Want to swpa out idiot light dash & put in my Gauge package dash. HOW?????
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
Want to swpa out idiot light dash & put in my Gauge package dash. HOW?????
Hi All,
With all your past help & tips, I've done my 2.8 to 3.4 swap.
NOW, I need gauges.
I have the correct gauge dash cluster (w/85MPH speedo).
HOW DO I PUT THIS IN?
I know, I'll may have to make the back plug in block connectors, as I have not yet found (in the yards) a Firebird with the gauge package dash to get that wiring harness.
I do not want to butcher (make inoperable) my current working idiot light dash.
How can I do this?
I have the 1985 Firebird Helms shop manual & a MOTOR wiring diagram book (want excercise? Lift both!).
I may have to create the wiring harness blocks and intergrate them, but.........
Not timid, just looking for tips, advice wisdom.
HELP!!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
With all your past help & tips, I've done my 2.8 to 3.4 swap.
NOW, I need gauges.
I have the correct gauge dash cluster (w/85MPH speedo).
HOW DO I PUT THIS IN?
I know, I'll may have to make the back plug in block connectors, as I have not yet found (in the yards) a Firebird with the gauge package dash to get that wiring harness.
I do not want to butcher (make inoperable) my current working idiot light dash.
How can I do this?
I have the 1985 Firebird Helms shop manual & a MOTOR wiring diagram book (want excercise? Lift both!).
I may have to create the wiring harness blocks and intergrate them, but.........
Not timid, just looking for tips, advice wisdom.
HELP!!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Supreme Member
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 13,414
Likes: 6
From: Central NJ, USA
Car: 1986 Firebird
Engine: 2.8 V6
Transmission: 700R4
Karl, got a question- do you have another '85 panel with the full gauges? Or is this the gauge panel from the 3.4 donor car? I'd have no idea about the 3.4 dash, but I have a few on the 85-86 panel.
------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!
------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
Hi Tom,
I got a 85MPH speedo dash cluster, full gauge package dash for $3.
I am NOT sure what year it is from, I'm hoping the 85 MPH speedo one is exactly my 1985 year, as my current idiot light dash is a 85 MPH speedo, too.
Hope this helps with your answers for me!
I really want gauges!! And this gauge cluster to work!
Funny, the last car I had with just idiot lights was also a Firebird.
But, a 1968 Firebird, 400/TH400 tranny, power disc, fold down rear seat, luxury interior, clock on console.
I was told, it could have been a RAII engine (like 1 of 12, I found out later).
All I know is it always broke motor mounts and I NEVER lost a drag race in Van Nuys (back in the early 80's).
Sold it to a collector in Canada, in 1983.
THANKS TOM!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
I got a 85MPH speedo dash cluster, full gauge package dash for $3.
I am NOT sure what year it is from, I'm hoping the 85 MPH speedo one is exactly my 1985 year, as my current idiot light dash is a 85 MPH speedo, too.
Hope this helps with your answers for me!
I really want gauges!! And this gauge cluster to work!
Funny, the last car I had with just idiot lights was also a Firebird.
But, a 1968 Firebird, 400/TH400 tranny, power disc, fold down rear seat, luxury interior, clock on console.
I was told, it could have been a RAII engine (like 1 of 12, I found out later).
All I know is it always broke motor mounts and I NEVER lost a drag race in Van Nuys (back in the early 80's).
Sold it to a collector in Canada, in 1983.
THANKS TOM!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
I have been told to recreate the wiring harness I need and to buy a oil pressure senesor & water temp sensor for this gauge package I now have.
How can I tell if I have the 1985 version of this gauge cluster in my hands?
By the speedo cable outlet of the 85MPH speedo?
I was told about an "electric" speedo set up?
My 1985 Firebird has a speedo cable to the tranny, now, if that will help anyone.
HELP!!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
How can I tell if I have the 1985 version of this gauge cluster in my hands?
