Ok so i have a 86 trans am with a 305 tpi automatic. I raced a 94ish civic 5 speed on the highway starting at a 40mph roll and got my *** kicked. I plan on puting in a 383 when i get the money an people and him still think hez gunna win. He has some retarded dohc v tech with gsr heads or somthing idk i hate jap crap but what does any one else think?

 

With a 383 you can run 12s and still be daily driveable.I don't know what this guy has done to his civic but my guess is 13s is all he will run at the max if it is a daily driven naturally aspirated GSR motor.A guy I knew had a 2000 si with a turbo,headwork,headers and cam and ran 13.2. A guy I used to work with had a 90s civic hatchback with the prelude motor (B-18 I think it is called) and he ran low 14s.I haven't seen many civics or imports for that matter that ran faster then 13s without turbo.Not that they don't exist but there are not that many.Almost all the fast imports that could outrun a 12s 383 camaro need nitrous or some type of forced induction. Plus your car is only a mid 15s-low 16s second car stock.He is probably running the GSR motor or a modded B-18.I would guess unless he has some type of juice or forced induction that he won't run faster then high 13s but thats just a guess.

 

dont underestimate imports.. there is a showcar 4-door integra that runs at the track where i live.. and hes running 11.50's.. its a damn fast car.. i would get spanked with my 385.. but not if i put a turbo!!

 

Some of these cars are fast, just like our third gens, some slow, some wicked fast, build your 383 forged, if he still gets you, come back for round 3 sprayin a 200 hp shot and murder him, supposing the rest of your drive line can handle it.

 

if you decide on nitrous, perhaps later down the road, just dont forget to open up the ring gaps when you build the motor.. with a 200 shot, no one on the street will touch you..

 

ya i kno some of those jap junk cars are pretty fast. The only reason is because there so frigg'n light. Ya iv'e thought about turbo and spray but im in hight school so i build my car up slowley after the motor i was gunna do the tranny with stall converter and shift kit then the rear end

 

This will probably be the best advice you ever recieve, before you build that motor, buy a good nitrous kit and put it on the 305. Big goals and ideas will end up biting your *** in the end, and absolutly nothing is going to add power to your car like spray. You can get away with a 100 shot every day on that 305 and if something goes wrong you're out a stock 305 not a built 383. You should do all of the free mods, nitrous, and sticky tires. This will probably get you around that Civic. Also don't forget to tune your car up before you strap the spray on. Good NGK plugs 1 heat range colder than stock, .035 gap, good wires, and proper 6 degrees initial ignition timing, now throw some 91 octane in the tank and you're ready to win some races. After this you can start building that 383 and transer your nitrous onto it. Good luck on the races and the build.

 

does any one think it will b cheaper to just build up a sick 350 and put spray in it

 

so it was a naturally aspirated B18 im assuming....i raced a turbo B18 in my 97 SHO and it wasnt a race really...my taurus ate him alive

get a decent tune up and make sure everything is going ok with your car....unless he has a significant amount of work in that motor or he has a great deal of weight reduction it should have been much closer

 

if you really want good reliable power, build a supercharged 355.. 12-15psi boost.. forged everything, roller blower cam, dish pistons, AFR heads, super victor, 750 DP, and in the 10's you will be.. turbo 350 and build rear also..

 

How can it be cheaper for you to build a "sick 350" then put spray "in" it than it would be to simply strap a nitrous kit onto your 305 and spray it. The prices will be exactly the same only you'll have a fast car now that will get faster when you build your motor.

 

Let me rephrase what I meant to say earlier: Put the nitrous kit on your car first and foremost, it will give you the most gain for the least money. Also if you have a beginners mistake with it it will be on your 305 not on an engine you just built. After this start building a 350 for the car, your nitrous kit will swap over with all the other parts of the 305 you reuse.

