jb1289610

I wanna put a VERY small blower on my 84 z28. The reason for a small one is because I don't want it to stick through the hood AT ALL. I have a wide 3 inch cowl hood. Motor is a carbureted 350 (soon to be a carbbed 327). What blowers will fit?

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Even a small (roots-type) blower will require a 4" cowl to fit under the hood. I doubt it would fit under a 3" - with any kind of air cleaner on it at least....

A sure bet if you're concerned about hood clearance is to run a centrifugal blower, like a Vortec, or Procharger....

EDIT: And why are you switching to a 327?? I'll take more cubes any day of the week...

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Just a guess, but maybe his heads & cam call for a shorter stroke, higher RPM application...

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Maybe...but if that's the type of heads/cam combo he has, it may not be blower friendly anyway..those normally call for higher compressions also...

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

a very small blower on a very small eng. = a 1968 396 bbc (lack luster) eng..
would start off with 100 cubes more min.. Just me.

stephennmm

iTrader: (1)

a 142/144 can fit a small cowl hood but you need a drop style air filter or a carb hat could save some room

jb1289610

I have a 3 inch cowl hood. And the cowl is wide too. Would it fit under that? Or would I need a 4 inch one

jb1289610

Is there a blower that's even lower profile out there? The 144 and 142 blowers seem kinda small but still are kinda big. There's gotta be something smaller out there.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

vortech s-trim.

jb1289610

sorry diggler. im lookin for a twin screw supercharger. not so much a cyntrifical one.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

are you just wanting a blower for looks? smaller than a 142 puts you somewhere around a stock eaton off of a lightning/cobra or something maybe? lots of fabrication going that route, though.

11ellswray

iTrader: (1)

If you want it under the hood i would say Procharger, i know you don't want to go that route but I don't see another way. Unless you want to build your own k member and front suspension in an attempt to lower the motor? I don't see a lot of options.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

i ran a 144 series blower under my hood with a drop base air cleaner and a 2.5" air filter....and it all fit under my 3" cowl hood with 1/2" to spare.......you can do it if i can

Kingtal0n

same here, I had a 144 B&M roots blower under a 2" cowl using the right drop base air cleaner. This setup works but...

... A centrifugal supercharger is recommended over any other type of power adder, except turbocharger. Why? Because the technology is better for one. But that aside, it will fit under an OEM hood. that aside, you will produce more power, and have more potential, regardless of engine combination (cam heads etc...) as the centrifugal types tend to be more efficient near the "upper range" of flow.

Edit:
heres pictures of the cowl and blower... I dont know where the pic is with the hood open showing the blower, but it is on this board somewhere also...

jb1289610

alright. is there a stock factory blower out there that has a place for the carb that i could use? i dont care about the size at all. not looking for a 500hp beast. just a quick street car

jb1289610

i saw on yahoo that a guy took a chrvy 3800 blower and customized it for a buick v8. i was looking at the ford 3.8 blowers and they seem like the intake part could be unbolted to fit s carb. or maybe i am looking at it wrong. making an intake for it is no trouble. got a guy for that. anybody have any input on this?

Fallen2603

That square portion your talking about on the Ford M90 is actually the outlet of the supercharger. The inlet is on the back. Yes, the outlet comes out the "top" on the Thunderbird SuperCoupe, goes to an intercooler, and then wraps around the back of then engine to the intake manifold just under the supercharger inlet. A weird system, but it works.

jb1289610

well dang. any other ones that could work then?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Wont find a factory blower for sbc.

Fallen2603

Are you open to the idea of doing a "remote-mount" supercharger? A member named "Pocket" did that. You'd still be able to use the Ford Thunderbird SuperCoupe M90.

jb1289610

what is a remote mount supercharger? how does that work?

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Who is "recommending" a centrifugal blower?!? For the street??....for the drag strip??...which is "better" really depends on where you're using it at.

