ok, so i managed to break a tooth off my pinion today while driving. anywho, as you can see from the images, the carrier is quite torn up, however it still works fine. the thoughts that have rolled through my head are, buy new, but thats expensive. also, buy just new ring and pinion (probably upgrade to 3.73 from 3.23 for higher highway rpms) and use old carrier after smoother out the rough edges on it lol.

1)could i re use carrier?
2)where would be a good place to look for one for relatively cheap?
3)which would be better on hwy with the stock manual trans? right now it chugs at 60mph due to cam. 3.42 or 3.73?

thanks everyone!

 

All I see is, the pinion has been rubbing the carrier, because the nut backed off.

If you had paid any attention to the LOUD noise it's been making for the last few months every time you take your foot off the gas, it wouldn't have happened.

The carrier is probably fine. (as far as re-use, as far as the damage is concerned) Only problem I see with it is, it's an Auburn. :barf:

That depends on the cam. Looks like it's a 3.23 now. Also depends on which 5th gear T5 you have... if you have to low-perf one from the grocery-getter sleds (LG4 or L03) it has a .63 OD, if you have a "performance" one from a decent car (L69 or LB9) it has .73 OD. Both are "stock".

You want one that's GOOD, or you want "cheeeeeeeeeeeeep"? If you want GOOD, I can help you. I know NOTHING about "cheeeeeeeeeeeeeep"; having to buy inferior parts repeatedly, because they're not worth a crap to begin with, is not the world I live in.

 

ok, first thing, ever since i started driving it, its had a hum to it. i didnt think this would be the problem. right now you are correct, it has 3.23 gears. the cam thats in it is the Muthr Thumpr Cam. i can get specs on it if need be. basically a mild lope. at 60 the rpms are around 1700 which is just shy of where it quits chugging which is around 1900. so essentially i would like to cruise 60 @ 2100-2200rpms. next, i had the "performance" car with the 4bbl 305 HO which i believe is the L69. ive also come to thoughts of just
swapping it with a 4th gen rear end, but my biggest concern that i cannot find a
definitive answer on is, will my current rear disc bolt up to the 4th gen rear disc mounts? i found one on craigslist without the brakes off a 1994 ws6. the guy thinks it has 3.72 gears, but i couldnt find evidence of them making 3.72 in them. i wanted 3.73 gears originally, but most come with 3.42. is it possible the 3.42 will give me a noticeable bump in highway rpms?

 

If you're having "chugging" problems with 3.23's, you probably ought to go with 3.73's. 3.42 probably isn't enough of a change from 3.23's to really help much. If you do buy a new ring/pinion, make sure to stay FAR away from the cheap ones offered on Ebay. They're Chinese junk and almost always make noise, even when set up perfect. Check out Randy's Ring and Pinion. They have a good reputation for selling good quality gearsets. And yeah, the damage shown in your pic is really just cosmetic. It should be fine with a new ring/pinion. That is, at least until the cone clutches finally die in that Auburn. That's not a matter of IF, but WHEN. But I can understand if you don't want to plunk down all the extra cash for a new carrier at this point in time. One other fairly inexpensive option for a better carrier is to pick up a used Torsen from a 98-02, f-body posi rear. They use no clutches, just worm gears, so you never have to worry about the clutches going bad. If your timing is right on Ebay, you can usually pick one of those up for about 150-200 bucks on average. One other thing though with the Torsen. I noticed your car is an 86, and if it still has the original rearend in it, it has 26 spline axles. You'll need a set of 90-92 f-body axles that are 28 spline to work with a Torsen. But yeah, I'd say go ahead and pick up a 3.73 ring/pinion and just install it with the Auburn for now, until you can afford a better carrier down the road sometime. If you have to get the 28 spline axles for a Torsen carrier, you're probably better off just purchasing a 26 spline Eaton posi unit when the time comes. Btw, the early L69 HO cars with the T5 trans actually ran 3.73's from the factory. I pulled a set of these out of an 85 L69 HO Camaro at the junkyard a few years ago. The posi unit in it was the junk Eaton Gov-Loc, but it was nice to snag a set of factory 3.73's at the time!

 

Right, no such thing as 3.72 gears...

THINK about the gear ratio: it's a # of teeth on the ring, divided by a # of teeth on the pinion. They only make teeth in whole numbers; there's no gears with 43.5 teeth for example, when new. (unlike your pinion now, which now has like 12.2 teeth ) The pinion in these rears has 10, 11, 12, or 13 teeth, in the range of ratios of interest; so the only ratios that are possible, are some other # divided by one of those. The teeth are always roughly the same size, therefore the higher the ratio, the fewer the teeth. At least one of the tooth counts is always a prime # (cannot be evenly divided by any other #) in this model of rear, as it SHOULD be in ALL models but isn't always (especially in Frod rears). If you write down all the combinations of #s that meet those constraints, you'll find that the number of possible ratios is narrowed down quite a bit. 41:10 (4.10), 41:11 (3.73), 41:12 (3.42), and 42:13 (3.23) are the only really common ones, that are actually manufactured for this model of rear. Note that of those tooth counts, 11, 13, and 41 are all prime numbers.

