Cuco85T/A

Hey guys, I ordered a hypertech 160 thermostat from Thunderracing.com which arrived today. I've read everywhere that I should use a racing or burned chip to go along with it. Right now I don't have the money to buy a chip.
Question is: What are the bad things that can happen if I just put the thermostat in without the chip? And does anyone know where they sell racing chips for cheap? Thanx in advance!!!

MdFormula350

well just putting the thermostat in wont hurt anything beacause it will just open up earlier however your fan will still work the same as it did.

getting a chip will make the car work off the new temp better, like turn the fan on earlier to keep the temp down in traffic, change the open / closed loop, etc....

so you should be fine untill you get one made/buy one..

Danno

You just wasted your money. Anything colder than the 195 will reduce fuel economy, increase emissions and generally reduce engine efficiency. All engine management is designed to operate at a target temp of 185-200 degrees no if's, and's or but's. A lot of guy's here like a 180 and in most cases it's OK because the average temp is pretty close to what the engine want's especially in stop and go type driving. Ditto with the so called performance proms. They are a total waste of money, they don't buy any real world performance. Put the stock stat back in do a mileage test then go to a 160 stat. I'll bet you lose anywhere from 2-4mpg. I don't care what you read the engine runs best at it's target temp.

86IROCNJ

Well, they should be only $10 so he didn't waste too much money, lol. Yeah, 160* is a little overkill for a prety much stock motor. I say return it if you can, or keep it for the future if you can't! Its only $10. Get a 180*, its better than stock and not overkill. As far as the aftermarket proms being junk, try www.fastchip.com They are very reputable and compared to Hyperjunk or Jet, they make a big difference! good luck

MdFormula350

yeah a 180 would of been a better choice...

the better idea instead of a chip, would just be to install a manual switch for fan control..

Cuco85T/A

Thanx guys! The only reason I went with the 160 is because I live in miami and it's always hot down here, even in winter. I also have the fan programmed to always be on so I don't need the manual switch.

giff

I'd say go with the 180. I first put a 160 on and thought the motor ran like crap. jumped up to a 180 and it ran much better than the 160 AND the factory original 195.

spent about $3 or $4 at autozone...but that was a few years back.

giff

fireturd350

iTrader: (8)

Yeah, I also agree. 160 should be too cold. I think for the computer to go into closed loop it needs to be a little warmer than that around 180 I think. Without it in closed loop you will get pretty sucky gas mileage. I tried using a 160 once and I then switched to a 180 and it worked a lot better... I still put my 195 back in for winter just for the heater to work properly, course you won't have that problem. I would say go with a 180 and see how that works first.

Chris89GTA

iTrader: (2)

i am running a 160 with no complaints... car ran 10 time better with it.

Danno

It's all in your head.

Chris89GTA

iTrader: (2)

ok

breathment

well just cause ur running a 160* stat doesn't always mean ur gonna run at 160*

r90camarors

I run a 160* stat, and I can promise you my engine runs better AND gets the same milage as if I were running a 195* stat. Granted, I have a custom chip which is tuned to run at a cooler temperature. Without a chip, the computer may constantly try to warm your engine to operating temperature by running it rich, which will cost you performance and milage. However, I garrentee an engine with a chip tuned to 160* will run better and last longer than the same engine tuned to 180* or 195*.

Danno

This topic comes up time and time again. I personally experimented with different stats and ran fairly accurate mileage tests. With any other operating temp the mileage dropped noticeably. I was using stock fuel mapping, no prom changes. I have also discussed this topic with now 3 engineers from GM, Chrysler and Volvo. Basically in a nutshell here is what they say. Current R&D is into HOTTER running engines. They say that the engine runs better and is more efficient the hotter it is running. Material limitations and cost of the same is what prevents them from going to 250 or so for average temp. And it's not just an emission issue. When you take into account that only one third of the fuel used actually performs work thier point is made. 30mpg SUV's would be a reality if engine efficiency could be increased. I would like to have a sniff test done with your 160 and custom prom, I'll bet it won't pass. You can't say for sure what improvement a colder engine generates without calibrated testing. I can say this without hesitation that every change to prom cal in my sportbikes or messing with the temp had a negative effect on a dyno which I had access to on a regular basis. When people say it feels better, or will last longer you must have some sort of reference. When I throw a set of pipes on my bike and I think it's better almost always the dyno says different. I put in a lot of time talking to people in the business of building cars and I can only relay what they all seem to agree on, the hotter the better.