By the speedo cable outlet of the 85MPH speedo?
I was told about an "electric" speedo set up?
My 1985 Firebird has a speedo cable to the tranny, now, if that will help anyone.
HELP!!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Supreme Member
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 13,414
Likes: 6
From: Central NJ, USA
Car: 1986 Firebird
Engine: 2.8 V6
Transmission: 700R4
Okay man, since that cluster isn't out of a 4th gen 3.4, that makes life easier 
Yes, if you have a cable-driven-speedo on that spare cluster, you're in great shape. The electronic speedometer (with a needle, it looks analog but it's not) started around '87 or '88 or '89.
You should also have a yellow box hanging off the back of the speedo- that's the VSS (Vehic speed sensor) for the computer. The cars with the electronic speedo's had the VSS in the transmission. Instead of a speedo cable, they just had wires going from the trans to the speedo to the computer.
I've heard that all the wiring is there for the gauges panel. In fact, you don't need to modify the connector on the back of that dash panel! I hear there's one wire missing, and I believe that's for the tachometer. You'd have to lead that missing wire from the engine's spark coil to the dashboard.
Do you know what engine the car had that you've got the gauges panel from? If the gauges panel was from a V8 firebird/camaro, the tachometer inside will be 25% slow. That's because the v8 tach "expects" 8 pulses, but you're only giving it 6. 6 divided by 8 is 75% - you'll see 75% of actual on the v8 tach, which means it'll be 25% slow. Let me know if I didn't explain that right...
Yes, you just need to replace your "idiot light switches" with "gauges panel sensors" on the engine block. (The idiot panel switches kick on at limits- as in, 0 oil pressure = the oil pressure switch closes, and lights up your oil pressure idiot light. The gauge panel sensors are always monitoring the engine.) The coolant switch/sensor for the dash is on the driver's side head, at the front. You might have to move your a/c compressor out of the way to see it.
The oil pressure switch/sensor for the dashboard is located by the oil filter. There's two sensors there- one has one wire coming from it, the other sensor has two wires. The one-wire sensor (actually a switch) is the one you'll replace. The two-wire one is the "backup switch" for the fuel pump, and doesn't get changed.
But, from what I was told, all the wiring (save for one wire) is in the car already. The differences between a gauge panel and idiot light panel was:
1. Panel
2. Idiot light panel used "switches" for pressure & temperature on engine
3. Gauge panel used "sensors" on engine
Oops, I think I'm late for class. Let me know if you find anything else out!
------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!
Yes, if you have a cable-driven-speedo on that spare cluster, you're in great shape. The electronic speedometer (with a needle, it looks analog but it's not) started around '87 or '88 or '89.
You should also have a yellow box hanging off the back of the speedo- that's the VSS (Vehic speed sensor) for the computer. The cars with the electronic speedo's had the VSS in the transmission. Instead of a speedo cable, they just had wires going from the trans to the speedo to the computer.
I've heard that all the wiring is there for the gauges panel. In fact, you don't need to modify the connector on the back of that dash panel! I hear there's one wire missing, and I believe that's for the tachometer. You'd have to lead that missing wire from the engine's spark coil to the dashboard.
Do you know what engine the car had that you've got the gauges panel from? If the gauges panel was from a V8 firebird/camaro, the tachometer inside will be 25% slow. That's because the v8 tach "expects" 8 pulses, but you're only giving it 6. 6 divided by 8 is 75% - you'll see 75% of actual on the v8 tach, which means it'll be 25% slow. Let me know if I didn't explain that right...
Yes, you just need to replace your "idiot light switches" with "gauges panel sensors" on the engine block. (The idiot panel switches kick on at limits- as in, 0 oil pressure = the oil pressure switch closes, and lights up your oil pressure idiot light. The gauge panel sensors are always monitoring the engine.) The coolant switch/sensor for the dash is on the driver's side head, at the front. You might have to move your a/c compressor out of the way to see it.
