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91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Old 03-19-2017, 08:07 PM   #1
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91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Not really sure why I'm posting this but for what its worth, a friend of mine has a Fiesta ST (euro 3 door but I believe for performance intents and purposes identical to the NA car)

Had a race from a roll. 40mph to about a 100. Done 3 runs

I ran from third and changed up around 4.5k rpm, finishing in 4th. I ended up being slightly ahead, maybe a car and a half. Very close.

On one run I kept it in forth and the ST pulled away.

My car is a stock R6P (G92 equiv for firebird) car but for headers and an exhaust, about 115k miles on the clock.

Given the Fiesta ST's stats that's probably about right. And factoring the TPI's are stronger off the line than from a roll, I suspect a quarter mile thrash would have the firebird more ahead?

Still, can't believe we're about level with a hot-hatch. The shame!

Any similar experiences, would love to hear
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Old 03-19-2017, 11:48 PM   #2
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Cars have come a long way in the last 10 years. We are living in the greatest golden age of power and speed.
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Old 03-21-2017, 12:43 AM   #3
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Its scary to think a kid in a fiesta st would pull up to a pony car and legit have a chance at beating you in stock form.But thats where we are at this day and age.And i saldy dont want to admit this..but since i do work at a ford dealer and have driven plenty of fiesta st..focus st/rs etc..the fiesta st probably would beat the firebird from a dig with the right driver.They are crazy light hatchback cars. But if it was a roadcourse..that fiesta st would eat the bird lap after lap

Time to ad some grunt to the bird to scare those pesky hot hatches away.
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Old 03-21-2017, 03:43 AM   #4
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Yea, I have a stock Fiesta ST as my daily commuter. It'll beat pretty much any stock thirdgen from stop to top in straight line, and no thirdgen will touch it in the esses, especially with the Michelin PSS on it. Driving it really is a true pleasure.

Of course, if you take into consideration "cool-factor"... well it lacks that entirely.
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Old 03-21-2017, 03:51 AM   #5
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Here she is with her friends at Spring Mountain Motorsports Ranch:

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Old 03-22-2017, 02:18 AM   #6
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Originally Posted by GTA1990
Still, can't believe we're about level with a hot-hatch. The shame!
What's not to believe? The Fiesta ST makes roughly the same power as your stock LB9, and the car itself weighs almost one thousand pounds less than your Firebird. The Fiesta ST engine also redlines 1500 to 2000-RPM higher than your engine. In my opinion your friend does not know how to drive because he should have beaten you...
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:29 PM   #7
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Thanks. I've owned two Fiesta ST's and have been on the track with them; I know what they're capable of in stock form.

This was more a just a sobering 'how the once mighty have fallen' thought.
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Old 03-22-2017, 06:49 PM   #8
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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What's not to believe?
You miss the point of this thread entirely.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:13 PM   #9
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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You miss the point of this thread entirely.
Oh really, how so? Did I miss the point.... or, is it that you, and maybe a few others, can relate to his point? Don't lump everyone together who actually drove these cars along with the bench racers. Not everyone who drove/drives these cars considers a RWD V8 to automatically be on another level to a 2000+ vehicle simply because it is a V8 and because it sounds fast. That is hillbilly thinking. These 3rd gen cars were 14/15 second cars when new, who thought that was fast? I know of a friends essentially stock block '89 TTA that will annihilate a Hellcat, does that still make this thread relevant because it is a 3rd gen? Of course it doesn't. No, I did not miss the point. Drag racing and performance has not changed; power, weight and gearing, even 70's drag racers were scratching their heads when LB9 3rd gens came out because they flowed horribly, and those cars preceded them by a decade. There is a reason why this website is filled with engine swaps, it's nothing new, so only a newbie who bases performance by the sound of a muffler would be surprised of the outcome of a stock LB9 vs a Fiesta ST, and only a newbie who didn't suffer the fate of repeated Fox body beat downs back during the 80's on the street would see the stock LB9 as something that it isn't. The LB9 was never anything, so I don't see how it was ever on another level. Maybe to that of an AMC Gremlin once upon a time it was, but even then my money is on the Gremlin.
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Old 03-22-2017, 10:26 PM   #10
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Did I miss the point....
Yes, more than once.
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Old 08-20-2017, 09:19 PM   #11
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

