Hey guys,

Whats the part number for the crank pulley for two engines. One is a '79 Camaro Z28 350 (dunno if AC or not), and the other is an '83 Camaro L69 with AC?

I'd like to know, because I think I have the wrong one, and thats why its throwing alternator belts off every 10 minutes or less.

Also... is there any difference in the thickness (front to back) between a 350 balancer and a 305 balancer?

 

Anyone?

 

i thought most v-belts were the same width. maybe your belt is to long. do a search and read about the jack @** behind the parts counter that swore he was giving me the right belt. i finally went behind the counter and picked it out myself.

 

Tell ya what...head to the local discount AP store, pull a belt from each, compare the width and V...my guess is you have an alignment problem, not a pulley issue.
V belt setups always have issues with the lame-*** bracket on the alternator...doesn't take much to bend it out of whack.

 

The belt itself isn't the problem. Its the crank pulley. It sticks out 1/4" too far. You can even see it in the belt. Its a straight line from the alternator to the water pump pulley, but from the alternator down to the crank pulley, you can see the belt being pulled out toward the front of the car at a pretty big angle.

Are the 350 and 305 crank pullies different? Thats about all I can think of now, I have tried everything else. Right now I have the 305 pulley bolted to the 350 (with 350 balancer) because of a little mishap during the engine install that ruined the 350's original pulley.

The back and middle pulley slots are fine on that 305 pulley because the PS belt is dead straight and has never been a problem, but the pulley right at the front looks like its spaced about 1/8" farther away from the middle slot than the back pulley is.

 

exactly how do you have your belt set up??? i have the old vbelt and i can compare???

im not sure why it would do that.

 

None what so ever.

 

I don't know why either. It is a '79 350 (with its original damper) but its got the 305s water pump, brackets, alternator and crank pulley. The power steering pump belt is on the groove farthest back on the crank pulley, and it is dead straight and I have never had a problem with it.

The alt (obviously) only has 1 pulley groove on it, same with the water pump. Between the alt and the water pump pulley (the big w.p. pulley, not the smaller front one) the belt is perfectly straight. It is only down from the alt to the crank pulley (look from the passenger side) that the geometry is all wrong. I have tried the belt on both the middle and the front pulley grooves on the crank pulley. The middle pulley pulls the belt too far back and makes the belt flip over if the engine is even cranked over. If I put it on the front groove, it will throw it off at any engine speed above idle, no matter how tight the belt is.

 

Ok, a little update:

I called a GM dealer today and there are two different pullies. The one I have (305) is 14023145 and its for a '83 Camaro 305 with AC. The one that came with the new engine (350) has pulley 14023148 for a '79 Camaro with a 350 and AC.

I went looking for the #148 pulley at the wrecker today to compare, but didn't find any. I looked in anything that had a SBC in it. I did, however, find an alt. bracket like mine that seemed to be in better shape. Didn't help. Still outta alignment like it was before.

Do I need to find this pulley? Cuz all the other pullies on the engine now (WP, PS, alt, crank) are from the 305, so they should line up, right?

And how is it that nothing happened at all in the last year since the engine was installed, yet now it throws it off every 10 minutes?!

 

If it worked for a whole year without a problem, then something shifted recientlyor you wore the pulley out on that edge.

I just thought of something. Did you replace your alt in the past few months/weeks? I know mine has a spacer behind the pulley and if you forget to put it in, you'll know about it.

 

you couldnt find a 2nd gen at the bone yard??? kinda odd, there is a lot of them around here. they should have the pulley you are looking for.

 

The location of the alt pulley, and therefore the crank pulley, didn't change on the V-belt engines from 69 until they discontinued V-belts. They're all the same. The only differences in the pulleys over the years and engine sizes is the number of inner grooves (2 or 3), and the diameter of the various sheaves.

Are you sure your balancer is installed all the way? Did this by any chance start after it was removed? Or, has this particular motor always done this, in which case it's just never been completely assembled? Have you tried popping the crank damper bolt out, greasing the threads, and putting it back in, just to see if you can get the balancer to go on some more?

 

Yep, I checked the balancer. Its on nice and snug. And this is the same alt I have used since last December, and havent had a problem untill a few weeks ago. The pulley, as far as I can tell, is fine. Its not worn at all.

I don't think the balancer has ever been removed from the engine. At least, not as long as I have owned it. The engine is fully assembled an has been running pretty well for almost a year now. It was installed and first fired last December, and (as far as any of the belts go) I have never had a problem untill a few weeks ago.