The oil pressure switch/sensor for the dashboard is located by the oil filter. There's two sensors there- one has one wire coming from it, the other sensor has two wires. The one-wire sensor (actually a switch) is the one you'll replace. The two-wire one is the "backup switch" for the fuel pump, and doesn't get changed.
But, from what I was told, all the wiring (save for one wire) is in the car already. The differences between a gauge panel and idiot light panel was:
1. Panel
2. Idiot light panel used "switches" for pressure & temperature on engine
3. Gauge panel used "sensors" on engine
Oops, I think I'm late for class. Let me know if you find anything else out!
------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
Hi Tom,
What I discovered when I inserted the "new" gauge dash to the current block (used for idiot lights) was that I only blew fuses.
It didn't cooperate, correctly, at all.
I can tell ya, I WAS TOLD, that the gauge I have is from a 6 car.
I have a 6,000 RPM Tach.
I do have that yellow block on the back.
I just let my Wife drive the 2.8 in disuguise for the first time, and that gauge dash is in the car (lack of room for new Son, 5 months old this 11th!)
NOW...
Your comment on sensor, could that have accounted for the fuses blowing?
Wiring block, and the wiring diagrams between guages are "different" according to the Motor electric wiring manual.
I'll keep taking tips, but, it's on hold, until I get the dash back in my hand.
I gotta buy sensors, huh! DAMN!!
But only two sensors?
Located behind the AC compressor & on the oil filter housing? Easy to get to, if so.
Where do I get wire for the tach? I am using a remote mount Accel SUPER COIL for this car. My original coil (on engine bracket, pass side) failed (I had complete ignition failure) & I ended up rebuilding distributor completely, including using this coil, instead of the GM one.
THANKS TOM,
Do well in your classes.
It'll pay off! Promise.
Keep your eye on the "real" world, not the "book" world.
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
What I discovered when I inserted the "new" gauge dash to the current block (used for idiot lights) was that I only blew fuses.
It didn't cooperate, correctly, at all.
I can tell ya, I WAS TOLD, that the gauge I have is from a 6 car.
I have a 6,000 RPM Tach.
I do have that yellow block on the back.
I just let my Wife drive the 2.8 in disuguise for the first time, and that gauge dash is in the car (lack of room for new Son, 5 months old this 11th!)
NOW...
Your comment on sensor, could that have accounted for the fuses blowing?
Wiring block, and the wiring diagrams between guages are "different" according to the Motor electric wiring manual.
I'll keep taking tips, but, it's on hold, until I get the dash back in my hand.
I gotta buy sensors, huh! DAMN!!
But only two sensors?
Located behind the AC compressor & on the oil filter housing? Easy to get to, if so.
Where do I get wire for the tach? I am using a remote mount Accel SUPER COIL for this car. My original coil (on engine bracket, pass side) failed (I had complete ignition failure) & I ended up rebuilding distributor completely, including using this coil, instead of the GM one.
THANKS TOM,
Do well in your classes.
It'll pay off! Promise.
Keep your eye on the "real" world, not the "book" world.
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Member
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 428
Likes: 0
From: Maryland,USA
Car: 1984 Camaro
Engine: V6
Transmission: 700 R4
Here's a tech article on the swap: https://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/tech/gauges.shtml
Whenever I switched my gauge cluster the way I knew that I needed to switch the sending units was whenever I turned the key on the gauges "pegged" themselves. I had to change the oil sending unit on mine.
------------------
"5 out of 4 people have a problem with fractions"
My Camaro: http://home.earthlink.net/~singleton052095
Whenever I switched my gauge cluster the way I knew that I needed to switch the sending units was whenever I turned the key on the gauges "pegged" themselves. I had to change the oil sending unit on mine.
------------------
"5 out of 4 people have a problem with fractions"
My Camaro: http://home.earthlink.net/~singleton052095
Trending Topics
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
Hi Rob,
I read it.
