old man winter

just got ebl flash installed into my ecm and trying to tune my setup. not having much luck. i can get it to idle fairly well but at 1200 rpm and when i put it in gear it chugs and stalls if not hard into the throttle.
here's what i've got
355 with gmpp vortec iron heads
gmpp vortec tbi intake
tbi from my l03 with 61pph injectors from a 350 suburban
speed pro CS1013R cam 2000-4500 RPM Range, 288 intake/298 exhaust Adv Dur, @.050 214 intake/224 exhaust, Valve Lift 443 intake/465 exhaust, Lobe C/L 112
shorty headers
flowmaster cat back
idle is set at 1200
initial s/a at 6*
took everything to do with sa from vortec bin that came with ebl flash
lowest map at idle is 60 kpa and that was after bumping up idle sa to 40*
was using bin for l05 caprice as a base
in doing multiple ve learns at idle and reved up to about 2500 rpm in park every cell was -10% so i multiplied the entire table by .9, did that a few times and got blm at idle to stay at 128
as soon as it gets put into gear it falls on it's face and dies.
wondering what to do next. how much sa is too much? i had it at 45* at idle and it knocked on startup so i backed it down to 40 and brought the tables up 20* so it doesn't retard when it comes out of idle mode.
my ve tables are way down from where they started. think my bpw is right at 138 (from ebl utility)
idle also surges with iac opening and closing and timing going up and down also flashes ae light in wud and launch mode is almost always on
probably missing some info but cant think of what it could be

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Something sounds way off and I am betting its mechanical.

By no means should your vortec setup need 40* of timing at idle. For the moment set the idle timing flag and set idle timing at 25* and forget about raising it more. Set your initial timing for 10* BTDC with the timing wire disconnected. Set the Base/Initial timing value in the .BIN at 10*. Load up the Vortec .bin in compare function and copy over the spark tables. I am sure it will want a little more timing in most of the spark map, but its a good start.

My guess is you are dead lean under load with only 61# injectors. I usually increase the fuel pressure to 20-22 PSI on the 350 trucks I mess with that have had vortec head swaps. BPWC should be around ~90-100 with 61# injectors at ~20 psi. I know some people say set the BPWC and forget it, but knowing the injectors are not necessarily linear I often fudge the BPWC slightly to get the fuel map closer. If I am globally lean I will increase the number and vice versa. If you run out of room in the VE table (100% in places) I increase the BPWC to offset the VE table.

That cam should idle stable at 700 RPM with 16-18 in/hg. If you are seeing different numbers you could have mechanical issues. Valves that are adjusted too tight, spark plug wires not on the correct cylinders (5&7 are easy to get swapped), intake vacuum leak, or a cam that is not timed correctly. I have also seen a cam boxed wrong as well. The cam was much bigger than the installer believed it to be.

Your chug and die sounds like the AE is too lean. You need to take your MAP and TPS AE tables and multiply the Pulsewidth tables in all but the lowest value by about 1.5 to get it closer. The Vortec heads LOVE AE and on paper it looks like you are just drowning the engine, but I promise the engine needs it. I had a setup that lacked AE so badly at 2,000 RPM when you stepped on the accelerator the engine would DIE if you suddenly slammed the pedal and held it open. If it didn't die it would backfire out of the TBI and shoot a nice fireball.

old man winter

Thanks for the input... sometimes you just need someone with a broader perspective to make you give your head a shake... the more I think about it the more I believe that my valves are too tight... this engine was on a stand for probably 5 years waiting to be finished and I think I set the valves back then and then set them again without any oil left in the lifters years later when I put the covers on... I will set them running and make those changes to the bin and see how she goes. thanks again

lakeffect2

I'd agree that part of it may be that 40* initial idle timing. Then where does it go upon acceleration? It could be so far advanced at that point that it's near a point of coming back up the intake. Mine is set at 8* base and 22* at idle.

old man winter

Fast355 you are my hero!!! I wish I could buy you a beer. Set my valves and set idle to 700 and she purrs like a kitten. Just some fine tuning to get it tip top but a night and day improvement. Thanks again for the pointer... I was looking in entirely the wrong direction and now I'm on the right track.

old man winter

Btw my valves were about 1.5 turns too tight... that's what happens when you set them twice, 5 years apart without any oil pressure.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Glad to hear you got it running. Hope the tuning is progressing well.