 

wouldnt spray in my 21 year old probally getting tired 305 with out upgraded pistons or any thin blow up in my face "obviously not rly blow up but u get what im say'n" i just gave it a tune up plugs, wires, distibuter,and coil i mean i put it to the floor and it didnt take long to get to 100mph but this kid was was frigg'n still pull'n hard pretty far away from me. what i ment by cheaper on the 350 was all the parts i would put in the 350 insted of mak'n it a 383 also
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I'm not to worried about mak'n a beginners mistake on the 383 with spray im friends with the this guy down the street who has his own shop an a 69 camaro 396 with spray an h'ell help me with it

 

You didnt say if it was a hatch or coupe,nor do you know if he was spraying and some hondas might only run 13''s with a motor swap but if they hooked they would be faster,hondas can sometimes beat a car on the highway that they cant beat at the track,a gsr motor is a b18 but there is different types of b18''s a civic hatch with a b18 lower end and a b16 head with a few mods can be a real sleeper to the unsuspecting v-8 guy and god forbid they have a k20 motor with just the mods it takes to put them in a civic they make over 200 whp in a sub 2500 pound car 12''s all day with a good driver and traction i am a v-8 guy but i love and respect any car thats fast

 

I have a few friends that drive early 90 hatch civics. One with a built H22, another with a turbo'd B16. These cars fly! I don't under estimate these cars, it's just hard to respect them when they sound and look the way they do.

 

EXACTLY!!!! if it sounded like it had BALLZ then it would be better.. and the whole body kit/huge wing/big rims/sometimes *** colored car, its hard to look at it and say, "Nice".. instead you just say a short, "wow"..

keep it plain, clean and smooth..

 

As long as your old 305 isn't burning oil while running you'll be fine. Even if it is burning a little you'll be fine. The older engines will actually take spray a little better than a newer one because they're loose enough to compensate for a little piston expansion. My 350 smoked on startup and had 140,000 miles when I put it in and I've sprayed it every time I took it out with a 200 shot for the last 3 years. You should be fine with a modest shot on your 305.

 

he drives a 4 door an he just switched his engine again to an ls somthing maybe? now it has 195 hp he wasnt runn'n spray even tho he'z a lil pecker he doesnt lie he like to win because his car is faster just the way he is i looked under the hood an didnt see anythin

 

well, theres a big part of your problem. you have a auto TPI car and ran from a roll. a highway race is NOT a TPI cars strong point... for the Honda, however, it is. not that you wouldve won if the race had been from a stop, but you wouldnt have lost by as much. from now on, only race your car from a stop until you do heads/cam/intake work

FWIW, i agree 100% with the people who are suggesting nitrous. there is NOTHING that can match the bang for the buck power gains that a bottle in your trunk will bring you. as long as you keep it at a 100 shot or smaller, youll have no issues with your motor. i run a 75 shot on my 107k mile 84' Z28 all the time with absolutely no breakage

 

...lol


On another note, does anyone know what a k24(a?) is, some kid at my school has one and like ws6gta said, I can respect a fast car, adn he brags abotu it alot, he showed me around it alittle bit, i saw a turbocharger on it (I'm nto sure if that is stock) it was also a 6sspd with a rsx tranny, and gauge cluster, HID?, s2000 seats, si front end, and other misc stuff. I've heard of the b16, b18, h22, and a couple others, but never this one. I was kind of puzzled but didn't really care to ask him, I guess he kind of just assumed I knew what it was

 

Man, come to think of it, id like to test the new 383, where you live??? Id like to visit your buddy and tell him its just "another" 305 with a tiny cam... anyway, a n2o kit is really cheap, and a great bang for the buck, if your serious buy one, it'll be tail lights fade...

 

Thats the CRV engine, it's big and modern so it's no pushover. With a turbocharger on it it'll haul. You need to get some drag radials and nitrous to keep up with these kids. Do any of them run spray that you know of?

 

There are 5 different types of k24''s that range from 160hp-205hp one is not offered in the U.S.,if he has the cr-v motor he has the 160hp motor if he has the tsx motor he has 205hp motor the k24 motor requires a cold air intake headers and exhaust to fit in any car besides the one it came in and just those mods alone on that motor bump it up to about 230-240hp and thats without the turbo,i think with the mods required and the turbo that thing should make atleast 220 hp with the cr-v motor and close to 300hp with the tsx motor that would make for one fast a$$ civic

 

imports should just swap in a V8.. it would help with the lack on power in some, and traction because of the weight.. hahaha i'm pretty much just making a joke of this thread already.. i'm done now..

 

What about a crx with a grand national motor,six speed and rwd that would be sick

 

no nobody is runn'n spray every one is all motor or forced induction

 

Cool, lock it down on the nitrous front and don't tell anyone it's in there. Get yourself a set of drag radials while you're at it and start running from a dig. Holeshots are for a man, racing from a roll is for sissies. You'll have a big advantage racing these guys from a dig if you equip your car with the proper tires and a 100hp shot should give you enough HP and torque to really get moving.

