Ok so we all know that no V6 camaro ever came with a stock TBI but that the V8 models did, i bought this awesome new Fageol supercharger for my car and i want to go TBI, since TBI is kinda like a carb, could i use the TBI stuff from a V8 camaro? I think its easier to stay camaro original in wiring after looking at a few TBI 2.8 blazers in the junkyard. How different are the block sensors between a V6 and a V8? Are they just the same basic oil pressure and coolant sensors? Anyway i hope this wiring route isnt a pipe dream. Let me know what you think.

 

2.8 trucks were TBI Im pretty sure...........

 

yea im just trying to stay with camaro parts for some aspect of plug and play, if i use a s-10 tbi wiring harness i need to worry about splicing it in with the camaro, though i guess if i had a wiring manual for both i could do it, im just trying to keep it simple, anybody on here besides 614 steets have that fageol supercharger?

 

just pull the wiring harness out of the camaro and install the S10 harness. it'll be cleaner. As far as I know, the only sensors that will be compatable are the CTS, pickup coil, and O2. The TBI setups didn't have an IAT or MAF.

 

on a camaro the wiring harness starts in the upper right corner of the engine with a massive connector, does that go to the gauge cluster or does the wiring from the computer into the car go to the gauge cluster? i know i can run the lights and everything from the camaro stuff, i just dont know how to get my gauge cluster to be compatible with the s-10 stuff, i need to reaearch stuff, i just know im not going carb

 

is there any such thing as a 4.3 v8? cause painless has a wiring harness for 4.3 5.0 5.7 and 7.4 TBI engines, if the 4.6 is only a v6 then i can use that to wire everything up, and its all brand new

 

yeah basically.

remember though ya got 2 harnesses. theres the gauge/dash and the comp harness. the comp harness comes out the fenderwell at the a/c box on the right and the gauge and dash comes out as the like 2 x 4 connector on the left.

 

what year is your camaro again?

Problem I had going from TBI to SFI was the electronic speed sensor in the trans.

May I suggest getting a TBI wireharness from an 86-89 S10 2.8. 90 and up made use of the electronic vss, where pre's didnt.

It can be done, but its not fun. As I did the reverse of what your doing. Sometimes I miss that truck

Edited, just noticed your 1990 model. Do you have a cable driven speedo, or electronic?

 

when i did the swap i didnt hook up anything to the trans but 2 electrical connectors and the kick down cable so ill have to assume i have electronic speedo

 

They probably make and sell one uni harness for all thoes engines. Not much different between them far as wiring needs. 4.3 is a V6, its a chevy V8 missing two back cylinders. So its can share many parts on top. And its easy re-tool parts for them.

Do you got any money left after buying that blower?
Id buy a new[on sale, discount] or a used full TBI system. carbs to computer wiring n all kit. I wouldn't , you can, but dude, you got a bad butt blower, id want something better then an old 80s gm computer in control. Though I would also drive it year round, and go MPFI and stick. Would need to be stick to driven year round.

Firebird with a blower and some wicked snow chains plowing through. I alredy do it on all season tires n a 6..............

 

how would the engine react if i made my own custom plenum and fuel log and had 2 groups of 3 injectors firing down into the air intake atop the supercharger? i would use the stock mpfi tb on the front of my custom plenum and the injectors would be inside the plenum or would be atop the plenum and inject into the plenum, i know with tpi and mpfi it fires into each cylinder and with a carb its kinda like how this set up would be, is the computer going to realize its not getting fuel into each cylinder? Or should i do something like they do over in the alternative intake boards and drill holes in the intake for the fuel injectors and then just make a custome plenum/plate for a tb, im thinking i can keep this mpfi someway somehow

 

persanity, you would be correct then. Dakota digital makes a converter box to modify the vss signal. Not cheap, and I never got around to buying it. Had to sell the truck before the swap was final.


I would love to try and find a way to make an mpfi bolt on top s/c.

The fwd versions of our engines use fuel rails that are on the "outside" of the plenium. Take a look at them and see if you can use that rail, or get any ideas from it.

Having any fuel sprayed in pre s/c, it wont mater if its mpfi/sfi/tbi/carb. Its all going to get mixed with the blades. It will have to be post s/c to take any advantage at all.

 

yea, keeping it MPFI would be that simple. Just mill a 2-3 in high square hollow like adapter ring and put the 6 injectors from the intake into the sides of it. Could run the 7th cold start injector too.