giff

danno - points well taken. "the hotter the better" for lower emissions and better fuel mileage or for better performance? IF your talking "better" for performance why the big push to cool engines down - cooler stats, hosing off intakes between runs, packing dry ice on intake etc etc - you know all the tricks. seems like people wouldn't be doing these things if they didn't work. ??

giff

r90camarors

I know I wouldn't pass emmisions, but that is do to my lack of air pump But for real, milage is easy to figure out-and I get the exact same now as when the car was stock. Granted I have a bunch of mods, but my engine also has nearly 160,000 miles on her and still gets 25 miles per gallon on the highway. I don't have a 305 TPI like Cuco, but I do have the all powerful 305 TBI These engines do not like to be run hot. ALDL data will prove that with the amount of knocks you get. You gotta remember too, that these engines are not in current R&D, but 10-to 20 years old.

Danno

Giff, it's a point well taken. I did the same dry ice thing with my 67 Chevelle way back when. The theory behind that however was to better atomize the fuel. The problem today with electronically managed engines is that altering operating temps has a counterproductive effect. I will also concur that for a specific application there may be some benefit, but the way I look at this is in overall driveability. I was out of the car thing for many years(family stuff) so in 90 when I got the iroc it was fun again-I gotta a new toy! I played around with it forever but I found that when it was stock it ran the best overall. There was a post that said it was old technology, most of all the stuff on the TG's is still in use today. Heck, GM even went back to MAF. I guess pushing 50(Dec 24-no gifts, cash please) I have seen the folly of the sooooo many so called changes for improvement. I just got a zz-4 block and dropped it in. It runs at 195, starts on the first half crank, gets 24mpg in OD and will twist the frame if called for. All I tried to put forth was that in most cases altering the operating temp with an electronically managed engine does nothing more that put one a step backwards. Dan

philoldsmobile

not sure what stat i have in, but my temp guage sits just off the 1/4 mark (1/2 is 220) and runs absolutly fine. a 100 mile motorway trip a while ago used 17 liters of fuel (near as damn it 17 quarts) so economy is ok.

I'm not sure if its realy running that cool, coz the heater blows quite warm, but not as hot as my dads Tahoe. besides, when i changed the water pump, i noticed that the temp sender is quite old, and the terminal is quite corroded. this would raise risistance in the curcuit, would this raise or lower the temp guage reading?

john8169

iTrader: (2)

I testify that a 160 thermostat will do better and engines dont like heat except for emision and economy. WE DONT CAR ABOUT ECONOMY. I am thinking 160 with holes drilled in the outer edge to flow more coolant would be optimal and that is a proven fact just ask TPIS guys they have done alot of testing on cheap ways to increase performance.
I dont know about your car but mine runs best cold, as ice. The first couple minutes I cant keep the tires planted through first gear, after a couple minutes I can stomp it and only burns at certain rpm levels. Also thats in hot or cold weather so its not all intake temp.
I dont know maybe some peoples cars that are carburated take the time to get were the jets respond better to the engine being warm, but not from computer controlled cars, they tune to engine temp and dont need heat to run properly.

Danno

For all the discussion about this subject I have yet to see any calibrated testing results. All I know is what the engineers say about the subject. Economy is only one result of increased efficiency. In electronics efficiency=Pout divided by Pin. With that in mind one would have to measure the energy given from a set amount of fuel under ideal conditions and then measure the output from the combustion process occurring in a cylinder. According to the data I have collected the opinion is about 1/3 of the available energy from the fuel is transferred to horsepower. Therein is the question, does a colder engine generate more HP? Why is it that manufacturers research is into hotter running materials? The moderator has asked us to not belabor this subject since it falls into the category of which oil to use, but I would welcome e-mail since there is a lot of differing opinion. Until I see real world data comparing different operating temps I think I'll stick this into the Harvey the Rabbit file.