I wish mine could be that easy. Your tips say that for Camaro & V-8.
IT SEEMS....
All I need do is swap idiot light sensors for other gauge sensors.
Plug in blocks.
NOW....
How can someone tell me if my speedo/tach gauge cluster, I have, is for a V-6?
Last time I plugged this gauge dash in, all that happened was I blew fuses.
Oh Joy, Oh Thrill!
THANKS!!
Tom, Have the dash on my lap.
So convient!
Yellow block behind speedo, inlet (female) cable for the speedo, 3 wires leading out of the speedo area, to the yellow box.
Oil pressure goes up to 60
Volts goes up to 18
Temp goes to 260
Tach WARNING redline is 4500
REDLINE is 5,000 top RPM's is 6,000
Part code is ZDT #25078585
THANKS!!!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
[This message has been edited by KED85 (edited February 08, 2001).]
I read it.
I wish mine could be that easy. Your tips say that for Camaro & V-8.
IT SEEMS....
All I need do is swap idiot light sensors for other gauge sensors.
Plug in blocks.
NOW....
How can someone tell me if my speedo/tach gauge cluster, I have, is for a V-6?
Last time I plugged this gauge dash in, all that happened was I blew fuses.
Oh Joy, Oh Thrill!
THANKS!!
Tom, Have the dash on my lap.
So convient!
Yellow block behind speedo, inlet (female) cable for the speedo, 3 wires leading out of the speedo area, to the yellow box.
Oil pressure goes up to 60
Volts goes up to 18
Temp goes to 260
Tach WARNING redline is 4500
REDLINE is 5,000 top RPM's is 6,000
Part code is ZDT #25078585
THANKS!!!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
[This message has been edited by KED85 (edited February 08, 2001).]
Supreme Member
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 13,414
Likes: 6
From: Central NJ, USA
Car: 1986 Firebird
Engine: 2.8 V6
Transmission: 700R4
KED, thanx for the encouragement- i've learned my lesson now... hell, I should have my graduate degree by now. 
Oh well. But at least I'm getting it done now.
CC_HotRod, thanks for that link! I didn't know someone wrote it up already. I always seem to miss something in that tech section...
Oh and I'm not sure how to tell if the cluster's for v6 or v8... I have the idiot light cluster, and I added gauges, so I'm not sure what the limits are for the stock panel. Anyone with the stock gauges panel got an idea?
The GM service manual shows the tach wire as being the black/white wire on the gray coil connector. I'd imagine you'd tap into this line, and snake the new wire into your passenger compartment... but that tech article said the tach wire's already there. Hm. Damn! If that's the case, that means I could've hooked up my aftermarket tach without drilling through the f'ing firewall! Oh well. (I have 5 or 6 holes going thru my firewall...)
------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!
Oh well. But at least I'm getting it done now. CC_HotRod, thanks for that link! I didn't know someone wrote it up already. I always seem to miss something in that tech section...
Oh and I'm not sure how to tell if the cluster's for v6 or v8... I have the idiot light cluster, and I added gauges, so I'm not sure what the limits are for the stock panel. Anyone with the stock gauges panel got an idea?
The GM service manual shows the tach wire as being the black/white wire on the gray coil connector. I'd imagine you'd tap into this line, and snake the new wire into your passenger compartment... but that tech article said the tach wire's already there. Hm. Damn! If that's the case, that means I could've hooked up my aftermarket tach without drilling through the f'ing firewall! Oh well.
(I have 5 or 6 holes going thru my firewall...)------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
Tom,
Do the extra firewall holes help keep the passenger compartment, warmer?!
Glad to send ya encouragement. To many, these days, only want to take away.
I'll let ya know answers, soon.
I'm gonna take this dash to a GM dealer parts counter friend for his parts number matching answer if it's a 6 or an 8 dash.
He sells me parts @wholesale cost. BIG HELP WITH THIS SWAP I DID!