Get one of them turblower like tops made to stick on it and just put the throttle body there.

guess it aint really mpfi anymore.

 

yea i guess itd be more like a 6 injector tbi system, should i fabricate something to go before or after the supercharger to inject fuel? just mix in the fuel like tbi from on top? or try to make injector holes in each cylinders runner on the intake manifold and try to keep it almost stock mpfi, oh and i dont have a 7th injector on either my 90 or 92 fuel rail, but yea ive seen some V6 fuel rails that i can modify easy to work how i want no matter which route i go, i just need to make sure they have the same inlet and outlets as the camaro mpfi fuel log, but yea, this is going to be so much easier then tbi, i just need physical parts instead of custom wiring, lot less daunting this way, im going to try to wait till i have the supercharger in hand before i ask more questions, im just excited about it, but i want to get a nice big picture of what im doing myself, then run it by the people who have been helping, which btw you all have helped me, and go from there

 

whats the link to the auction, or can you post some pictures of the seperate parts?

I like that spacer idea, but I'm still not sure it would fully work properly.

 

Here] , it looks to me like there is room to put injectors on that manifold next to the supercharger so i can prob rig up a mpfi fuel injector set up, also check out This

 

you can easily make an adaptor for teh TBI unit from 1/4 inch thick plate steel or aluminum.
TBI for V6 and V8 used the same sensor sets and all read in the same scales. with the programming being required for your application anyway i woudl suggest using a V8 computer to control it, they have more cells so you cna more precisely tune things in, teh big block truck computers being the best choice.
you could easily scrounge a 2.8 s-10 platform wiring harness to use and jstu find a few wiring diagrams to make sure all the ports are teh same.
the distributer signal can be adjusted fo rthe V6 when you do the rest of the tuning.

 

Just wanted to add some infor here, my stock L4 151cid iron Duke came stock with a single barrel TBI.

 

Yes, the 'baby LT1' that came in the Caprice's.

 

without having the parts in front of me i can only guess at things, put as i said before it appears there is enough room to add fuel injector ports to the intake manifold below the charger but im wondering with boost if itd leak air or if since its a vaccum if it wouldnt matter, but ive been looking at the alternative port intakes on this forum and they are carb manifolds drilled for fuel injectors and custom tb atop the carb, so if i get a new fuel rail and have injector holes, basicly nothing is changing as far as fuel injection and thats one less problem

 

RPO code L99 (i am a fountain of useless knowledge)

 

*edit: n/m.. not the proper place for extended v8 banter.

 

this is all about a V6, i was just wondering if i could use a few v8 parts before but thats no longer the focus of discussion

 

do you want an award

 

njspder has a good point.

As much as your going to have to re-work the ecm of whatever system you choose. Your best solution for TBI is to use the v8 TBI harness/ecm assuming they use the same ICM as us(think they do).

Would have to shorten, or maybe extend a few wires. But then it would read proper vss. Would all plug into and fit stock looking.

If you want mpfi, use the system you have now. Try to have a spacer plate made for between s/c and intake. Then custom fuel rails as well.

 

Found everything i needed to know Here basicly, found out both my ideas would work for modifying the mpfi system, my decided coarse of action is that im going to drill the manifold and have injector bungs welded in, have custom fuel rails made and fabricate a top plenum/manifold to accept a tpi throttle body an get the largest tpi tb i can find, ill be done by the end of febuary if everything goes good, ill buy a camera so i can do progress pictures too, as far as the computer stuff, is it possible to perhaps use a 3.4 supercharged computer from a grand prix since its set up for a supercharger?

deffinitly room for injectors

 

I dont see mpfi working properly of any fashion.

To get injectors in that manifold, they will have to face the wrong direction.

Making a spacer plate to go between the two might not work either. It would be close as the angle where they need to spray to and the other end clearing the valve covers.


As for the ecm, As far as I can tell, the stock 3.1 will work fine with re-programing. Contact doward for this. Again, the engine doesnt care what type of boost (s/c or turbo), its just getting it.

 

the injectors will go straight down into the manifold, and no it wont effect anything, ive been talking to people and reading alot of stuff on diy fuel injection intake boards, they take carb manifolds and add fuel injection, there are companies out there that do mpfi conversions to carb manifolds, if i drill holes in each runner and add a fuel injector bung so the injector sits right on the manifold straight up and down, it will clear the sc and allow me to keep mpfi, ill add more info as it becomes available, oh yea i got the pacesetter headers too

 

You can add them. But if you set the s/c back on top, its going to hit the injectors. Injectors wont fit strait up n down according to the pictures.