91rs4life

okay I read the first 10 or so posts to this thread and I don't want to sound mean but, you guys are kind of repeating yourselves. I had a 195. car ran okay. My autozone for some reason doesn't have the 180 avail for me so I went to the 160. My car does seem to respond better due to the denser fuel mix however I did suffer a fuel loss of about 10-15 miles per tank. About a mpg. Emissions? All I can say is sometimes it depends on the operators and the test equipment come test time. However we must remember that when in open loop we run a denser fuel mix until we enter closed loop and the O2 signal is recognized. So assuming we would dump more emissions doesn't sound far-fetched at all. however, just because the therm opens at 160 doesn't mean it runs at that temp. the engine will still continue to rise in temp until the fan kicks on. I still run 220 like I did with the 195. The fan won't turn on until 240 and then it shuts off at about 200 i think. The only benefits I have truly seen from it is that I get heat faster in the winter because it is opening sooner and it does take longer to get up to 220 than it used to because the thermo is opening up earlier. Regardless of what the thermostat is doing, the ECM will only enter closed loop when the temp sending unit tells it that it has reached the proper temp. So in a way...everyone here is right to a certain extent in one aspect or another.

p.s. when i say i get better response, it is only when the temp is still below about 200. once I get up to OT, it performs like it always did.

PHAT89TA

i recently put in a 160 t-stat and a hypertech fan switch with stock chip and it runs perfect. only a couple of times it has gone a little over 220 other then that it stays around 160-180

Tom91RS

Thermo stat question:

I recently replaced the waterpump in my 91RS 305 TBI. I did replace the thermostat at the same time with one my son bought at Autozone. I honestly don't know what temp it is but it seems to take a long time to open. I live in Michigan and right now it avaerages about 15 to 20 degrees outside. My concern is the upper hose gets hot but really hard until I believe the thermostat opens. Is this normal, is the pressure in the upper hose a sign its going to blow???

fireturd350

iTrader: (8)

Easiest way to inspect an upper hose is to look for small cracks or feel the hose. If you find soft spots in the hose when you squeeze it, then you should replace it.

As for the thermostat you want one that gets fairly hot. A 160* isn't worth anything here in IL in the winter, because it doesn't let the coolant get hot enough to make the heater core warm. You end up getting a cold blast of air when it's on.

I usually swap back out to my 195* stat in the winter if I'm going to drive the car. A 180* is ok, but for the blistering cold winter days I prefer the 195*.

If you think it's a sticky stat you might as well just get a new one. Maybe try a 180*, but I would use a 195*. There shouldn't be any worries of the car overheating in those temps.

You might be noticing the hose more now because you may have a little more flow with the new water pump of the 13 year old one?

If you guys really want a cooler running car swap out the radiator. I went to an old GM type 31"x19", which I traded a fellow member/friend a pair of OEM lca's. After that the car runs a lot cooler even in 100+ degree temps. Course you could go to a Griffin, but I didn't have the 180+ bucks to spend on a radiator at the time.

Tom91RS

Hey thanks for the info but I still don't understand why the hose gets hard. Is it a sign that something is plugged. It seems to be ok once the thermostst opens, but hard and hot during warm up. Should it be soft ?

P.S.

I just recently bought this car and I also just realized my fan is hard wired, runs all the time. Could make the thermostat take longer to open ?

fireturd350

iTrader: (8)

"Check the radiator and heater hoses under the hood for cracks, blister, bulges and soft spots. These hoses rot from the inside out, so even an apparently good looking hose might be ready to burst. And there goes your nice, fresh coolant — and your trip."
http://www.savvymotoring.com/st_010715.htm

The hose will get firm when the car is on and the thermostat is shut because the water pump pulley is turning and that makes the water pump force coolant into the radiator, but the coolant can't get back through the thermostat into the intake. So it's just stuck in a spot (inside the radiator) cooling until the motor gets hot enough to open the stat then the coolant from the radiator is forced in the motor. That's why shops say pressure testing radiator caps is a good idea.

Having your fan wired on all time will cool down the coolant more. That's why we run a manual switch to cool down the temp to where we want it and then shut the fans off.

