TierAngst

If you've been following along with my previous posts you'll have noticed me mention being able to get a bunch of LT1 stuff for cheap. I was thinking this morning I may not go with the 383 crate motor and just stick in an LT1 block and do some LE2 Heads/cam. Would still be using TBI for this since they now have carb manifolds for the LT1s, so I wouldn't have to worry about getting different wiring. It'd be as easy as bolting the engine in which happens to use the same mounts, and switching the cooling system for reverse flow. So the question is, should I go with a LT1/TBI setup or should I do a few minor mods like I had planned and save up for a 383 w/ roots blower? The LT1 setup I'd go with would have a bit less power than the blown stroker but it'd be cheaper and I'd go faster sooner, then again it doesn't have the same wow factor as opening the hood to a blower. What do you all think?

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Why not just use something like the ZZ383? Why throw the more complicated LT1-TBI swap in. Your best bet is to stick with the conventional Gen1 SBC. If you add a pair of GM FastBurn heads you have roughly a LT1.

TierAngst

Won't do the ZZ383 because it would be just like me saving up for the other crate motor, it costs a lot. An LT1 motor will cost about 1000-2000 depending on miles, for the whole swap I figure 2500 for the engine and all other parts needed including install (supposing I find an engine on the cheaper end of the spectrum). Sure I'll still have to save a bit but this is a lot less than $4,680.00 I'd pay for a zz383.

Won't be replacing heads on this motor since my next motor will come with a new set and no reason to spend an extra grand.

There is always the third option here to go with my very original plan (not sure if I posted it on here or not) which would be a forged 383 running a 250 shot of nitrous. Going this route I can buy all other parts first and then at the end save up for a forged short block and a nitrous system.

flaming-ford

iTrader: (7)

go lt1 tbi. iT SOUNDS like you have an idea what you need to do to get it done andd lt1s are great and pretty fun so why not.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

IMO, you will spend more money on the LT1 swap than a GOOD CRATE ENGINE with a warrenty!!!! The LT1 IS NOT a regular old small block!! Even with the switch to the carb manifold things will be alot different. For example your front accessories may need to be switched. If you go with the LT1 accessories all your lines will be in the wrong place and you will have to clearance the frame.

Furthermore after it is all said and done, you may be required to keep it smog legal in the NEAR future. Its never going to get better only worse!

Why not just get the GM 330 HP 350 HO like JP did? It would cost less than even a used LT1 swap. Your existing accessories will bolt to it. It also comes with a warrenty backed by GM. It would suck to get a LT1 in there, it blow up, then you have to blow another $1,500 to get it rebuilt.

Looking back at all the problems I have had, I should have just gone with the HO 350 a year ago. It would still be pulling hard.

BronYrAur

iTrader: (1)

I'm with Fast on this one, you want instant "out-of-the-box" LT1 range power, buy a HO 350. Solid motor right off the bat and Gen 1 block that's upgradeable. Throw a hotter cam in if you want even and pick up some good power.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

With the LT4 Hot Cam conversion, Behive springs, and the LT4 retainers the vortec heads can run .525" lift, like Car Craft did. Toss the LT4 Hot Cam (switch to roller) in it along with 1.5:1 rockers and you will be at like .492" lift. They made 400+ FWHP and 415 FT/LBS with an otherwise stock 350 HO.

TierAngst

Where did vortec come from? If you can run .525" lift why use 1.5 rockers over the 1.6s? All lt1/4 cams are hydraulic rollers, what am I switching to roller, are you talking roller tipped rockers? I'm all sorts of lost with your post if you couldn't tell.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

The GM 330 HP 350 HO comes from GM with Vortec Heads on it.

It also comes with a smallish flat tappet hydraulic camshaft. That is the reference to swapping to a roller cam. The HO 350 is already equipped for a roller camshaft, meaning the block is tapped in all the right places. It just needs the spyder, lifter link bars, lifters, cam retainer plate, pushrods, and timing set.

My reference to the cam swap is from a series that Car Craft did with the engine.

My comment on keeping the 1.5:1 rockers is to keep from pushing the Vortecs to the ragged edge. Even after the valve spring/retainer swap they would still be on the edge with .525" of lift. I like about 30-40 thousandths clearance at a minimum. That is retainer to valve seal. Plus going with the 1.6:1s will require removing the heads and opening up the pushrod guide hole.

They added the LT4 hot cam package as well as a few other things and made 400 FWHP. IT made like 340 HP out of the box.