Just think about it...if centrifugal blowers were the "economical" answer to everything except for turbos, why in the world would Ford (and the ZL1 Camaros) use roots type blowers.....according to your statement, it doesn't make sense on any standpoint. The blower I have only uses 1/3 of a HP while cruising on the highway at 70 MPH....try that with a centrifugal blower. There's much better and more efficient roots blowers than the old Weiand 142/144 lobe-type out there. But -I can believe better efficiency with a turbo....

Just read up on where the real power bands are for each type of blower, and you'll find some are much better suited for street driving (under 5500 rpm's), others for the drag strip (2k and up rpm's).

Some things I totally agree with....centrif. and turbos can fit under hoods better, have potential for higher boost levels and power (in the upper rpm ranges). -BUT- "regardless of engine combination"!?!? REALLY??

That pic above is most likely a 4" cowl hood.. You're just not gonna fit any roots blower in a Thirdgen Camaro under any 2" cowl hood. Not with a carb on top. Try it...I did.

Don't get me wrong, I love turbos and centrifugal blowers. But I'd much rather have my roots blower for daily street driving any day of the week. On the drag strip...different story.

Fallen2603

Basically, for a "remote-mount" supercharger, you'd have the supercharger mounted to the engine. Say on top of the valve-cover. This way, you could also run an air-to-air intercooler between the blower and the intake manifold, which would help quite a bit.

Here's that thread I was talking about:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/ltx-...-not-left.html

It's on an LSx in this thread, but the principle would still be the same for you. It would probably be a lot easier to mount the supercharger to the valve-cover on a SBC since you don't have COP ignition.

11ellswray

iTrader: (1)

see and thats another advantage of a centripetal charger, you have the ability to add a intercooler, even if you did remote mount a roots type i doubt you could fit a intercooler that would be as good as the intercooler on a centripetal system.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

You don't need one with a roots blower, just run E85 when you want to up the boost...

11ellswray

iTrader: (1)

Thats true, on the same note wouldn't an E85 car benifit from a intercooler as well?

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

You'll hear lots of guys say that, however I have seen plenty of engines running methanol and lower air temps, yet still detonate even with IC's. Personally, I have never seen an engine detonate with E85 yet, I just haven't. I'm actually in the midst of setting up my own to run both premium and E85 and switch on the fly, I am that convinced about it...

11ellswray

iTrader: (1)

That sounds like a pretty BADASS setup, and I have no real expeirence with E85, I do know that it is a cleaner cooler fuel but I didnt know it would affect your intake temps enough to make a IC not worth it....

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

You probably didnt push it hard enough e85 will detonate but by then its usually too late...motor goes or heads lift lol lots of pressure and heat in chamber to get the alcohol to detonate

Its insurance to add intecooler even on e85. Certainly wont hurt

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

30-psi S2 Buick, it just won't detonate, even with 110 air temps...

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

There is a radical in pump gas, E85 burns much cooler...

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

110 is high? I have seen 130's on my pump gas car at only 12 psi and havent detonated yet with a good bit of timing lol. I need meth but installed nitrous instead

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

You know what's really crazy, the guys on the Buick boards that are running hot air turbo's will remove the IC that they installed on their own, will then have to bring the wastage rod out quite a few full turns because they picked up so much spool time from the loss of the restrictive IC, convert to E85, and then set the boost to 28-psi. Always thought E85 was a fad, but it's definitely the way to go after countless success stories...

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Certainly isnt a fad. Def works. 816 whp on heads cam ls2 stock bottom end on only 11 psi . On a very stingy mustang dyno in out area. Best i have seen. A 496 big block made 800 on 10 psi there

Kingtal0n

ok, you got me, you are absolutely right, I completely forgot about the more efficient versions of positive displacement technology available. The application matters above all else, of course, and some applications such as towing are more in favor of positive displacement style power adders. Good catch of an oversight on my behalf.

Allow me re-phrase, I would recommend that everybody go turbocharger and forget this blower nonsense

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

im old school on the nexed Time I Redue My car, it's
427 chevy 6/71 roots with EFI ontop! note the GM TPS,lower left.(others are out back of the Hat!

every body likes Fast cars, But when they are Fast and look Killer! thats a home run!

