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Cam swap now runs rich

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Old Jun 4, 2016 | 11:47 PM
  #1  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Cam swap now runs rich

I just finnished swapping my cam to a melling 278/288 and my car seems to be running rich I have the timming at 18° but cant get it any lower because one of the wires (the one running from that terminal near the egr) running to the distributor is too short may it be possible my distributor is off a tooth or should I advance the timing past 18. It idles smooth and drives good but you can really smell the gas in the exhaust especially while sitting in place
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Old Jun 4, 2016 | 11:55 PM
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Car: 1973 Datsun 240Z/ 1985 S-15 Jimmy
Engine: Turbo LX9/To be decided
Transmission: 5-speed/T-5
Axle/Gears: R200 3.90/7.5" 3.73
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

With a larger change in the cam, you will need to re-tune the EFI to get it to run correctly.
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 12:15 AM
  #3  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by Six_Shooter
With a larger change in the cam, you will need to re-tune the EFI to get it to run correctly.
The car is pulling alot harder now and definitely doesnt seem to be losing power at top end. You would think if the cam was having a conflict with the ecm it be more noticable than just running rich wouldnt you? Not saying your wrong just confused as to whats to do. I dont want to tune if I dont need to if it could be fixed with a slight rotation of the distributor.
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 06:05 AM
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Car: 1991 Camaro RS
Engine: Lq4 6.0 SBE s485 turbo E85
Transmission: Fsi th400 stage 4. TSI 5500 st
Axle/Gears: Strange S60 4:10s
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by Wafflestomp
The car is pulling alot harder now and definitely doesnt seem to be losing power at top end. You would think if the cam was having a conflict with the ecm it be more noticable than just running rich wouldnt you? Not saying your wrong just confused as to whats to do. I dont want to tune if I dont need to if it could be fixed with a slight rotation of the distributor.
I guarentee it's rich at idle and lean up top (high rpm)

Is this a 1990-1992? Car?

If it is... you need to tune it expecially with a big cam like that.
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 09:21 AM
  #5  
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Car: 1973 Datsun 240Z/ 1985 S-15 Jimmy
Engine: Turbo LX9/To be decided
Transmission: 5-speed/T-5
Axle/Gears: R200 3.90/7.5" 3.73
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Changing the cam, changes the fueling needs of the engine over the RPM range as compared to using the stock cam.

Typically with a larger cam, there will be less vacuum created at idle and cruise, where the ECM will think the engine is under higher load than it really is, so it adds more fuel than it needs. Then as the RPM increases the air flow increases due to the characteristics of the cam, and the reason we change then to get more air through the engine, so you need to have the ECM add more fuel up top than it originally did.

Twisting the dizzy, or playing with fuel pressure will only improve one area of the RPM range, but make other areas suffer. Do it right, or not at all.
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 09:35 AM
  #6  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by fasteddi
I guarentee it's rich at idle and lean up top (high rpm)

Is this a 1990-1992? Car?

If it is... you need to tune it expecially with a big cam like that.
No its a 1987
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 09:37 AM
  #7  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by Six_Shooter
Changing the cam, changes the fueling needs of the engine over the RPM range as compared to using the stock cam.

Typically with a larger cam, there will be less vacuum created at idle and cruise, where the ECM will think the engine is under higher load than it really is, so it adds more fuel than it needs. Then as the RPM increases the air flow increases due to the characteristics of the cam, and the reason we change then to get more air through the engine, so you need to have the ECM add more fuel up top than it originally did.

Twisting the dizzy, or playing with fuel pressure will only improve one area of the RPM range, but make other areas suffer. Do it right, or not at all.
Makes sense
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 09:50 AM
  #8  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by fasteddi
I guarentee it's rich at idle and lean up top (high rpm)

Is this a 1990-1992? Car?