 

im gonna second tpivette89 on the race advice. DONT exspect to blow by someone on a stock 305 at 40-45MPH roll. By the time you reach 50MPH the power curve drops. The highlight of most of your races in a stock 305 will be from a stop in 1st-2nd gear.

 

what about a crx with a blown big block??? prostreet style..

 

how much horse do u think I'll b running with heads,cam, and intake work

 

Maybe 50hp up on what you have now depending on how far out you go, possibly more since you're an 86 and have the peanut cam. I'de do the spray and tires first, then if it wheel hops get lower control arms and a pan hard bar, then worry about the heads, cam, and intake porting. If you just port the heads, base, plenum it'll help quite a bit but that's alot of down time and money. The cam really does need to go, keep it mild and keep in mind it's a 305 so the cam will act more radical and have a higher power band than what its rated for in a 350.

 

Your DOHC B series motors have serious aftermarket support. GSRs were probly the best of the bunch and most saught after. Their heads made higher compression, better exhaust flow and they aslo had a "dual stage" intake manifold.

It's fairly easy to make a b18 swapped civic run much faster than the almighty 305tpi.

 

Well I was talking to my buddy alittle more at school today, and he told me it is an RSX motor, I know every1 is saying TSX but I'm 100% sure he said RSX. and he does have alot of mods on it, he said he had it at the drag strip in english town and he ran a 13.8. He also told me he was pushing 22lbs of boost(...crazy), and he told me that, that is nothing cuz his buddy is running a hatch with 50+pounds . He told me that they go ot englishtown alot and they are all runnign turbo's. By "they" I mean the guys at the shop he hangs out at (performance shop in the bronx). His car is a blue 99 Si by the way.

 

My 350 TPI did 3 13.5's last time I was out, thats with minimal mods (stock heads and cam though my cam's better than your 86 cam) and a ton of milleage. Not to mention that was off spray. Don't be down hearted. The kid has a *quick* car not a fast one. You should be able to pull a high to mid 12 with sticky tires, spray, headers and exhaust; you should be in the low 13's with just tires and spray, high to mid 13's with just the spray.

 

either he wasn't racing, didn't have a turbo, something was wrong with his car, or your car has some work done to it

 

if his friend is running 50lbs he must be damn good at changing those pistons and rods out by now. that's all I have to say about that.

 

Reason #431 most third-gens get disrespected...

 

305's have good low-end torque, try racing him from a stop and if he starts pulling on you, swerve towards his lane and run that *******-r off the road.

 

IMO, real men take the loss, give respect, then learn from it, build, and whoop their *** later.. haha

 

real men also drive v8's haha

 

And spray huge shots of nitrous to there cars on a weekly basis... while running from a dig

 

so that's how you do it huh? can't win you play dirty. doesn't sound very sporting or man like there. if nothing else just the fact that you would disrespect others property/life and your own car just because of a loss doesn't sound too cool.

 

There's nothing good about 305s

Reason #432

 

what so bad about 305's? when ur a high school student with a part time job and barely have any money to spend and wants a muscle car a 305 looks pretty dam good. Obviosley if u want ur car to 12 like nothing u would get a better engine. They dont suck u just want a bigger engine thats all

 

Your telling me, I must have spent 7-8 minuites just arguing back and forth(friendly) about how he could not do that on a street car. I told him the same thing, "there is no way he can be pushing that ammount of boost on a car and not have any problems with it". But he kept insisting, it had all the supporting mods and he was doing and driving it at the track like that, and brings it down "alittle" on the streets. I find it had to believe also that he(my friend) is running 22 pounds on a daily street driven motor. Oh well though, I won't know until I'm actually in it and shows me his gauge so I can see for myself where he spikes. Anyway though we ended the conversation off by me given him-a "keep on rice'n" closer (all of this was friendly of course), my ignorance got the best of me I guess alittle bit....lol

 

Wow, almost 5,000 posts on here and u cant take a joke, that sucks dude

 

what can I say it was a very dumb joke

plus with all the other little kids that come around here and say stuff like this and actually seem to mean it this tends to happen.

 

305 TPI, shoestring budget, 12 second time slips; no problem. You just have to do it right. Don't waste any money on insignificant stuff, get a goal set and go for it. You also don't have alot of options and it's pretty much going to be power adder to stay economical. Your list of options in order from least costly to most are, Nitrous, home fabbed turbo, used supercharger. For what it's worth I'de rather have a new nitrous kit than the other 2 options simply because of the involvement with the other 2 setups and the price. The only other thing I believe is necassary with a good nitrous setup is a good strong fuel pump, but with the age of these cars it's about time for those anyways. Get a Walboro 255, do it once, and do it right. Don't try to reuse that peice of line in the tank or that little block; get a good length of J30R10 fuel line and 2 hose clamps (experience talking here).