Who has stock gauges in their V-6?
Time for a new post!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Do the extra firewall holes help keep the passenger compartment, warmer?
!Glad to send ya encouragement. To many, these days, only want to take away.
I'll let ya know answers, soon.
I'm gonna take this dash to a GM dealer parts counter friend for his parts number matching answer if it's a 6 or an 8 dash.
He sells me parts @wholesale cost. BIG HELP WITH THIS SWAP I DID!
Who has stock gauges in their V-6?
Time for a new post!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
I was informed the gauge cluster dash I have is for a V-8.
It's a 1985 305 4-bbl package dash.
The last 4 numbers read 8585.
The dash I want is 8584.
What do I do, now?
I'm going to my schematics & see differences in tach resistance. I see no real real why I can't use this, somehow!!
All the aftermarket tachs I've ever had all had a setting for 4-6-8 cylinders, why can't I do something like that to this? I gotta find out what to insert to adjust the electric signal to the tach.
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
It's a 1985 305 4-bbl package dash.
The last 4 numbers read 8585.
The dash I want is 8584.
What do I do, now?
I'm going to my schematics & see differences in tach resistance. I see no real real why I can't use this, somehow!!
All the aftermarket tachs I've ever had all had a setting for 4-6-8 cylinders, why can't I do something like that to this? I gotta find out what to insert to adjust the electric signal to the tach.
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
I pulled a part the tach.
The circuit board comes off with 3 1/4" nuts.
I plan on finding a 6 cylinder Fiero Tach circuit board at a wrecking yard. Or Camaro or similar item. Just pull out tach & see if it's identical. Then I just swap them. I'll then have a V-6 tach.
Simple!
Wish I didn't have to move Wife's stuff in the rain, this weekend.
I'd be out in the wrecking yards!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
The circuit board comes off with 3 1/4" nuts.
I plan on finding a 6 cylinder Fiero Tach circuit board at a wrecking yard. Or Camaro or similar item. Just pull out tach & see if it's identical. Then I just swap them. I'll then have a V-6 tach.
Simple!
Wish I didn't have to move Wife's stuff in the rain, this weekend.
I'd be out in the wrecking yards!
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
From: East Hampton, CT USA
Car: 1988 Formula now a T/A
Engine: LB9
Transmission: 700r4
Email me if you want help. I sucessfully swapped a 1985 Firebird guage dash into a 1982 Firebird idiot light dash. You will most definately have to swap wires around in the two plugs mounted in the dash that the guage panel plugs into This is why you are blowing fuses trust me I went through the same thing and anyways (nothing plugs right in. you should know better than that it would be too easy) If you are interested I can draw you a diagram and email it to you. (I'm laid off until april I have loads of free time) You definately have a v8 guage panel. In my experience the v6 panels have a 80 psi oil pressure guage, not 60 psi. I may be new to the board, but I honestly believe I can help you! Sparkledelic@aol.com
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7,604
Likes: 1
From: ****SoCal, USA****
You are so correct on the oil pressure call.
I just checked my S-10 Blazer dash gauge.
0-40-80.
I feel, I'm still ahead, I mean I have paid $3 for this thing.
Sent ya an email.
I'm anxious to find out if I'm correct on the tach circuit board call.
Now, how do I hook up tach wires to Accel remoute mount Super Coil?
My original coil failed. It's outta there.
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
I just checked my S-10 Blazer dash gauge.
0-40-80.
I feel, I'm still ahead, I mean I have paid $3 for this thing.
Sent ya an email.
I'm anxious to find out if I'm correct on the tach circuit board call.
Now, how do I hook up tach wires to Accel remoute mount Super Coil?
My original coil failed. It's outta there.
------------------
Chat Soon,
KED85
Karl
1985 Firebird 2.8 to 3.4 swap project for Smog Happy LA, CA
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Ghettobird52
Tech / General Engine
16
Jul 5, 2024 11:18 PM