If you had a L69 car, it should have come with a 3.73 rear, unless it was a 84 auto car in which case it might have been a 3.42.

If you have the tools and knowhow to change the gears, you'll be aware that the gears are CHEEEEEEP and not worth getting used ones. You'll also need a "gear install kit", which comes with bearings and shims and so forth, and I'd strongly recommend a solid pinion spacer as well. With all that metal shed into your fluid, your axle bearings are probably also smoked, which means you also need axles; I'd check em before buying anything, because it'd be STOOOPID to buy new 26-spline axles, but to use 28-spline ones you'd have to buy a carrier too.

A 94 car probably won't have 3.73 gears, no matter what about some seller's runnymouth. Tell him to pop the cover off and look, before shooting his mouth off in an obvious LIE. It will also have, AT BEST, an Auburn POS carrier, same garbage as what you've got now, which I would avoid if at all possible.

Frankly if I were in your situation, I'd probably hold out for either a 90-92 rear and put the gears I want into that, or a 98-02 rear with 3.73s. I'd pass on a 94 one.

 

I agree, as far as I know, 3.73's NEVER came stock in a 4th gen. 3.42 is the lowest ratio you'll find stock in any 4th gen f-body. I also agree that if you have to get new axles, then it's time to grab some 28's. They are somewhat stronger than the old 26 spline ones. 28 spline axles can be had cheap if you can find a used set at the junkyard in any 90-92 f-body. If not, Superior Axle offers good quality new ones at a reasonable price. Oh yeah, keep in mind, everything we're mentioning pertains to the 10 bolt rears. If you happen to have a 9 bolt, run it til it dies, then replace it with a 10 bolt. While the 9 bolts are a bit stronger, new replacement parts are virtually non-existent for them, so the little extra strength is not worth the headache of finding parts for them!

 

I woud just like to add one thing. When you ge your parts don't go to the same place that most people go, Summit or Jeg's. Go to a place that actually does rear end work and keeps quality parts in stock. Tom's Differentials and Randy's Ring & Pinion are the places that I recommend. They have good installation kits wih Timken bearings and the super him sets that Summit and Jeg's don't have. They also have good prices on their parts and can actually help you if you have problems.

 

Yeah most outfits these days sell nothing but Chinese-made junk gears and shims, which leads to a noisy rearend. Like he said above, if you go with a reputable place, you should be able to get quality, U.S. made stuff. I heard a while back that even Motive brand gears are being made overseas now, which is a shame. They used to be good quality. Last I heard, Richmond gears are still made domestically. And yeah, I swear by Timken bearings on all my rearend rebuilds too.

 

well, there are a few things i should mention to be sure we are on the same page and see where im coming from. first, my car has 4 wheel disc factory. last summer i got all new calipers, rotors, and pads, so i dont care to use the brakes off a different car if possible. thats why im wondering if the brakes from mine will bolt right up to the 90-92 or any 4th gens? next thing, is this car is not a high horsepower drag car. right now its probably running 250-300hp. at the most in its lifetime itll probably reach 350hp. so is it really worth swapping to the 28 spline and 3.73? in my eyes, the best way to do it right now, is get another rear end from, if possible, another third gen with 3.73 gears. if theres nothing around here, just get something to stick under there to drive it for now. like someone mentioned before, if i kept the same rear end and carrier, i would chance having the excess metal wreck it. it would be a waste of time IMO. So get another third gen 26 spline axle with 3.73 so my brakes bolt up. anything else anyone could add? sorry theres a lot to take in.

 

Yeah, I think I can see where you're coming from. I don't blame you for wanting to keep costs down. Yeah, your brakes should bolt right up to a 90-92 rear, or a 4th gen rear, provided they're disc rears and not drum. To use discs on a drum rear, there's some modification required. If you can find a 3rd gen rear locally with 3.73's, by all means go for it! You know what rearend and ratio would be pretty easy to find in just about any junkyard would be 3.23 or 3.42. Those ratios are way common in 6 cylinder 3rd gens. The only problem there is most 6 cylinder cars had drums on the rear. However, when it comes to 4th gen rears, 3.23 or 3.42 ratios are pretty easy to come by, and most 4th gens had disc brakes, so getting a 4th gen rear from one of your local yards is probably gonna be the easiest path to take. You're gonna find the 3.42 rears in the stickshift 4th gens, and 3.23's were common in the auto cars. Just avoid Formula Firebirds because they commonly got 2.73's. If you can find a 6 cylinder 4th gen, there's a good chance it'll have 3 series gears and possibly disc brakes as well.