LAFireboyd

iTrader: (3)

I switched to a 160 stat in 2002, and my car ran sooooo much better! And as for the "sniff" test, you won't find them any tougher to pass than here in CA, and my car passed easily in 2003--with 230,000 miles on it! And GM had a very difficult time getting the 1987 305 TPI/5-speed combination to pass federal emissions tests back then. Maybe they should've run it cooler, lol.

So hotter is better, colder is better... Everyone has their own theory about which is right, lol. But "theory" doesn't always hold-up in the real world. Apparently, it all depends on having the "right conditions."

I'm currently "toying" with no stat, with good short-term results so far. I live in the desert, and this car responds much better at cooler temps.

Danno

Absolutely correct, what was the temp when the test was run. I'll wager it was well above 160. Here in PA they have the new enhanced emisssion test, they put the car onto somthing similiar to a dyno then run it up. By the time the car is set up, and by the way they always make sure its at full operating temp it is usually above average driving temp. Even with a 160 stat out there it will still start to go towards the same temp as a 195 stat would. If it idled for a while most likely it was close to 200 when the test was run. I have a pipe sniffer and have run tests with different temp stats, my 89 always runs richer when colder. It's not theory, it's fact that a hotter running engine will be cleaner emission wise. Thats why manufacturers are researching into materials that will take more intense heat. I don't have the extreme temps you do, but I have found for overall driveability the 195 stat works the best.

breathment

do u have a fan switch?

Kennerz

with my car tuned properly using a 180 deg themostat, my car over cooled and my mileage dropped to 11mpg. I have a steel 31x19 using water wetter. I just swapped out to the 195 and a new CTS (I'll be honest ) and new O2 and my mileage jumped at least 5+ mpg . Untuned, lean- with too much timing with the 180 thermo the car ran about 190~200 deg on the freeway( above the first quarter mark on the dash guage). the computer would work in the right heat range and my car got about 15-17 mpg. once tuned properly the combustion temps went way down and the car ran consistently @ 180 deg, and my mileage went to hell. Put in a new 195 and the mileage immediately jumped back up. my car was over coolong in traffic in the middle of summer- I know most would love to have that problem, but I'm telling you - my mileage sucked with the cool temp- and yes all my cooling equip works very well. I hate to say it- I know the logic against it, but my vote is for the 195

nsimmons

what about me? i have a mild 350 with a non cc qjet, no fuel maps here. the car has a 160 in it now, manual fan switch. Ive only run the engine about 3 hours and a 1/4 mile of driving. i also have a 180 and 195 stat i could put in. The car has to pass emissions testing, idle and 2500rpm cruise, no visual.

I'd be more concerned with mileage and emissions than optimum power output.

Want to hear something funny. You can lookup the maximum readings for your year vehicle on the local gov't's website, and the 4 and 6 cylinder maximums are higher than the v8

xlwhellraiser

iTrader: (1)

What can I say, my battle for a cooler engine has always been, and it will always be fierce.
195stat, is put there for a reason, and I always think that GM people would know better of how their machines should run and especially at what temp. But they also want us to buy a new car once in a while, ya know... ehem ...
Firebirds have been known of tipping 300000 miles with their stock set up (which does run hot), so I am not sure if we should be afraid of the heat as much.
We all know that heat is not what we are afraid of. Its the power. When you start your engine give it a little bit of time to warm up and drive it, the pick up is tremendous, than when it gets hot the pick up is dull, only good at certain rpms. So therefore we want it cooler. 180 thermo should be ideal as a first step to cool. Although it does not do much, it will circulate coolant a bit earlier. I personally would not want to change the electric fans stock turn on point. Its because in cooler days you will not be wanting performance, heat will be on your mind.
I would recomend a sucker fan that mounts on the other side of the radiator to suck air in, and its important for it to be a switch only to where you can controll it, because of the cold weather.
Also, there is a lot of good cold air right by the battery and the smog pump (fenders) where you will see many people mounting their ram air or CAI. Get some hoses and run them from there to your open element (I found that open element might be usefull for both cold and hot climates). Open element does breathe warm air, but during the winter wouldnt you want warm air? Ofcorse, but during summer you might want to use ram air from fenders to cool the sucker off.
The last suggestion would be custom made grille. Its easy to modify the front bumpers/effects for it allow air to radiator, just check under to where it would be most ideal.
Good luck

tad1214

Well since this is the post underneath the what temp thermostat i should use, ill post this here.

