klu-less

i just purchased an 86 IROC and i am dissapointed in the "roughness" of the ride. i used to dive a 93 300zx and there is a very big difference. i understand that they have two diff. type of suspension setups too. anyway, i bought some KYB struts/shocks for starters and would like to have my front end rebuilt but, not sure what to get......any suggestions? i am looking for the smoothest ride possible without breaking me financially, thanks.

92 zzz28

Well, for the best ride possible go with stock type rubber bushings instead of the poly bushings. In the front end, the bushings that may need to be replaced are the control arms, only lowers on our cars. The steering linkage may be worn, but that wouldn't lead to a "harsh" ride. The poly ones tend be be harder and that leads to a firmer ride which you may not want. Does the car have the stock springs on it or have they been changed? Maybe if someone did something stupid before you bought it then that could lead to a harshness. When I bought my Z in stock condition with 90,000+ on it, I thought the ride quaility was pretty good considering. Even now with aggressive shocks/struts, lowered, and poly bushings and Heim joints here and there, I still think it rides very nicely. Firm, but I wouldn't say harsh.

klu-less

kewl..............thanks. so far i have found a basic (non poly) front end kit: 2 Upper Ball Joints 2 Lower Ball Joints 4 Upper Inner Control Arm Bushings 2 or 4 Lower Inner Control Arm Bushings 2 Strut Rod Bushings (if required) 2 Outer Tie Rod Ends 2 Stabilizer Links 2 Sway Bar Bushings (for most models) Control Arm Bumpers (for most models) $159.00

or the SUPER: 2 Upper Ball Joints, 2 Lower Ball Joints, 4 Upper Inner Control Arm Bushings, 2 or 4 Lower Inner Control Arm Bushings,2 Strut Rod Bushings (if required), 2 Upper Inner Shafts
2 Outer Tie Rod Ends, 2 Inner Tie Rod Ends, 2 Tie Rod Adjusting Sleeves, 1 Idler Arm, 2 Stabilizer Links, 2 Sway Bar Bushings (for most models), Control Arm Bumpers (for most models) for $309.00

are these prices reasonable.......do i really NEED all this stuff or what can i do without?

thanks for your advice......

Dewey316

our cars do not have upper ball joints.

klu-less

Doh! i see i have A LOT to learn about my IROC.....thanks!

92 zzz28

Here's your shoping list if you want to rebuild the front end. I am not saying to do it, but this is what you would need.

Lower control arm bushings 4 (no uppers on this car!)
Lower ball joints 2(no uppers on this car!)
Inner tie rods 2
Outer tie rods 2
Center link 1(also refered to as a Drag link)
Idler arm 1
Sway bar bushings 2
Sway bar endlinks 2
Tie rod adjusting sleeves 2(recommend heavy duty pieces offered by aftermarket companies)
Struts 2(shocks on rear)
Strut plates 2(the bearings car wear out!)
Springs 2(front only obviously, also only rec. if car has worn springs on currently, ie, sagging, high mileage) You don't have to do springs, but adding new springs, even stock type units, really makes the car feel different.

As I said you shouldn't just go crazy and buy eveything!! Figure out what's wrong and fix it. If you problem is just harsh ride, you may not want to do the steering linkage. I may have forgotten something so others will have to add to the list.

BTW, try to ride in other people's 3rd gens. You may find that what you consider to be a "rough" ride is just the way these are. Especially an IROC or a Z-28. Some had more aggressive suspensions than the RS or V-6 models so that could just be the way your car is. Good luck to ya...

meridius

the ride of our cars is pretty rough concidering they are performance cars. I know the ones with the performance suspension package ride even rougher yet. You may want to check into lowering your spring rate with a different set of springs if your just after a nice ride.

klu-less

i am hoping the shocks/struts (KYB) help out cause its more of a rattling, somethings loose feeling that i get when i cruise on a semi bumpy road. i just havent had time to check out the front end yet......too much OT right now. thanks guys!

SpeedCat86

Klu-less, I can relate. I didn't have my Z (a '90) long enough to start getting involved with mods, but there is a marked difference between a 300ZX and an IROC/WS6.
First off, my TransAm weighed about 1000 lbs more than my Z (2seater Non-Turbo), so it thumps in to bumps harder than the Z, which felt like it was just skimming off of them.
Second, because of the unique F-body suspension, especiallly the fronts, they use pretty massive (~550 lb) springs, so good struts are a must. If the previous owner installed lowering springs, they're gonna be even heavier than the stockers, as much as 700 in/lb.
Good Struts are a must on these cars' suspensions. KYB's aren't bad. Billstein seems to be the best. Pricey, but worth it from what i've heard.

