I have seen several references to MiniRam, and I just wanted to know what it was. Stock or aftermarket? How does it compare to a '90 - '92 TPI stock intake, if that's not what it is? What are the most common upgrades for the stock TPI mentioned above, like StealthRam? Just random info is appreciated. Thanks guys...

 

www.tpis.com click on their catalog and you'll find it.

 

It is THE hot FI setup, for horizontal-draft-TB applications. Capable of probably 100-150 more HP than the Stealth Ram. THe LT1 manifold is similar; except the LT1's runners are smaller and longer.

 

How eaasily can a stock LT1 intake be swapped in where a 1992 TPI was? I just need to know if they are smiliar or totally different beasts.

 

Vhat ees dees 'SEARCH' you speak ov?

 

Somewhat different.... just a few minor details... like, water passages, a hole for a distributor, stuff like that. It'll bolt right up, your car will just be kind of slow though. Only however fast you can push it.

People mod them to work on Gen 1 SBCs. Cut the EGR off and weld up a plate to cover the back of the plenum, drill a dist hole, etc. But it's not exactly a trivial mod, even when you buy one already done. It should probably be thought of as one of those "If you have to ask, you're not ready for it yet" type of things.

 

I for the most part came to that conclusion, but these days, you never know until you ask. With Chevy, I have never ventured outside of carbed engines. I have somewhat limited, and self inflicted knowledge of only the pre-1987 350. Built several, one for my Vette, and a few others for friends. The engine I'm working on now is TPI, I'm skipping TBI, and everything I know now, or will know, is from asking stupid questions. I know I seem like the annoying new guy here, but in the last few days I have learned volumes by reading up on problems and solutions for the 3rd Gen motors. So far I do not feel I have dug myself in too deep. I'm on schedule to finish the motor within the month at a minimum dollar amount. The true challenge will be installing my motor and trans, getting a chip burned right, and driving the crap out of it. Thanks for all the input.

 

Ever heard of holley stealth ram?

 

No I have not heard much more than just the name of StealthRam. I admit I'm curious what it is...I think I even posted that in the original topic thread. I wanted to know what all the aftermarket versions of intakes there were...MINI, Stealth...and a few others I heard mentioned. It sounds expensive though...

 

The Stealth Ram is probably the best bang-for-the-buck replacement for the stock TPI. Somewhere in the neighborhood of $600 for the whole swap including the intake itself, fuel rails, regulator, assorted hoses and fittings to connect to the stock fuel lines, and gaskets. I just bought one and am in the process of installing it. It is a pretty straightforward swap. I would definitely recommend a Stealth Ram.

 

The Stealth Ram is an old dual 4-barrel intake that Holley had created some years ago for street rods (as opposed to a "performance" app, it was made strictly for looks), called the "Street Ram". It originally came with a pair of small "plenums" that each held a carb. It didn't do very well in the marketplace; they didn't chrome it, so the street-rodders didn't bite on it, and the runners were too small for it to make as much power as a single 4-barrel on a single-plane intake let alone making more, so racers weren't interested either. It died. Then I guess somebody at Holley must have been looking at old drawings and realized that they could dust off the same intake casting except add injector bungs, and make a new plenum for a horizontal-draft TB, and it would be applicable to FI.

It flows about 425-450 HP of air, tops. It's real easy to get 400 HP with it. Which, compared to TPI which is extremely difficult to get much past 325 HP, it's a HUGE step up. If you look at the runners it's pretty easy to see what its flow limits are. They're long and narrow, especially at the top; they start out small, REAL small, and "grow" as they approach the head. Which was one of its performance handicaps with a carb; but it's not an issue in a dry-flow FI setup.

It's a helluvalot better than TPI, as far as how much power it can make; but NOWHERE CLOSE to a truly high-performance setup such as the MiniRam or the Accel ProRam. (lots of "ramming" going on these days it seems) But, it all depends on what you're looking for; not everybody needs, or wants, a motor that will do 500-550 HP. None of those are emissions-legal, strictly speaking, though; the only totally emissions-legal replacement for TPI is the SuperRam (there you go, some more "ram" action!). But that thing has got to be the biggest PITA to work on and maintain, of anything ever built; I personally wouldn't use it on anything I had to drive and keep running. That thing is for people with another car to daily-drive who just want a toy, and have enough money to pay somebody else to deal with the headaches.

The pic I posted is some stuff in my garage, that some one of these days will end up on a short block. I'm looking for something in the 550 HP range, at least. Obviously a Stealth Ram won't do. There will be too many cubic inches in the motor for that.

The LT1 intake is totally completely altogether different from TPI. It doesn't use the "tuned" runner principle at all. About all that it has in common with TPI is that they're both port FI, and they both came in F cars & Corvettes. The similarities end there.

 

RB83L69, man, you hit the nail right on the head. The S/R is a performer, but when you figure in the intensive labor involved any time you work on your car, I somtimes wish I never had that paticular manifold.

Ive had mine off at least a half dozen times, and with all that practice, it still is a half of a days job. I envy the guys that can make an injector change in less than an hour! I almost cried when I even thought that I might have to remove it, when I had a problem snakeing my TV cable under it.(got the harness inside the runners). Never had one before the conversion to an auto.