I am building a carbed 383, ZERO computer equipment controlling my engine. So "proper temp so the computer doesnt try to warm the engine up" doesnt apply to this. What temp thermostat is best? This is a summer only car and i am pulling my heater core. I assume a 195 wouldnt be correct. The idea of a thermostat would be good because it would create a consistant operating temperature to aid in tuning. My guess is a 160* stat because the colder the better in fuel/air charge density. I am replacing my entire cooling system.

Danno

With a carbed eng you don't have the issues with EFI systems, e.g. a computer trying to compensate to return the engine to specific parameters. The early TG ECM's were not a sophistocated as the newer PCM's in use. I would use a 170 stat, that is a nice compromise to get the engine up to temp and still have that colder engine zap.

DENN_SHAH

iTrader: (1)

this has topic has been gone over here too many times to remember.

some years back one of the oil companies did an extensive wear test on different oils at different temps. they used parts bought in bulk, each part came from the same manufacture, blocks from
one place, pistons & rings from someone else & so on. each of the parts from each company was from the same parts run. they also used oils from different companies. the motors were run under very strict lab conditions. during assembly each part was carefully measured & documented.
each motor had the same amount of run time with the same loads & RPM range put on it.
at tear down each part was again carefully measured & documented.
what was found in this test was,
1, a good quality oil from any oil company made little difference on the amount of wear, with the cheaper oils wear was faster, with the best oils wear was slower.
2, engine temp did have a major impact on wear, too cold (160 or below) or too hot ( 230 or higher) & the motor would wear out sooner.
the best wear temps they found were in the 185~220 range with 190~200 the best temps for long engine life.

other than shut down for oil & filter changes, these motors were all ran non-stop for this test.
the dirtiest oil always came from the coldest motors, the coldest motors also had the most sludge in them at tear down. too hot also produced high sludge/carbon levels inside the motor.
the one synthetic oil used showed the least amount of sludge at each temp extreme & was also the cleanest at all other temps.

variables that do make a difference on how long a motor lasts are, the type of use it gets, a taxi is not really that much of a sever duty use. you grandmother who drives her car just a few minutes every few days IS sever duty. long highway trips are not sever duty, short trips are sever duty. in a short trip the oil does not get up to temp to burn off the moisture & acids that accumulate in it, so the oil doesn't last as long as it would in long trip use.
driving under dusty conditions also falls under sever duty.


here is something to think about, keeping a clean air filter on a motor will cause the motor to wear out sooner than a slightly dirty air filter will. why?

vexter

iTrader: (3)

For four years now, I've been running a Hypercrap chip and 160deg stat/thermo switch. I live in the central valley of California and only during the hottest part of the summer does the car run above 200deg. There is a noticable difference in performance. My car runs strongest down around 160deg... it is not in my head. Further, my tags get renewed in November, when the weather is much cooler. My car NEVER runs above 160deg (during that time of year) and passes smog w/ flying colors. FYI, my car has ~ 170k on the clock... in town driving averages around 14.5mpg and highway sees about 21mpg.

While I appreciate the physics behind what the engineers have relayed to danno, clearly not all his other points are hard and fast.

Gallileo60

Hey guys, I know this is an old post, but I hope someone can help....I have a 89 305 TBI car, does the same info on the thermostats apply to the TBI, like it does the TPI cars...I want to run a lower temp stat than the stock one...Thanks for any help, or recomendations........Tom

Reid Fleming

iTrader: (2)

I'd be wondering what was wrong if I was getting 14 and 21 mpg on my car (350/A4). A 305/M5 should be getting better mileage than that. Either it's too cold or you have your A/C on all the time.