I'd take a look (or have a trusted shop look) at the bushings that are already on the front end. They may still be in good shape, and not need replacing, depending on your car's milage / general condition.


I would reccomend beefing up the chassis, though. ThirdGens are notoriously flexy unibodies, and when you toss in the super-stiff suspensions, you get lots of shakes and rattles.
You've got an IROC, so you've probably got a 'WonderBar' which is a tubular brace that GM fitted across the front swaybar mounts. If you dont have one, they are pretty inexpensive, and you can get them from a number of vendors, like Spohn, T.D.S, and Global West. I would also reccomend a Strut Tower Brace, preferably a three-point brace, like the Edelbrock or BMR models. these will tie the tops of the struts together, and brace them off of the firewall. While stiffening the chassis sounds counter to smoothing the ride, it will actually help. Stiffening the chassis will make the suspension carry more of the load in soaking up bumps.

Final note. The Z was (is) a light, tight quick little car. If it was an airplane, it'd be an F-16. The IROC on the other hand, is an F-4 Phantom, a big, heavy powerful bruiser of a car. They'll both get the job done, but the go at it from different directions.

little P

Good info here ! Does anyone have a pic with alot of these front end parts labeled ?

Lucid

iTrader: (4)

You know i hate bumps when i drive my car too, it had the Z28 suspension setup which was really floppy on the front end, and caused nose dive during braking. In 2000 i put in the IROC springs in the front which really stiffened it up a lot, and which also raised the front end as well. The car bumps all around when i hit bumps, i think it has a lot to do with the unibody design, and over the years the floorpan gets twisty and weakened. I'm going to get a wonderbar for my car as well, which will hopefully help out on turns. My father's IROC doesn't nearly bounce all around as much, and soaks up bumps really well. My friends Stealth has a great frame design, and handles bumps and curves very well. The KYB shocks and struts really helped out, they absorb input so much better than cheaper stuff. I noticed that when i hit junky sections of the road that load the wheels differently, the car starts to jumble.... do i need to get some subframe connectors? Anyone put subframe connectors on and notice a big difference? When i boxed the panhard rod, i noticed a more responsive rear end that tended to control fishtails a heck of a lot better, so there are definite flaws in chevy trying to save money on some parts. I think the IROC is more like a F-14 than the F-4 phantom ....The F-18 is quicker than the F-16

92 zzz28

Yes you need SFC, all 3rd gens, actually all unibody cars, need subframe connectors.

Yes, most people feel a big difference from adding SFC. They made my car feel like a different car.

The stock panhard and rear LCA are just cheap metal stampings. Boxing them is a good inexpensive method to lessen the twisting and flexing that the stock pieces are prone to. If you box or replace your LCAs you will notice a big difference too.

Lucid

iTrader: (4)

MR 92 zzz28 you are a wealth of knowledge
I actually boxed the panhard rod just for fun and to see if there really would be a difference in the axle control. The welder did such a good job i'm going to the junkyard and pull some LCA's tomorrow so i can have him do those too. The stock panhard was $20 and the guy put square steel tubing inside and then covered it with flat steel for $45. Finding a wonderbar is a little more difficult than i thought it would be.

Thanks for the advice

92 zzz28

YOu should be able to get a wonderbar from Spohn. He makes top of the line parts. Not to expensive either.

klu-less

hey guys, just wanted to let yall know i got a pretty sweet deal off e-bay on the entire set of shocks/struts for my 86 IROC this past week. i paid a total of $159.99 for the parts and shipping combined! no BS.....here's the link to their store. all i did was type in "camaro KYB struts" good luck and thanks once again to all...........

http://stores.ebay.com/Kuruma-Motori...erLinksQQtZkm?

Lucid

iTrader: (4)

92 zzz28
You were right, those lower control arms really should have come boxed from the factory. I had the welder stick some square tubing inside the control arms, spot weld it and then cover it with steel with full length beads. I noticed my endlink bushings were bad on the rear sway bar too, so i redid those as well. The car is amazingly a whole lot more stable on turns, and it pushes the wheels down on acceleration, so the car launches instead of wasting time spinning the tires.

porkyzilla

iTrader: (1)

although i do love a rough ride its a sports car not a bmw

92 zzz28

Ain't physics wonderful!!!

klu-less

the KYB struts/shocks made a HUGE difference....i am happy now (except now i have a crooked rim!)