shaggy56

I was looking up to see what it took to build an engine with 18 degree heads. I see they sell Edelbrock Victor heads bare as cast for like $500 each. Im not sure if they could be run as cast or require porting to be run. I looked on ebay and they seem to have pretty affordable shaft rocker systems. Also the pistons dont look any worse in price then if you were to buy a good set of forged pistons. I think all thats really left is the headers and intake which doesnt look any worse than competition parts for any other engine. I heard you can get really good power with very little compression with 18 degree heads. Please chime in because I know very little about this and would love to learn.

F-BIRD'88

The Brodix stuff uses $$standard 23deg valvetrain$$. Buddy made over 700hp N/A on a 406 with 18deg heads. Stock block stock (iced) cast crank 5.7" rods off the shelf 18deg pistons.

JesasaurusRex

iTrader: (3)

my biggest worry would be finding some headers that would work in these cars, if u find some let us know

shaggy56

Probably have to be custom. But then again it wont be going into a thirdgen. Nothing a little welding cant do.

F-BIRD'88

definatly custom built headers

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

wouldn't the "standard" valvetrain stuff be cheaper then special 18* stuff?

ditchbangr

iTrader: (1)

What are different between standard 23 degree headers and 18 degree headers? Ports higher/spaced further apart or is the whole architecture of the head different? I was just thinking the valve angles should be the only difference.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

Thinking without having knowledge is dangerous. Having knowledge without thinking is a waste. It takes both to be successful.

-10 RI™ and -10X™ Series Cylinder Heads/23°

Will your headers bolt up to these? They have the typical exhaust flange for REAL RACE heads, of any valve angle (their 18° heads are also like this); one of the most extreme limitations to a SBC head being, the bolt pattern for the 2 center exh ports being so small that it limits the port size.

Air_Adam

Possibly port location, but I know theres the fact that the ports are HUGE, and it doesn't jive too well with the stock SBC exhaust bolt pattern, so the aftermarket made up their own bolt pattern (actually two... Stahl pattern, and some other one).

ditchbangr

iTrader: (1)

I was looking at the TFS 18's, that is a different animal than the brodix.

11 Flat

Go with either the Edelbrock or the TFS 18 deg heads

I would not use cheap shaft rockers off ebay... Its only going to come back and bite you in the *** later

You would have to have custom headers made for it $$$ probably a 1 3/4 to 1 7/8 stepped header??? What size motor???

A quick fluff and buff wouldn't hurt

I don’t have any 18 deg heads in the shop right now.... but I do have a set of 15 deg heads and 12 deg heads im doing. I'll try and barrow a digital camera and snap some pics of the exhaust side, next to a standard 23 deg head. To give you an idea of the differences

Its not going to be cheap done right...... Things add up

P.S. if you have any other questions feel free to ask or PM me

sixpackmtrspts

if you run flat top pistons you will be ok, may have to do some work on the vlave nothes depending on cam, a domed piston will require a special domwe for 18* heads. i think the differances on the exhaust stuff is the angle of the ehaust flange is different, so this would cause interferance issues with the header tubes and frame parts, steering etc. some also have either the standard bolt pattern or the stahl pattern or the rerher and morrison pattern. there are adpators to adapt stard headers but they are typically 1/2 to 5/8 thick so again casues clearance issues.

also the ontake manifold is different, not sure on theose brodix bolt on 18* but the 18* bowties i have take a different manifold as the intake flange angles are different than standard 23* heads.

shaggy56

Great info coming. Thanks for all the added advice. I was just conjuring up possibly running a 427 with something that will breathe. I was told that the 23 degree heads when you get into the large cubes starts becoming a restriction. I was told the largest 23 degree cnc'd heads may work also. I heard the All Pro heads breathe great for 23 degree heads but I have no clue where you can even get them.

BadSS

The 227M2s or the KeithCraft 227 fully CNCed Track Is are killer 23-degree heads that use standard valvetrain and headers. On a pump gas 406 - 427cid SBC you can get them to dish out 580 - 600 streatable horsepower with a moderately sized cam. I can tell you,, that kind of power on the streets can get hairy. The throttle response is insane with 406+ cubes,, and there's no electronics (like in the new Vettes) to help correct the car when you hit the turn a little too steep. Folks that's never run deep in the 11s would be more than happy (if not scared to death) with a properly built 23-degree, 406+cid combination using those heads. If around 600 horses won't do,,,, I'd recommend skipping the small block and moving right to a budget 496 BBC or a 532 with fully CNCed heads - which could be built for the same money as an altered valve headed SBC,,, and run circles around it. If I knew back 25 years ago what I know now,,, that's what I would do.

shaggy56

I have thought it out and definately will not be going big block. I would rather watch peoples faces drop when I open the hood. Thats enough reason for me.

daverr

iTrader: (1)

If u get something that says "as cast" u need to get them ported or else u will be very disappointed.

in in the middle of a 18* motor build. Project came to a hault due to a new project. I should always finish what i started

check out this link

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tech...w-numbers.html

Pics

ditchbangr

iTrader: (1)

For the guys that have done the 18deg. heads, is it worth it? With the LSX and edelbrocks carb intake wouldn't that route be easier? Starting from scratch anyways?

Nice looking heads Dave....

daverr

iTrader: (1)

i think Lsx would probably cost more. I personally use only fuel injection, im done with carburators.

shaggy56

Dave, Thanks for the photos. Nice to actually get a photo of them closeup. Im thinking something along that line. If I get the heads already CNCed it shouldnt be a problem. Headers shouldnt be a problem since I know many guys that can fab for the pleasure to see it run.

BadSS

I hear you. I was and still am the same way to a degree,, but I never popped my hood way back in the days when I was grudge racing.

You can run a lot less cam in the altered valve heads and make similar or better power than a larger cam in the 23-degree head engine,, they're "pricey",,, but if you're going for that ultimate SBC sleeper with "shock-value",, they'll give you that. Scoggins built a pump gas 11.2:1 434 with cnc ported 18-degree heads (353cfm at cam lift) that pulled 670 horses @7000rpm with a 252/258solid roller. LPE built a 434 18-degree pump gas combo with a baby 224 duration solid roller with 1.7 ratio rockers to get the lift over .600 and best I remember it made somewhere around 640 horses. The power is definitely there if you're willing to spend the money.

BadSS

We used standard off the shelf 1 3/4" or 1 7/8" headers and sectioned in a little extra pipe and the flanges in this link for a quick and cheap fab if the spacers were going to cause clearance problems.
http://www.schoenfeldheaders.com/sbflanges.htm