I've never drove a fiesta st but my old boss had a focus st. From driving that car in stock form and modified form, with included eibach pro springs, I have a hard time believing these cars handle better than the performance versions of our third gens. Yes it would out run all third gens but the gnx powered pace car but in 1984 the z28 was deemed the best handling car in America with a skid pad rating of (don't quote me exactly) .86g (I know it was in the .8x rating) with them old junk *** good years. Bring that car into today with a set of 17in rims and low pro tires such as the BFG kdw 2 and that number would most definitely rise into the strong .9xg range. My 84 z28 handled amazing and so did my 87 iroc and 88 gta ws6. And the 84 seemed to be the best at speeds above 120 mph tho. I'm not disagreeing with the fact that the st is faster but in my opinion there's no way it could out do a third gen in the cones. And for reference the focus st runs 14.4 in 1/4, g92 cars and B2L equipped cars ran 14.5-14.7. so not a *** dragging by any means. Motor week I believe it was claimed to have gotten a 84 trans am 3:73 t5 L69 car into the mid 14s back in the day as well. Just food for thought.
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Old 08-20-2017, 09:32 PM   #12
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Keep dreaming, pal. My stock FiST on Michelin PSS crushes my '90 TA on C6 18"F & 19"R Michelin PSS in the corners. Of course, it won't touch it in the 1/4, but driving in a straight line is for *****, anyway.
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Old 08-21-2017, 09:55 PM   #13
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Keep dreaming, pal. My stock FiST on Michelin PSS crushes my '90 TA on C6 18"F & 19"R Michelin PSS in the corners. Of course, it won't touch it in the 1/4, but driving in a straight line is for *****, anyway.
I think your the one that needs to keep dreaming, according to multiple sources the FiST pulls .90-.94 g on a skid pad. The 84 z28 with it's tall skinny junk tires from 84 did .86 or something like that. A year later in 85 on a 16in junk tire combo the new iroc-z pulled .94g. Bring tire tech to today speed and that 85 iroc could probably pull 1 g on the skid pad and just imagine what a 1LE car would do in today's world!! Plus the whole fact that your wrong wheel drive platform will plow and under steer when it is at it's limit or close to it. Our third gens will over steer, not only the handling difference between the cars but the wheel drive is what would really set them apart on the track. Put the st against a 91-92 LB9 t5 3:42/3:45 dual cat 1LE 230hp car on any track and it would get dominated allllllll day long.
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Old 08-21-2017, 11:20 PM   #14
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Cars have come a long way in the last 10 years. We are living in the greatest golden age of power and speed.


This is the truest thing I've read in a while. It is a great time for cars and to be a car enthusiast.
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Old 08-22-2017, 12:13 AM   #15
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Put the st against a 91-92 LB9 t5 3:42/3:45 dual cat 1LE 230hp car on any track and it would get dominated allllllll day long.
Ok, I fell for it. You got me. I thought you were being serious and didn't realize you were just trolling. Good one!
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Old 08-22-2017, 09:59 PM   #16
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Ok, I fell for it. You got me. I thought you were being serious and didn't realize you were just trolling. Good one!
Your a special kinda person that's for sure lol I guess at least your happy with your st. Forgot this was a third gen fourm.
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Old 08-23-2017, 03:42 PM   #17
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

I had a 90 GTA which had the full thirdgen. org choice refresh incl. bearing top mounts, tubular arms, konis etc and on an airfield track day my brother's E46 330ci had me in the corners. His car was stock right down to the tyres. I don't profess to be a great driver but neither is he.

Sure on a flat sweeper corner thirdgens, with a few usual suspension mods, can hang on with newer sports cars but tighter chicanes with lots of weight transfer going on, I'm not so sure.

They pulled some impressive numbers in their day, but, as mentioned above, today is a golden era for performance...
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Old 08-23-2017, 07:23 PM   #18
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Sure on a flat sweeper corner thirdgens, with a few usual suspension mods, can hang on with newer sports cars but tighter chicanes with lots of weight transfer going on, I'm not so sure.