And, if the banalcer was too far out, wouldn't I also have a problem with the PS belt? I don't, but if the balancer was out, I would have a problem with it too, no?

 

Not necessarily, if it's in the wrong groove.

Try it. I know I'm an idiot and don't know anything about these cars or the 78 Z28 350 and 79 Z28 350 I used to own, but humor a moron anyway, and give it a try.

 

Wrong groove? You mean on the pulley (belt) or balancer and crank? I thought there was only 1 groove in the balancer for the crank?

 

Sure I could, there are lots. Problem is, the wrecker I go to pulls out running engines and keeps them in a separate shed, So I can't tell what came engine from what car.

 

Doesn't matter which sheet metal was wrinkled around those pulleys when they were put into cars. They're all the same, as far as where the grooves are. Think about it: they have to be. The alt didn't move from 69 up until they introduced the single serpentine belt; and the crank damper is the same from 55 to the present. That means the depth of the pulley is the same. Has to be.

Tighten your crank bolt. Make sure the damper is fully installed.

 

Ok, I'll give it a shot tonight. What is the torque spec for the damper bolt?

 

Anyone?

 

Right around 65 ft/lbs...7/16th bolt, right? Lemme check my Helms...




Helms says 70ft/lbs

 

Ok... I got another question now.

The balancer, after I checked it out under the car, looks like its really close to the timing chain cover. Its about 5-8mm away from it. Is this were it should be? I haven't touched it yet btw.

The odd thing about this is that the ps belt perfectly aligns with the crank pulley groove and the alt belt lines up perfectly from the water pump down to the crank pulley. ONLY from the alt down to the crank is it 'off'.

I have tried a different alt bracket too, because I thought maybe mine was bent or something. Didn't help at all.

 

The balancer will only go on so far, then it bottoms out. Are you absolutly sure you have your alternator bracket mounted correctly? See if there is maybe another way that it might mount that will align the pulleys.

 

Tried that too... there are only two holes for the bolts. One in the intake manifold, one in the water pump. As it is, it aligns perfectly with the water pump pulley, so I doubt its that.

Today I took off the crank pulley and 'tapped' the balancer back, to see if it would move any. I did it with a long 2x4 and tapped that with a hammer. I got under the car and it looks like it moved back about 1mm or maybe 2mm.

Could this maybe have been enough to cause my problems? After that, I drove the car around a bit, at all engine speeds, from idle, cruise, and then gave her hell a few times. I was driving it for about 10 minutes after the engine warmed up enough, so it was also idling and warming up for about 10 minutes.

When I got back, I checked it all out, and the belt hasn't moved, there were no funny noises from anything and the belt doesn't look excessively worn, like the other 4 belts I went through did after some running time.

What do you guys think; problem solved? Or is there anything else I should check out, just incase?

 

Since it moved, you may want to get a balancer install tool (most places will loan you one with a deposite) and make sure it is on all the way and torque the bolt to proper spec (60-70 ft/lbs if memory serves)

 

You can make your own balancer installer too; just buy threaded rod with the same threads as the center balancer bolt, and spin the threaded rod into the crank snout. Then run a big washer onto the threaded rod, and finally, spin a nut on over everything. As you tighten the nut you'll draw the balancer onto the crank. Although; it might be hard to get a torque spec that way, unless you cut the threaded rod so you can slip a deep socket over the whole thing.

Could a pulley have gotten dented somehow? I got a p/s pump from one of those "we hand you the part off our shelf" junkyards, got home, spun the pulley, and it was dented in just a bit. I didn't want to take any chance, so I brought it back. Of course it was his last one- I wonder why?

There was a guy on here a while ago (sorry can't remember the name to give credit), but he used a $10 laser pointer to figure out his alignment problem. He aimed the laser pointer from the edge of the alternator pulley so it showed two points of light on the edge of the pulley. And then he looked down at the crankshaft. Where the light should've been on the crank, it wasn't.

I don't remember what he did to fix it though.

Yep, that -was- a long time ago; it didn't come up in the forum searches that I tried.

 

Thats briliant... i'll have to try that. I dont think any of the pulleys are dented, I checked them all. I like your idea about the balancer installer too.. mainly because I was thinking of the EXACT same thing, lol

 

Ok... I have checked everything and shimmed everything in every possible combination... nothing is working!!!

And the balancer didn't move. Its on tight, I checked it with an installer.

I am totally lost and getting really pi**ed at this thing now. I have replaced the upper bracket and about 5 belts now, and nothing I try is working!