I have been grenading Ford 9"'s left and right. 2 this week alone, what's the deal? This is always in the 1 - 2 shift (auto trans).

Does anyone know a cheap alternative? I am not interested in shelling out for a Strange set-up or the like. I need cheap options as I am working on engine dynamics alone.

Thanks

 

what breaks?

 

Typically it is the ring gear, carrier and housing. The last one bent the axle tubes. I usually end up out in the middle of the road with a coffee can.

I thought these 9" Fords were supposed to be strong.

 

they are.


obviously, you have somthing setup wrong.


if i was to take a wild guess, id say your housing is warped or is becoming warped under load... causing a misalignment.

but thats just a wild guess from the minimal facts you posted.
what is obvious though, is that theres something wrong with your rear, and eating 9" centersections is the result. not the problem.

 

I have not been able to identify a problem with alignment nor structural integrity with any of the housings or carriers. I did find one ring gear that had a minor casting imperfection (trapped gas, only visible in the radiograph - don't think it was enough to cause the issue).

Clarification - if this was happening to just one housing, I would suspect it and look a lot closer at it, but I am at 6 housings now. It is quite irritating as I have to cut down a housing and modify it to fit in the car. This takes too much time.

I have gotten second opinions on these rears just to be sure I wasn't missing something, nobody has been able to identify the weak link yet.

Suspension is based on a 4 link setup, taylored a bit to suit my own needs. Problem occurs at 1-2 shift after a couple runs (this is on my back street, not a track). Shift rpm's between 7800 - 8200. Car launches hard and shifts hard. I had to change to a different suspension set-up due to the torque arm snapping the tailshafts off my transmissions - too costly and labor intensive.

Hope this gives more info.

 

Sounds like what happens with stock 9" stuff....

The stock parts are garbage. Very weak. The virtue of the 9" platform is that it's just exactly that, a platform; there's all sorts of aftermarket parts that fit the platform. Its virtue isn't that a junkyard one is strong.

People run these things all the time in professional race cars, on tracks and strips, with a helluvalot more power and traction than (and therefore stress on the rear) than you're doing. So either your parts choice is very poor, or something about the car isn't put together right.

 

As stated previously, I am more interested in engine dynamics, not racing. I have chosen what I felt was the least expensive, most easily obtained and strongest option available. Is there something else you might recommend?

Suspension geometry was my first suspect, but that all checks out fine. I do get excellent traction off the line, front wheels hang a couple inches off the ground.

 

here is a pic to give you an idea.

 

What have you been using? Stock center section and pinion bearing carrier? If so, that's the problem. There are any number of better ones out there; Strange, Moser, plus all sorts of REALLY $$$$ racing stuff; they all bolt directly to a stock 9" housing (or a better one built to the same interface dimensions), but are radically different from stock. You can get cast iron, cast aluminum, billet steel, even machined billet aluminum ones. Same for R&P gears, yokes, axles, small gear sets, complete carriers, etc. etc. etc. Kind of like, durability costs money; how durable do you want to spend? Are you running a Pro Mod 600" big block with both port nitrous and a fogger, making 1100 ft-lbs and 1400 HP? they're readily available for such as those, I'm sure you can find one that will handle your small block. I can't make any specific recommendations really, but I think you should be able to find something suitable without too much trouble.

 

I know I could buy high dollar stuff, but I really didn't want to...purpose doesn't justify cost. I suppose I shall have to concede though as I am getting sick of replacing it.

I was just wondering if there was something else out there that was stock and stronger than these cheapy 9"'s.

Thanks

 

Sometimes it sucks to shell out the bucks, but since you have replaced it 6 times, you probably could have had a nice one by now.

 

True, but when you break one of the "nice" ones, you end up waiting forever to get a replacement.

 

About the best you can do with the stock crap is to try to find a nodular iron center section..... they're said to be nearly as strong as GM 7½" 10-bolt.

They can be identified by having a large letter "N" cast into them. They're a bit hard to find though, as there never were very many of them, and the huge majority of cars that had them have long since beeen junked, and they're highly sought after; and when you do find one, it costs near as much as an entry-level good one would, because so much "stupid money" is chasing after them.

Get a good one. Then you won't be looking for replacements, so shelling them isn't a concern. For example, my brother-in-law has a door-slammer 76 Camaro he races, 454 solid roller Powerglide 4-link etc. trailered race car; he's had the same rear in it for about 9 years now IIRC. He bracket-races it with a throttle stop, 10.80s or something like that, the car will do 10.30s wide open; 1.44 60' times; weekend after weekend, year after year, zero failures.