TierAngst

Ok didn't realize you were referencing everything to a 350 HO, I don't plan on using one of those either since again crate motors cost serious $$, not to mention all the additional work it'll take to do all the stuff you mentioned. I really wish I was leaning towards one direction, right not I don't have a clue what I want.
The way I see it I have 5 options:
Some power now, a lot later. = small cam now, supercharger later
no power now, some later, a lot even later = going TBI'd LT1
no power now, a decent amount later, a lot even later = L05
Some power now, a lot later = small cam now, big one w/n20 later
Sell yacht, buy 4-banger econo car = end of car problems

brodyscamaro

I doubt he’d have to cut the frame to make it work.

LT1 swap is dumb. Either stick with your Gen I block or go with a Gen III setup.
And your best bet is to learn how to tune your car beautifully, that or find somebody that can do it for you. I know there are a few custom tuners in San Antonio, Allen Nelson is one of em.
I wouldn’t even think about actually spending extra money on a TBI’ed LT1 though, nor would I force feed any TBI motor…

TierAngst

I probably would have gone Gen III if I had not already ordered a set of headers, from what I've heard Gen I/II headers won't fit a Gen III

TierAngst

I checked out Nelson's site, he doesn't do TBI vehicles. Is that where you got your truck tuned? What is "CC TX" you live near SA by chance?

brodyscamaro

Naw, Nelson wants to much to tune these vehicles IMO (although he does do free upgrades/retunes for the life of the vehicle)...

Corpus Christi


And nope, gen III have different exhaust ports...

TierAngst

Ah, Corpus, not sure if you've heard of SAIL (San Antonio Impala Lovers) we've got 3-4 members down there, sometimes a few of the SA folks try going to their car shows since they often come to ours. I'll have to look you up next time I go, or vise versa if you go to any shows up here.

357mag

Just remember, what fast355 said, emissions compliance is/might be/ will be a consideration. The HO is NOT an emissions-certified replacement engine. Vortec headed motors need additional plumbing to be compliant. LTx swaps are not uncommon, check some of the B-body sites for hybrids. Personally, I think LTx motors rock! I have a 75 Monte that could use a transplant, and a 95 Z28 going to the auction yard from our PD. Hmmmm...
Whatever you do, good wrenching.

Tim sends

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

The way the Texas emissions laws are written, the Vortec heads are a legal upgrade. They don't even blink an eye at it. They don't even blink an eye at my TBI setup vs. a carb. Especially when it blows practically ZEROs on the Emissions Dyno Machine.

357mag

Arizona, well Maricopa and Pima counties only, require EGR for vehicles that originally were equipped with them. Doesn't matter if you pass the sniffer, if any portion of the equipment is damaged, missing, etc, you lose. You get 30 days to repair/replace said equipment, then you get to sit in line at 115 Friggin' degrees waiting to accomplish the whole test once more. I envy you the Texas laws.

Tim sends

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I never said that you didn't need an EGR valve. The intake on that GM makes for the HO 350 has EGR provisions if you get the Q-Jet or TBI one. You can buy the engine in long block form, without the carb or intake and buy the intake off Ebay. The way Texas' law is written is that if the New Equipment does an equal job to the old, you can swap it out and still be complient. That means IF I wanted a holley carb, as long as the other emissions controls were in place and functioning and I passed the sniffer, I could have it. You can't legally change from injection to a carb on an injected vehicle though.

357mag

True that. Holleys are fine, but I got spoiled the first time I got a motor with EFI. Although they are more costly, once they are dialed in, I don't have to touch them for a good long time. My 1 1/2 year old Holley 4160 is giving me a little cold morning grief.

Tim sends

TierAngst

They're really aren't any laws for vehicles here in San Antonio, most people here think if your car can make it to the inspection shop its road worthy they give you the sticker. Right now I'm trying to do the whole legal juggle with my car since I have it registered in NY and I'm in the military I'm not sure I even need to ever get my car inspected if it doesn't go to NY. I'm not even going to tough vortec junk, I don't have a clue why everyone swears by it. Sure they out flow the TBI heads a little in stock form but for the cost of buying a vortec manifold and heads I could for less money have TBI heads ported to outflow vortecs. Not planning on doing either of these, I'd rather save up for a real set of heads like some AFR's. But as of right now I don't have a clue as to what engine to go with. I'm also wondering why Brody said I should go with the blower??? Blower + 4bbl TBI = 500+ hp, what'd be wrong with that?

357mag

Tier, check PM