Let me just add this. The wires are the same color. There is 12 volts coming from the blue and brown wires. When you put a test light on the brown wire the relay clicks.

And if you it the hatch button on the dash, the brake light flashes, if you hold down the hatch button the brake light stays on.

Does that help?

Thanks again for the help!


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BLACK 1989 FIREBIRD FORMULA 350
K&N, ACCEL CAP & ROTOR

 

Jason,

Let's first confirm that your motor is working.

Don't worry if all four wires on the socket that connect to the motor are the same color. Just test your motors (you purchased a second, remember?) as described on your last thread to see if it works.

On my 91 Camaro, there is a brown wire that connects to the ground side of the relay that is grounded by turning "on" the hatch switch. If you connect a light, with one wire going to ground, and the wire connected to the other side of the bulb connected to this brown wire, it will turn "on" this relay. For me, this activates the hatch relay solenoid.

Once the solenoid releases the hatch, a switch in the latch assembly will trigger the "extend" relay to raise the assembly "up".

If your brake lights come "on" when you turn on the hatch switch, you have a wiring problem. The brake lights are independent from the hatch circuitry, and somehow, +12 is getting to the brake lights. That could very well be the reason the hatch doesn't work. Sort of like having your windshield wipers come on when you turn on your turn signal .

 

When i said brake light i meant the little e-brake indicator on the dash. Sorry about that.

I know that if the engine is running, the hatch button will only work when the e-brake is engaged.

your right the motors need checked.

Since both of my motors are in the DOWN position and the blue wire is hot, shouldn't the motor energize if it was good?

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BLACK 1989 FIREBIRD FORMULA 350
K&N, ACCEL CAP & ROTOR

 

Jason,

According to my schematic, with the motor DOWN, the blue wire (terminal B) should be ground and the dark blue wire (terminal A) should be positive.

It's important that you don't reverse the positive/negative wires, and that you connect them correctly, the motor would try to go past its limit, and you'd either burn the motor out and/or break the limit stops --- don't know as I've never opened one up.

If in doubt, just connect them for a short moment and see if the motor operates freely. If you see it trying to work, but it's not moving, it may be trying to go beyond its limit.

Don't worry about the dash emergency brake light. You are correct that the emergency brake must be engaged for the switch to work for a manual transmission (automatic is via the starting system).

When you triggered the relay by applying the ground-to-bulb-to-hatch switch (brown wire), you not only activated the hatch relay, but you also illimunated the emergency brake light, which is connected to the same wire.

Another check is to be sure that the hatch pull-down unit is properly (clean and tight) grounded, and that all conectors are firmly seated.

I had a problem on mine that the hatch motor would not work consistently. Sometimes it'd close (or open), sometimes it wouldn't. Problem was a wire (or wires) not making good contact to the pins on the motor. I removed each wire from the connector and expanded the socket attached to the wire so it would make a tighter contact. To remove the wire from the connector, you have to insert something like a pin (or a very very very small screwdriver - like a micro screwdriver) and bend the lock-in tab in. The wire will then easily slip out. Bend that tab out a little so it'll lock the wire socket in the main socket when you reassemble it.

Have you tested the motors?

If not, try the above mentioned checks.

With everything connected, and the latch in the up position, moving the switch in the latch with your finger should cause the latch to move down. If not, hold the switch closed while wiggling the connector on the motor, and see if it'll move.

If the latch is in the down position, the motor should work as soon as all the connectors and fuse is in place, with that switch "out" (lid is not in the latch) until it reaches the upper limit. If nothing happens, just wiggle the connector on the motor until the motor works. Try the other connectors (relay, etc.) too and advise.

[This message has been edited by Stuart Moss (edited August 01, 2000).]

 

where can I get a schematic at? I tried the GM dealers, they don't have anything beyond 6 yrs.

 

I got my factory service manual from HELM Publications Division, 14310 Hamilton Ave., Highland Park, MI 48203. Phone (I think) is 313-865-3418, ext 6230 (that was the number for returns on my invoice). Don't know if they're on the web. Do a search.

Contains entire vehicle, with detailed trouble shooting guides. No comparison to the others (my electrical section is probably well over 100 pages alone, and that is just for 91 Camaro's. Compare that to the others that have 8 pages or so for several years, and not much detail.)

Cost was about $100 two years ago. Absolutely worth the money.

Mine probably wouldn't do you any good since mine is Chevrolet.