Gallileo60

Well im curious, what kinda milage should these 305/auto cars get...Mine is around 20, and I thought that was great...135k on the clock.....Any recomendations on the therm for a TBI car..170 sound right thank you...I am old school, back then the cooler the better..Hell we used to ice our motors down at the strip, so my knowlegde is out of date..thanks for any help...Tom

Reid Fleming

iTrader: (2)

I'm getting 16 and 23 on the 350. That's with the 180 thermostat.

I talked to a C4 Corvette guy with the digital dash. Said in the morning on the highway, the instant fuel economy would improve by 1.5 mpg from 160 to 180F and another 1 mpg when it got up to 195.

DBLTKE

iTrader: (1)

I'm getting around 13-15 MPG on stock 305 TPI. Today i was swapping out out the thermostat on my Auto Shop teachers jeep and she told me that a higher temperature, not lower, thermostat would cool the engine better. She mentioned that it is because when the thermostat opens at a higher temp that there is a higher different in the temperatures that it will have better heat transfer. thus cooling the engine more efficiently. Someone please chime in on this. I always believed that if you had a lower temp T-stat that it will open earlier, thus not allowing the engine to get hotter and maintain an overall lower water temp.

Gallileo60

Im not quite sure the teacher is right, but you never know......Since my last post on this thread, I have went back to the stock thermostat...I lost mileage with the 180 I put in....Now, if I have a chip burnt for my motor, and put a cooler therm in, will I then get better milage, and power???? Thanks guys, Tom

Grim Reaper

I've tested ALL combos and found no difference in ANY (with the proper tuning in the eprom). The biggest difference is the heater temperature in the winter.

Yes, I had my car ran for emissions testing and fuel economy, and with proper tuning I could make ALL work equally well. BTW, the temperature the engine goes into closed loop (and locks the automatic transmission) is lower than 160*F and can be changed IF NEEDED. It's another myth that the engine won't go into closed loop with a 160* Tstat.

I ultimately settled on a 180*F as I found it the best combo for performance & comfort (cold weather). And, my gas mileage never suffered from any any of this.

One caveat, I always tuned my own eprom and had tight control on the fans "on/off" temps to keep the engine temperature a constant temperature (the largest factor in wear btw...an engine runnning at constant temps in a normal operating range will last longer than an engine that is constantly heating up and cooling down).

Bottom line, you can make ANY temp of tstat work, and work well. But you will need to properly tune the eprom to make them work optimally. And the "off-the-shelf" eproms don't do it well.

If you are not prepared to get into tuning your own eprom, it is best to avoid the 160* Tstat as the fuel & spark tables are not properly setup in ANY of the "off-the-shelf" eproms to use the 160* optimally without making fuel economy or emissions suffer.

Remember, these cars are already setup PIG RICH from the factory as they are. That is why a lot of guys can do minor mods without actually having to get an eprom burned...they are already too rich. A 160* tstat without the proper tuning just runs far too rich.

It is my belief that the idea of running a 160* Tstat came out of the 1980s before people knew how to properly tune the eprom. Guys would start to modify their engine and find them too lean. So they came up with a bunch of "mechanical tricks" to force the engine to run richer, such as Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulators, relocating the MAT sensor to run in front of the TB and running cooler T-stats.

Gallileo60

Hey Grim, you seem to know your stuff....How would a newbie to chips get started??? Im not sure if there was some other factor in play with my car, but It stayed very cool according to the gauge with the 180 therm installed, my milage did seem to suffer, but as I said, I have never messed with the eprom...(Dont mind tearing into the engine, but this computer stuff confuses me)..Would like to go back to the 180 for the engines sake..Thanks for any thoughts on this subject......Tom