 

2 of them were nodular, and yes, they are not easy to find anymore.

I suppose I will order a Strange set-up. Kind of irritating as I don't expect the car to live for much longer.

 

What times are you running and what are your 60fts?

 

If you read back a few messages, you will see where I said I have been running on my back street. I have yet to go to a track.
By the stopwath (not the most accurate way), I run 0-60 around 4.5 s and on a measured 1/4 around 10 s.

Dyno says rwh is peaked at 478.

Of course, car is gutted, I removed every unessesary item (like seats, carpet, dash, console, stereo, blower motor, fender wells, hood bracing, lights, etc...). It is quite amazing how all those stupid little creature comfort's weight adds up!
Car is under 3000 now.

When I am able to keep a rear under it, I will go to a track. I just don't feel like hauling it all the way there just to break.

 

The reason I asked is I am switching to 9" this winter and want to make sure I put the right parts in it. Running low 12's now with a bet 60ft or 1.69 on an uprepped track.

 

Dana 80

 

This is the new housing. Going to order some Strange components to finish it up.

 

That was quick.

 

BS !!! That housing will not work unless you back half the car. Prove me wrong and show pics of the frame rails.

 

Dell computer $599

Internet connection $23 month

Proving to the members of TGO you are an *******, Priceless.

 

 

Don't have a Dell computer, My internet is free and you, my friend, seem to not realize that if a picture exists...then it had to be built by someone.

 

You must have missed this statement:

"Suspension is based on a 4 link setup"

I picked this car up for $200. Seized V6. This is not a dayly driver, it isn't even street legal anymore. My dayly driver is an Audi.

You young kids seem to think going to a proper chassis set-up is too difficult. All it is is taking a plasma cutter, hacking out what you don't need, welding in the new and wrapping sheet metal around it. Why would I even think about screwing around with the stock, inadequate suspension? That to me is more work than it's worth. I said before, I am only interested in engine dynamics...not racing.

I will, however, take the camera home with me this week and take a picture for all of you who seem to think that 4 link setups can only exist on TV.

Now to really **** you all off, I am in the middle of 4 different development designs that total around 45 million in construction costs, so I shall not be responding to stupid statements from disillusioned people.

Maybe now you all understand why I am looking for something cheap, available and stronger to put in the car as I am not happy sitting up all night cutting down a rear just to break it the next day. If anyone still has suggestions, I am open, but I am not responsing to ignorance.

 

The point I was getting at, is that the dimensions of the stock sub frame was not designed for a 4 link setup. My bad on assuming that you were going to try to stuff it under a stock sub frame. Good luck to you. I would like to see the finished results.

 

I am not angry. I just asked the question because I was hoping that someone through experience knew of another cheap alternative. The Dana 80 has been mentioned and I am going to check it out. I hate spending time and cash on items that are not directly related to my goals.

The only reason I have been working on this car is because everyone on the engine tech and engine swap forums said it couldn't be done with a 327.

I do need to get a good camera sometime as I have never been good at documenting my work. I retain what info I need in my head. I will try to take some pics for everyone.

 

Not a big job to do when you have the right equipment and 20 years of experience.

 

What he meant was you were deciding weather or not to buy one on the 17th, and on the 18th its at your door.....

i dont know why no one has suggested a GM 12 bolt yet...all this work you putting into making these 9's fit...hell try a 12 bolt lol...may actually have better luck with GM stuff

 

Phone, Internet

 

Just because I posted the topic on the 17th does not mean I blew it that day.

I blew it over the weekend (that would be the 14th to 15th). It was actually on the 14th. I started a new rear that evening. Sunday is set aside for family, so I didn't actually finish it until Monday night (this would be the 16th).

I hope that makes sense to you all, or I could rewrite it with little picture illustrations if your having trouble following.

Now, since my profession keeps me extremely busy, I didn't actually get around to posting the topic until Tuesday, the 17th.

I do have a life and I do have responsibilities other than my vehicles.

Now since this board seems to be full of a bunch of idiots who believe nothing more than what gets printed in Hot Rod or Car Craft magazine, and I am not going to get an answer to a very clear question, I believe you all know exactly where you can go.