If it is... you need to tune it expecially with a big cam like that.
With my car being a 87 does it have a 7730 ecm if not what vehicle can I get one off of so I can tune it.
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Old Jun 5, 2016 | 10:01 AM
  #9  
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Car: 1973 Datsun 240Z/ 1985 S-15 Jimmy
Engine: Turbo LX9/To be decided
Transmission: 5-speed/T-5
Axle/Gears: R200 3.90/7.5" 3.73
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

It doesn't have the '7730, but IIRC you can tune the stock ECM if you want. Most people swap to the '7730 to ditch the MAF, and many people find SD tuning easier than MAF tuning.
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Old Jun 6, 2016 | 05:44 AM
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From: Northwest Ohio
Car: 1991 Camaro RS
Engine: Lq4 6.0 SBE s485 turbo E85
Transmission: Fsi th400 stage 4. TSI 5500 st
Axle/Gears: Strange S60 4:10s
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by Wafflestomp
With my car being a 87 does it have a 7730 ecm if not what vehicle can I get one off of so I can tune it.

As six said no it doesn't have a 7730. But many swap one into there cars of that age to help.

Personally I would tune it though. I know you are not messing with alot of hp by any means but playing with the dizzy and running lean at high rpms can cause spark knock and iirc you engine does not have a knock sensor on it.
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Old Jun 6, 2016 | 06:11 AM
  #11  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by fasteddi
As six said no it doesn't have a 7730. But many swap one into there cars of that age to help.

Personally I would tune it though. I know you are not messing with alot of hp by any means but playing with the dizzy and running lean at high rpms can cause spark knock and iirc you engine does not have a knock sensor on it.
After I get a 7730 is there anything that needs to be done b4 I can hook it up?
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Old Jun 6, 2016 | 03:58 PM
  #12  
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From: Northwest Ohio
Car: 1991 Camaro RS
Engine: Lq4 6.0 SBE s485 turbo E85
Transmission: Fsi th400 stage 4. TSI 5500 st
Axle/Gears: Strange S60 4:10s
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Well you have to do quite a bit of wiring for the swap you also have to get a map sensor but then you would also need some tuning equipment so that you can tune the car.

It chip burner aldl cable.. exc

Last edited by fasteddi; Jun 6, 2016 at 04:03 PM.
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Old Jun 6, 2016 | 09:09 PM
  #13  
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by fasteddi
Well you have to do quite a bit of wiring for the swap you also have to get a map sensor but then you would also need some tuning equipment so that you can tune the car.

It chip burner aldl cable.. exc
Will the MAP sensor go in place of the MAF sensor or does it install in a different location
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Old Jun 6, 2016 | 10:16 PM
  #14  
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Car: 1973 Datsun 240Z/ 1985 S-15 Jimmy
Engine: Turbo LX9/To be decided
Transmission: 5-speed/T-5
Axle/Gears: R200 3.90/7.5" 3.73
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

It installs in a different location and connects differently.

Start looking up wiring diagrams and the parts associated with each system so you can get an idea of the changes needed. Also I believe there's a write up some where on this site about the swap.
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Old Jun 14, 2016 | 05:59 PM
  #15  
Wafflestomp's Avatar
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From: Gaylord, MI
Car: 1987 Camaro, 1984 Camaro Berlinetta
Engine: cammed 2.8, turbo 3.1 hybrid
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.42 one tire fire
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Okay so i just got tuner pro but i need a bin file for a $3a since i have a '7302 ecm i also need a a XDF and ADX file so i can get tuner pro to work :P
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Old Jun 15, 2016 | 11:21 AM
  #16  
fasteddi's Avatar
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From: Northwest Ohio
Car: 1991 Camaro RS
Engine: Lq4 6.0 SBE s485 turbo E85
Transmission: Fsi th400 stage 4. TSI 5500 st
Axle/Gears: Strange S60 4:10s
Re: Cam swap now runs rich

Originally Posted by Wafflestomp
Okay so i just got tuner pro but i need a bin file for a $3a since i have a '7302 ecm i also need a a XDF and ADX file so i can get tuner pro to work :P

Tuner pros website has some files to download and so does gearhead-efi.com look in the obd1 thead area there. Tons of them on that site!
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