ohiotemplar

Hey guys! I'm brand new to camaros. I just bought my brothers 92 RS of him. IT has 94,000 miles on it. I have several questions - alot actually - but I'm sure you'll appreciate me keeping them in thier appropriate threads. I love my car and I want it to last a loooong time. I have other cars too, so I pretty much just take the RS to cruise-ins or use it to take my wife on dates on the rare occasion we can find a babysitter. I think the best way to keep the car running longer is to use the 160 deg hypertech. Think about the physics - all of that plastic and lubricant under the hood. no one can honestly believe that it BETTER if it bakes at a higher temp. Nothing will last as long, it's simple physics. My heat guage (3.1 btw) - during in-town driving stays just before the first of the three red marks. that's nearly over heating! I can't have that! For some reason the temp guage goes right back to the middle if I use my air or heat. Weird huh? Anyway, I don't care about mileage, I just want the car to last. I don't believe it will actually run at 160 deg, but if it cools down even a little that would be nice. The royal purple should last longer too because it won't succumb so quickly to thermal breakdown (loosing viscosity) - If anyone can tell me other ways to keep it cool let me know - I've built up alot of ricers before getting this car and I'm always amazed at the heat I get when I open the hood on the RS.

thomas1976

ohiotemplar, ricers warm up much faster then thirdgens the engines are just smaller and with that a smaller heating surface.
Im running a 180° thermostat and a 210/200° on/of fan switch thermostate.
Id did not go to radical because by driving over 40mph this cars dont need any extra cooling the wind does the job (most of the time the thermostat is closed aniway). Only in slow traffic and mountain roads when the cooling is really needed I found that driving with 220° and having the fan not turning was a little extreme.
I also tried a 180° combined with 195/185° on/of fan switch but the fan never turned off once it turned on.
A little cooler does not affect the chip.

ohiotemplar

do you happen to know the part number of the fan switch? (stock temp) - I tried looking for a fan switch on autozone.com and couldn't find one. Is that what it's called? Anyhoo, my fan takes too long to turn on and my car is over-heating during in-town driving.

upincomin

Ok, so I checked this post looking for ways to lower my car's temp. Eventually, I plan to go to a 350, but for now I have the stock 305 TBI. My problem is living in hawaii it never drops below 76* here, and in traffic my car over-heats so bad. Can you imagine, Honalulu has close to 2 million people.. so during rush-hour, it's only inches forward at a time. I literally watch the temp guage raise. So I stay in the far right lane so I can pull over at anytime. When my car was over-heating back home in the mainland, I got out of town on a long stretch and I went 100 mph. Popped it in neutral, and watched it drop just as fast as it raised. It sucks, on cold days, that car RIPS, but as soon as I get caught in traffic on a slightly warm day, it over heats to the point where, when you pop the hood the radiator caps its teetering, about to pop off.. the overflow tank is bulging like it wants to explode, it's also hissing, letting steam out of it. So I mean, I can see that this is a pretty legit question he asked. As for me, I could care less that I'm getting 3-4 miles less to the gallon, I drive a gas hog, it's bound to happen, but I live on an Island so it's all good. How about, instead of complaining that we're not being efficient enough for todays "import status gas savers", and think of a way to keep us running cooler while stuck in traffic. The newer camaro's dont over heat.. Why are ours? I understand maybe a 160* stat might not be the answer.. but what alternatives to we have to keeping our cars below the red line? Sorry if I sound a little mad, but I read like 20 posts, and none of them were going in the direction of the orignal question. This car has been in my family for 8 years.. and never have I, nor my mom found anyone with any ideas to allow us to run these cars anytime we want. I get paid well so money for gas is NO issue.. thank you ahead of time for all your future help.
-Dow aka (Jow Jow)

Gallileo60

Well im back to my 160 therm, with a TBI chip, and use some water wetter, with fan running full time....I NEVER OVERHEAT.....Run very strong.....

scooter500

iTrader: (1)

lots of good info in this post. But B4 I got stuck in traffic every now then summer & winter & have had to turn the car off. after reading this post I now know the optimum burning temp, but just can't see trying to keep my car at a perfect 195 degrees, it'll never happen, especially w/ 1 thrilling fan. So while back I put a Hypertech fan switch in (200 on 185 off) and a basic 182 thermostat from AZ. The car has thankfully cooled but millage sank no matter how gentle the toe on the go. BUT I've noticed that getting up to speed, especially when engine is cold in AM, basically gets at least the same MPG if not better. After reading this post I am going to keep a heavier foot to cruise at speed limit, seems to heat the engine better. I have a 3-wire o2 sensor on order from EFI Conector & hope that will make the difference w/ my stock ccc carb & get the milage back up... any thoughts?