 

if you look at this you can see id just need to run a big spacer between the manifold and supercharger, i can add the injector bungs for mpfi straight up and down far enough away from the edge to clear the valve covers and add the fuel rail, to me this is easier then going tbi or carb, im not trying to knock ur opinion either, u have much more experence then me and i have read many of ur posts in many different boards and respect ur opinion, its just i have an idea in my head and based on what ive seen others do i believe i can make this work

 

Well yea you want a spacer just like his. a pop off valve is a must have. So you will have the space needed.

Last thing you want is the whole top end blowning off and ruining the motor cause you can no pop off valve.


Though when I said spacer earlier I said meant for the top of the SC. Someone said it needs mixed pre SC n thats when I said just add a spacer on top for injectors. But you gotta have the bottom middle spacer / pop off valve. No ifs ands or butts.

shoot me a PM Persanity

 

Though what's different from that manifold and the MPFI one?

ported better? is it possiable to just mill that middle spacers to adapt the SC to the stock mpfi lower intake?

Just thinkin

 

actualy 614streets said it doesnt NEED the popoff valve, if i make a manifold that has the fuel injected presupercharger hows that going to differ from intake manifold fuel injection via custom placed injector bungs? i just want to keep stock wiring anything else is game, i havnt seen a mpfi manifold for the supercharger, there was supposta be a kit but it was 2k over the carbed kit price, this lower intake is custom for the supercharger i cant bolt it onto another manifold

 

YEs, with a spacer like that, you can have them spray strait down, or maybe even angle them back a hair. Could use the spacer as a mount for the fuel rails as well

Something that tall, will it still clear the stock hood?

I've gotten into many custom projects, and had a wall thrown in my face. I just do my best to help others attempting crazy things to see the potential of problems. Esp when dealing with parts you cant buy anymore. Would hate to see that intake chopped up, you hit a wall. Then you have thrown all that money down the drain.

Anyone want a 1-off custom homedone carbon fiber hood for a s10

 

actually, once you get that in-hand. Id like to get some dimensions and see if it is possible to place the injectors in the spacer.

 

that was another idea, add the fuel injectors sideways into the spacer, but if i do that im thinking of adding it on top, i dont care if it clears the stock hood as i need a new hood

 

Adding the spacer up top? Then it would be pointless to use mpfi.


The whole point of mpfi is to have an injector spray x amount of fuel into each runner. It MIGHT be possible with a space of that size, but I would need a dead front view, and a few dimensions.

Ok, your not worried about fitting under stock hood. I personally would want it to.

 

what if the injectors went in at a angle so the tops were facing backwards towards the firewall? i just need a very custom fuel rail that has a injector fitting on the bottom of a T fitting and hose going to the next injector on either end of the fitting or since the engine will be under boost what would be so bad about having the injectors angled in slightly towards the sc? wouldnt the fuel just get mixed in with the air like normal? sorry i cant find a head on picture, but ill take one once i recieve mine, i actualy dont want this fitting under the stock hood i might just remove my hood after winter because of it, i love showing off, im even gonna write v6 on it so ppl know what beat them

 

read my previous info about the whole point of mpfi. Every idea you are coming up with on fuel, is totally eleminating the whole point of having mpfi.

To keep mpfi, and the benifits of it, you need to have one injector spraying down one runner. It supplys enough, and only enough fuel for that one cylinder to fire.

 

Dale that last idea was about a fuel rail to keep mpfi, adding the injector bungs so the injectors were at a backwards angle (with the tops for electrical connectors facing back) so theyd clear the supercharger without adding a plate, sorry if the post was unclear but again that was deffinitly an idea to keep mpfi with a custom fuel rail, i understand that if its to be mpfi that it needs a injector for each runner and thats the solution ive been focusing on even though i have asked questions about just adding fuel in pre-sc, untill now ive never used anything for a custom part inside a car, ive done engine swaps and rewired electrical harnesses but thats about it, i need a push and shove in the right direction every so often which is why im here asking for help/ discussing this amoungst ppl who think its interesting

 

ive been looking around over at the fiero boards, and it seems some people there are making a replacement upper intake manifold that will mount an m62 or m90, allowing retention of stock fuel systems. cost is probably going to be around $200-500, depending on materials used, and there will probably be some issues with tb location, etc . . . but it seems promising, especially for people like me who would like to be able to swap back to stock for visual emissions testing.