They pulled some impressive numbers in their day, but, as mentioned above, today is a golden era for performance...
That's precisely the key right there that people that don't have any track experience and base their fantastic theories on numbers from magazine articles can't comprehend.

My '90 Trans Am has a fair amount of suspension mods and excellent tires, as well, and is an absolute blast to drive. However, she's heavy and has a solid rear axle, and getting her to shift her weight around on the track without upsetting her is like wrestling a gorilla. My stock '15 FiSt and nearly stock '07 Solstice GXP, on the other hand, are almost effortless when tossing them around the corners. The skid pad numbers may look similar on paper, but once you get them out on the track, it's a massive difference.
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Old 08-23-2017, 07:38 PM   #19
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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That's precisely the key right there that people that don't have any track experience and base their fantastic theories on numbers from magazine articles can't comprehend.

My '90 Trans Am has a fair amount of suspension mods and excellent tires, as well, and is an absolute blast to drive. However, she's heavy and has a solid rear axle, and getting her to shift her weight around on the track without upsetting her is like wrestling a gorilla. My stock '15 FiSt and nearly stock '07 Solstice GXP, on the other hand, are almost effortless when tossing them around the corners. The skid pad numbers may look similar on paper, but once you get them out on the track, it's a massive difference.
Ive owned five third gens of all different trim level and they all had different performance objectives in their builds. You can insult me how ever you want, that's fine, you don't know me or my track experience or possible lack of. I'm glad you hold your fwd platform sooo high in it's amazing performance abilities. I'm not saying these cars are the best handling cars out there or anything of that sort. But no equivalent capable fwd car is going to out handle a rwd car with similar or better cornering ability. Sorry you feel other wise. I've drove a focus st with a eibach pro kit and all my third gens except one would have worked it over.

I'm not surprised that bmw worked it over. I love driving BMWs most of them drive great. Just wish the ones I liked were faster lol
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Old 08-23-2017, 09:35 PM   #20
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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you don't know me or my track experience or possible lack of.
Based on your posts, it's an easy conclusion to draw that you don't have much or any, in the same sense that it's an easy conclusion to draw that a guy claiming that 2x4=11 doesn't have an engineering degree hanging on his wall.


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But no equivalent capable fwd car is going to out handle a rwd car with similar or better cornering ability.
On this point, we agree 100%. Where we disagree is that a stock, near-stock, or even moderately modified thirdgen is remotely close in cornering ability to a stock FiST.
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Old 08-24-2017, 07:26 PM   #21
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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Based on your posts, it's an easy conclusion to draw that you don't have much or any, in the same sense that it's an easy conclusion to draw that a guy claiming that 2x4=11 doesn't have an engineering degree hanging on his wall.




On this point, we agree 100%. Where we disagree is that a stock, near-stock, or even moderately modified thirdgen is remotely close in cornering ability to a stock FiST.
Do I go to mid Ohio and compete, no, I do have years and years of experience at the drag strip, irrelevant for this argument but I felt to add it for purpose of being honest. I do however have my fair share of pushing plenty of cars to there limits on windy country roads and from what I have experienced I feel very confident in how I feel. I've had hours and hours of seat time in my bosses focus st in the last year. I am impressed how well it does handle but feel personally that the third gens will out compete it and the fiesta.
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Old 08-24-2017, 09:04 PM   #22
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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a guy claiming that 2x4=11 doesn't have an engineering degree hanging on his wall.
It can with moderate values of 2 and 4.
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Old 08-25-2017, 12:13 AM   #23
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

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It can with moderate values of 2 and 4.
That is an irrational statement.
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Old 08-25-2017, 12:31 AM   #24
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

It's an old math joke. Lighten up
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Old 08-25-2017, 12:34 AM   #25
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Aww, man. I know. My response was a math joke, too.
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Old 08-25-2017, 12:38 AM   #26
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Apparently, it wasn't very punny.
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Old 08-25-2017, 12:40 AM   #27
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Re: 91 t5 305 firebird VS Fiesta ST

Okay, that was so slick I didn't even see it until you pointed it out. Good one!
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