GeneralIesrussi

I'm sure everyone has heard it a thousand times on here, but I think there is no one better to ask. So Here is what we have and what we know.
Stock 1988 2.8L MPFI V6 Camaro Sport coupe, Auto transmission, No AC, 255,000km
I bought it when it had been parked for about a month after it stopped running,
I was told it started to run more and more sluggish before it eventually stopped running all together.
It sat in my yard for another year after that and I am resuming that project now.
Anomalies: Previously had alarm system, long since non functional, some wire remain hidden in original harness, no known affect.
Here is what has been done to it.
(apparently coolent flush by last owner)
New:
Spark plugs
Spark plug wires
Distributor cap
rotor
ICM
MAF sensor
Starter motor
(tried different ignition coil, have new one on the way)
Drained and flushed out old gas (Old gas had fuel stabilizer thankfully)

What the car currently does:
Turn key, fuel pump primes, then cranks and does not start, no sputtering, no popping, just infinite cranking
Has known exhaust leak that shouldnt affect starting

What we tested:
Ground new spark plugs on block, can see spark
Tried starting fluid after MAF sensor, did not start
Double checked spark plug wire locations against haynes manual
Fuel pressure at fuel rail (43psi if i remember correctly)
Messing with timing, little difference

Today we tried the starting fluid and when at WOT the car did fire and ignite the starting fluid several times resulting in a few very loud bangs out the front of the throttle body on the intake (MAF hose disconnected)
and when messing with the timing, we could get it to fire in unknown cylinders at unknown times on its own fuel (or so we think), sounded so far out that it could have been way to early or way to late, however we tried many different positions and all yielded nearly the same result. Spark plugs came out wet when removed but not fouled (didnt check all)

Suspects:
1 or more broken or plugged fuel injectors
Bad Sensor or ECM messing with fuel mixture
Timing way out
Bad pickup coil (Possible suspect, erratic spark resulting in these symptoms?) (distributor shaft crown and coil looked about 3/10 condition when changing ICM) Planning on rebuilding distributor shaft

WHAT NOW?
We need to know how to set the timing Properly with Not being able to idle the car, couldnt find an article to explain how.
We have lots of spare used Sensors and all the like from running 2.8L v6's if it helps with ideas
Need help connecting all the info we have here
We would greatly appreciate what the guys and girls at thirdgen.org have to say to help get our car back on the road, we are stumped.
All ideas will be considered, Thank you

ktthecarguy

Hi there,
I would suggest first to check the timing. After messing with it, do you know what the current timing is? If you don't have a timing light, you may be able to borrow one from the chain auto parts stores, most of them have loaner tools.


Start with timing first, so you are not chasing your tail.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Get a battery charger and a timing light and set the timing to 10* BTDC while cranking. And make sure you have the firing order correct. Directions are the same as for running except you need to make sure to back off and let the starter cool after extended cranking (no longer than 15 seconds).

Have you replaced the fuel filter? That issue seems likely as when it was running it kept getting worse and worse until it died. Some filter or something was plugged and kept getting more and more plugged until fuel refused to flow at all either to or through the injectors.

Might need a new set of injectors or to send yours out to have them cleaned and the inlet filters replaced. And also check the injector resistance. Without A/C, unplug the 4-pin connector on the injector harness and check for 4 ohms resistance per bank using one pink and one non-pink wire per test. More or less ohms means bad injector or more. If there is one that is shorted, the ECM may have a driver fault as well...

GeneralIesrussi

Thank you both for the replies,
I didn't actually know you could do the timing while just cranking the car, so I am very glad to hear that, I will rent a timing light to do that.
As for the firing order I think we have it right (Ours matches the Haynes book 100%) #1 starts before the PS screw. However when I tried to follow the same book for my 1991 tpi v8 somehow my order was different than the book, Here is a picture so you guys can confirm if mine is correct.
I will be careful not to burn out the starter, and I do actually have a new fuel filter to put in it, I will also do that, I have 2 used sets of injectors for this car laying around, I also have a fuel injector tip rebuild kit on the way, it does not include the filters, so I can order the top end kit as well
I dont have A/C so, I'll just have to try and find the 4-pin pigtail for the harness and test that, Can you also test the resistance on them individually if I remove the intake? And if so, would each functional injector yield a 4 ohm resistance if functional?
As for the ECM, if it had a driver fault, would that require replacing the entire ECM unit, I have a spare from an 88' 2.8L manual sport coupe if that is compatible, would it be worth a shot to check?

Anyways thanks for all your help so far, I'll report any progress I make back here.

knightinblackar

Here's your plug layout :

FIREWALL

5 6
3 4
1 2

FRONT OF CAR



Firing order is 1,2,3,4,5,6 CLOCKWISE

Get cylinder 1 to TDC
Check the big line on the crank pulley is lined up with the 0 marker (you can't get it wrong, there's only 1 thick line, and two thin ones)
Whichever post the rotor arm is pointing at on the distributor cap is your new cylinder 1.
Simples!

mikeceli

iTrader: (2)

I agree. I bought a not running, 2.8 F Body and out of ohm range injectors caused it's no start.

GeneralIesrussi

Thanks again for the replies, I will use this method to get the rough timing set up, I still plan to rebuild the injectors and test the resistance on them (I have 8 spares, so surely they can't all be broken), and to do all the things suggested earlier as well.
Quick question: If the rotor was in between two terminals when #1 is at TDC, that would mean I would have to rotate the distributor to compensate and fix that? (And of course the new one it would be pointing at after would be #1, and so on)
Very busy with work recently, I may not get most of this work done until about half-way through the month when the parts arrive (15-17th), so please stay tuned, I will be updating when progress is made. Thanks everyone!

GeneralIesrussi

Finally got the time to do the work to the car, I rebuilt the distributor, did the base timing, cleaned, rebuilt, and tested the fuel injectors (2 didnt work at all, the rest were full of rust and gunk so i used 5 of my best ones plus 1 okay one) replaced the fuel filter and the car fired right up, now its a matter of fine tuning and improving the idle. I will rent a timing light and set it perfectly and go from there. Thanks for all the replies and help everyone!

knightinblackar

So glad it worked out for you. I've just done a full rebuild on mine, including reconditioning the injectors and one STILL isn't firing right causing a misfire. New injectors on the way. It can be the slightest thing that makes these cars sensitive!! Great news though, well done. Good feeling isn't it!