 

I have seen cars run close to 20-25lbs on the street before BUT the cars that do so usually have strong motors to start with like the supra, rx7 and such or are very heavily modified to the point that there is almost nothing stock about the motor other then the block.

 

423 Flywheel Horsepower @ 6,500 RPM. I have not had the engine in a car yet with this combo, but I bet it would do low 12s in a 3rd gen with traction.

Block = 1983 4-Bolt main 305 (14010203 casting), Bored .040" over, Torque plate honed, Decked .025", ARP Main Studs, Align Bored

Crank = Stock GM Forged Steel (3941188), Lightened, Smoothed, Knive Edged, etc for less windage, balanced with the entire rotating assembly

Bearings = Federal Mogul Speed Pro Coated

Rods = X casting rods, Parting lines ground down, Lightened, Balanced, Shot Peened, Weights Matched, ARP Wave Loc 3/8 Rod Bolts, Reconditioned

Pistons = Stock L69 Hypereutetic Replacements, Flattops with 4 valve reliefs, -6 cc, 0.00" in the hole

Rings - Total Seal Gapless rings

Compression = 10.7:1 with 54cc heads, Zero Decked block, .038" compressed head gasket.

Heads - Ported 2004 ZZ4 castings ("463"s), cleaned up in my garage, final "MAX EFFORT" port work performed by my buddy in his machine shop, .100" longer valves than stock (1.94/1.55 Under Cut Stems, Swirl polished), 5 angle valve job, Forget the exact spring but they are meant for the cam and .100" longer than stock valves, .600 lift compatible. I had to use longer than stock push rods as well. Machined heads for Comp Cams guide plates after opening up pushrod holes in heads. Gasket matched to a Felpro 1206 (1.34" x 2.21")

Head flow @ 28 in/h20 with a 3.75" bore simulator (engine has 3.776" bore).
Lift------Intake---Exhaust
.100------57-------57
.200------123------118
.300------177------162
.400------223------183
.500------229------188
.600------238------193

Camshaft = Comp retrofit roller XFI280-H13 (280/288 @ .006, 230/233 @ .050, .576/.570" lift with 1.6:1 rocker, 113 LSA, 106 ICL) Cloyes Double roller timing set

Intake Manifold = Holley Projection TBI for "OLD" style heads with the same bolt angle. This intake is a dual plane, high rise, with 2" bores. Gasket matched to the Felpro 1206 intake gasket

TBI = TBI unit off of a Heavy Duty 7.0 liter TBI truck, 68# injectors at 32 PSI, 2" bores, thinned throttle shafts, radiused the entrance to the bores, sitting on a 1" tall open center TBI spacer, 720 CFM @ 3.00 in/hg

Headers/Exhaust = Hooker Super Comp 1 3/4" x 3.5" meant for a mid 70s Camaro with a 350. 3" duals with X-pipe (not used on dyno)

Ignition = Stock GM HEI EST small cap distributer (computer controlled) with MSD coil, MSD Module, Moroso Ultra 40 wires, AC Delco Rapidfires @ .045"

Oil System = Moroso Blue Printed Oil Pump w/ Pickup, Moroso Steel Shaft, Moroso 5 quart pan, Moroso Oil Control Kit, Mobil 1 5w20, 70 PSI Z/28 spring

Crankcase Evac = LT1 style Electric AIR pump pulling a crankcase vacuum of about 6 in/hg.

ECM = RBob's EBL with lots of tuning. 34* total advance @ 2,800 rpm.

Dyno Numbers (all rounded to the nearest whole number for simplicity)

RPM------HP----TQ
2,400----147----323
2,600----166----336
2,800----185----347
3,000----207----362
3,200----223----365
3,400----238----368
3,600----263----384
3,800----281----388
4,000----301----395
4,200----322----403
4,400----347----414
4,600----363----414
4,800----378----413
5,000----382----401
5,200----393----397
5,400----401----390
5,600----410----385
5,800----417----378
6,000----421----369
6,200----422----357
6,400----423----347
6,600----419----333

That is 423 FWHP @ 6,500 and 415 ft/lbs @ 4,500.