Maybe this spring, when I can actually datalog the car, maybe Ill find out the S/R is a "big" restriction on a 436. Then Ill have a reason to convert to a Pro-Ram style setup. Any front mounted T/B system could very well be less than optimum with a large combination. The 436 is just not an easy engine to keep fed with air.

We will soon see. I would hate spending even more money, but in this case, making the engine less of a chore to work on would be worth its weight in gold...

 

I've worked with a ProRam on a 434 (same thing as yours, just .030" over instead of .040"). It was in a truck. I can't imagine how you'd get that under the hood of one of these cars. The TB itself would be above the hood of a Firebird; and not far under the hood of a Camaro. Let alone an air cleaner. And, the throttle linkage was a MAJOR ordeal. The TB it uses is highly 700R4-hostile. And, it has no provision whatsoever for throttle cable brackets, the coil, and alot of other stuff you need but don't often think much about. It took ALOT of fabrication to get it into actual useable running condition.

It ran pretty hard though, once we sorted through all that.

The MiniRam has runners that are about 3-3½" long, and will port out to a 1206. The plenum opening will port out easily (it's almost there, one could say it's within casting tolerances of it) to a dual 58mm TB, which will support about 1000-1100 CFM. Basically it's got the same flow as a good single-plane down-draft intake such as the ProRam. That's a good 650 HP worth of air. I don't see the horizontal aspect as being a problem.

You can look at the pic, and see how easy it is to get at everything. I haven't run it yet; but, it sure does look to me like the best way to go, for one of these cars, if you want real power, i.e. competitive with a carb.

 

I had just mentioned the ProRam to be descriptive. If I should take on an intake conversion, I would probably use a 4 barrel intake converted to EFI. Lingenfelter used to sell an adapter that went to the carb flange, and allowed you to use the GM style 58mm T/B. The reason for this choice, is I have Brodix Track1s, and with the large runners on these heads, my S/R base had been been built up with aluminum, and with some Bridgeport work, and porting, the base is perfectly matched to the heads. The Edelbrock Victor would bolt right up to the heads with minimal work.

As for the hood clearance issue, my hood is a fiberglass cowl induction with lots of room underneath. Im sending your E-Mail a pic. of the car, as I still cant figure out how to post em on TGO as of yet....Tom

 

BTW, My engine was dynoed with the S/R, and a crummy ASM programmed prom, that I had left over from my 357. The S/R was not, and is still not ported. (the base is but the runners and plenum is not). Still with a terrible tune with that prom, and with an induction system that I believe is a bottleneck(wont know until I see Kpas drop) in the spring, the engine still made 570 lbs ft @3500, and 490 h.p @ 5000. The engine would not rev beyond 5000, because it was rich, and I mean" pig rich". We could not go any further at this point. At least we engine dynoed it with the EFI, and not a carb, as some do. I was hoping that with a proper tune this spring, and possibly a less restrictive intake(if it is restrictive) this combination should make more power. I was not at all unhappy with these #s, considering the situation.

 

Pass what your smokin over here

 

Those heads use a 1206 gasket; so a MiniRam would work for you, if you wanted to go that way. In fact you can order one from TPIS already CNC'd to those port dimensions. And, it looks like they CNC the whole port all the way up to the plenum (it's perfectly straight anyway), not just the gasket flange.

The ProRam is basically just exactly what you describe: a single-plane carb intake, with fuel injector bungs already cast in. It looks alot like a 3-piece "spider"intake, with the plenum & runners raised off the base, and the water outlet a separate section, also raised. I suspect you'd end up having to pay more to have something fabbed than the price of that thing, and it probably wouldn't come out as good. They sell a 4-barrel throttle body to go on top of it that looks alot like a carb with no fuel bowls.

Go ahead and send me your pics, I'd like to see them.

 

I think you miss read the thread. What RB was implying was that an engine will never achieve the "REAL" h.p. numbers that it is capable of with the HSR, as compared to the M/R. Thats the way I take it anyways. I hope you dont think that you can easily bolt on 100-150 more H.P. by a simple manifold change.

On a stout 406, or 434, a HSR will never be able to sustain the numbers that the M/R would. Ecpecially if the cylinder head and camshaft, and compression is optimum. So many people see a H.P. number, and they tend to float away from reality.

 

RB, Really, I did not know the M/R had the 1206 size runner. I remember just setting my Accel base on the engine, and I can literally fit my fingers in the runners. LOL.

I really do not anticipate such a change, Id like to play with what I have. Im starting to understand the importance of DIY Prom. I am using a S/D set up, and I KNOW there is some power to be tuned into it though. Ive been reading and re-reading alot of the threads on this. I now have Tunercat, and a PP2. I just converted to a 700R4, so this spring is gonna be a bit exciting. I plan on buying a WB02, and Diacom real soon. If my car was not getting the new trans., Im sure I would have played already.

BTW, that 4barrel style T/B that you mentioned. How much do they flow? Ive seen some nice units from Kinsler, and NOS, but they are a bit pricey. I sent the pics. Just tried to show the hood clearance. I dont have many pics. though...Tom