 

You want a clear answer to keep things from breaking all the time? Quit being a cheep *** using stock center sections and dish out some money for one that wont break on you as easy. (looks like you're going to do that now buying strange stuff) Put some extra bracing on the housing to keep the axle tubes from bending and doing weird things. If all you care about is "engine dynamics" and you don't take care of the rest of the car, stuff will just keep breaking. It's a package deal, can't just do one thing and expect others to last.

 

I think you'll be happy with the Strange parts. Your thread would go a bit smoother if you went into some detail about the car in the first post.

Sometimes proving people wrong (with your 327) can be fun. Good luck with it.

 

Strange products do not fit the issue. I need to be able to replace a part in a short period of time - hence the desire to use a stock item readily available at a scrap yard. I have ordered the Strange components that I need, but I am going to see what else I can do.

I truly wish that a question asked did not have to entail a barrage of BS crap from people. When I ask a question, I just want an answer.

 

Hard to prove anything over the internet...too many liars. Details on the car change almost dayly, so I choose to address specific items one at a time.

There is life after the 350, no matter what anyone says.

 

I totally understand where you're coming from. I use GM parts where possible; aftermarket where needed.

Stock for stock I would rather have a 12-bolt instead of a Ford 9" ... you're seeing why now.

 

Yup, when I brought up the possibility of getting a 327 and was wondering what to look for, people said it was a waste of time and why not build a 350 instead blah blah blah I got pissed off and said "screw you guys for not helping me out" and got banned for a month without warning. Ended up not getting the 327 before I started building on the 350 that was sitting in the garage, now there's a 427 in the garage to finish up Think the 327 I was possibly going to get is still in the other guy's car.

 

DANA 60!

 

lol. this post musta been the biggest waste of time..!!! he's almost as stupid as the guy who was on the radio talking about his iroc... if anyone herd it...?? well the thing is if you focus on"engien" **** all the time. good well how is the car gonna move when you keep break the cheap stuff. i'm a 17 yr old kid i work in a retoration shop. nothing thats gonna work good comes cheap. NOTING. i say NOTING. spend the f'ing money you'll never worry about it agian you'll waste less time re-fabrication the 9" the you keep breaking cause you a cheap SOB. so
if you car isn't street leagle. that should mean that you should have something that can hold that type of power. no stock 9" would ever do that. think before you open you yapper.

so what you got 20 years of experince. woopdy doo!!! this is a unibody car. your gonna twist the body to hell. unless you got some reallly nice SFC and had your body straighend before you put them on. wonder y GM had everything setup like they did. mayb cause they new what they were dealing with.

ohh and open your ears. listen to what people here have to say. *** knows thier smart. helped me out alot. you just to ignorant to accept the fact that your gonna have to fork out some money. well thats what happens when you upgradde a car and want it to keep working and not break. go get a danna or a currie 9" those are both nice axles. i'm savign for a currie 9" . and i'm only 17 i'm willing to fork out money. and i'm busy to i work 12 hours a day 5-6 days a week and i'm still flat *** brok. so fix it the right way and only do it once you jackass!!!

 

Dont bother, he's as arrogant as he is wealthy. Some people just deserve what they get.

 

No....I guess you won't get an answer with your condescending
attitude.

 

where can i go ?
lol
so there is nothing but idiots on this board huh?
guess that explains why you are here then doesnt it

 

My attitude was just fine until I was barraged with useless immature comments.

This thread is dead

Moderators, please lock it.

 

You're arrogant.

 

very!!!

 

I must agree with loanstar. He asked a simple question showed a pic and got dumped on. I to feel that this isn't the nicest board around, and I read it alot! Not to put everyone in the same pot, but there is alot of nice people on here to.
Also if people would read the topic from start to end before they posted that would help.

 

Im sorry, I shouldnt say that you are arrogant. Some of the things you posted where, but as I dont know you, I apologize for saying you were. It is pretty offensive though, when someone asks for some help, and shoots down what is offered.

 

this is true.

 

Lonestar....why dont you try a 12 bolt?..there more plentiful then a DANA and just as plentiful as a ford 9......also weld up the axle tubes and get a girdle...itll help quite a bit

 

here lies a problem trying to get by on stock parts, build the 9" so it will take all the abuse you throw at it. I chunked a stock 10 bolt with a V6. it was fun at the time.

I know if i put my 327 engine in my car i could chunk the 9 bolt and the T5 first thing.