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Kingtal0n - I wasn't trying to bash at all....to me, roots blower vs. Centrifugals and turbos are different animals and give you max power in different power bands. Even though I bet my small semi-helix blower is no sloutch on the strip, it's gonna run outta boost after 5500 rpm's, where a centrifugal will still shine. Turbos would be simular.

If I could actually get good traction and not blow the tires off, I "should" do great...at least half track....that's IF...

I see we think a lot alike!! I'd have a blast with that setup....I bet it ain't cheap though.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

i like the Magnuson, but look at the price difference between that and a vortech s-trim kit. its pretty hard to beat an s-trim for its power per dollar, ease of installation, overall price, and amount of power that can be made with it. i am working on a '94 z28 right now that had an s-trm on it awhile back. made mid 500's rwhp without much tinkering. drove good on the street and hauled ***. stock hood, still had the maf and all that.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

I can get a E-Force blower WITH a 800 cfm carb brand new for 2800 bucks new....these blowers are virtually identical to the Magnuson MP122H like I have. Ease of installation? Doesn't get any easier than a roots blower if you've ever changed an intake manifold and a carb before.

-Or you can get a Vortech S-trim for 3200 without a carb. But - you can put the Vortech on a TPI engine, and buy different injectors, tuning etc...at least that's what it'll take to make 500 rwhp. Want to make it easier and go carb with a Vortec? Either you'll build your own on the cheap, or go aftermarket and pay at LEAST 600 for one.

So we could debate all day so far as "power per dollar"...I just thought it odd to say the centrifugals are "recommended"...that's all. Kingtal0n knows his stuff...I have no doubt.

My point isn't whether one is "better" then the other. Both can a lot of power, and as I already said - a centrifugal has the potential to make more in the mid-to-upper rpm range if set up right.

I'd love to have a Procharged LSX one of these days...and it's most likely a future project of mine, to tear up the 1/4 mile with. IMO (and many others) -torque rules on the street, and I get 495 ft lbs of it to the rear wheels at 3100 rpm's. That's where the "fun factor" comes in with the little roots blowers - instant power when you mash the throttle, street light to street light...that's all I'm saying.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

To get this thread back on topic...to the OP...you're not gonna get any roots blower I know of under a stock thirdgen hood. From my experience, you'll need a 4" cowl and a low profile drop base air cleaner, and it'll just fit.

They make neat blowers for newer Camaro's that do fit under stockish hoods
(5th gens ZL1)...etc..so just wait for a totalled ZL1 at the boneyard....

Otherwise, you're gonna need a centrifugal blower or turbo if you want a sleeper look...no getting around it that I know of if you want boost...

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

wow, im outta the loop. last time i looked at a magneson those kits were $5k+.
i know what your saying, and i agree. but i will say the car im working on now would blister its 325/50/15 drag radials if you hit it from a redlight on the street with the s-trim. had around a 3500 stall converter in a th400. torque was pretty instant in that thing too.
i think a roots would shine on a truck towing at 2200rpms or cruising in the mountains in overdrive at low rpms. would work great.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

5K?!? Nahhh...more like this:
http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/...oductId=902536
Again, virtually the same as mine with the Edelcrock name tag. Long story short, that's what mine is, except when my drive bearing went out Edelcrock's warranty department screwed me over, so Magnuson took care of me.
-feel free to look at the dyno chart too. Guess I should've put the thing on a tow truck....

EDIT: They do sell kits in that price range which are model specific and intercooled...I'd love to get one for my Challenger actually. But they don't make one for it...yet.

stephennmm

iTrader: (1)

You can fit a 142/144 under a 3inch cowl. My brother had one of the ss style hoodscoops on a stock hood with a 142 b&m blower. Drop style aikrfilter is the key. Yes that s trim had power at that point but thats with a 3500 stall which sucks for a daily driver or street car with a small cam and no to a very small stall. I like roots for the street for low end grunt with driveability but for higher rpm power i like my turbos.