Dracul

Well since I decided to drive my car till my engine blew (lost lobe) and i had my car 98% road ready (or so i thought) i decided to go for a spin today around the block, and on a nice straight section (which was really fun), i finished the drive by pretty much needing a new engine.. i pulled into the driveway with my oil pressure at about 7psi and giving it gas goin to about 20psi (a little too low for my liking)...

SO the at this point i'm just gonna assume the engine is toast.. and i think this week i'm goin to the bank n just gettin a loan out n buying a crate motor as i REALLY want this car on the road ASAP. 9 months of waiting after buying a car that was supposedly 99% done and had a engine with 30k on it has really tried my patience....

now for crate motors i was lookin at a 2 different options.

buying the GM l98 for around 2600 i think then swappin out the cam in it for somethin a lil more aggressive that will match my intake. followed by a holly 750dp, and my new torker 2 intake.

or buying the blueprint 383 for 3k... now i tried to search as best i could and i didn't really find anyone that has actually used the blueprint engine. 1 post said that i couldn't change the cam in it or i would void the warrenty, but at 400hp i don't think i'd have to .. what i really like about this thing is that it has a 2 year warrenty so if it blows up for whatever reason i'm gettin a new engine.

so what do you guys think, i'm kinda stumped on what to do.. i'm gonna take probably a 4 grand loan out, and buy some long tubes for this thing n have some true duals fabbed up

so whichever engine i get the top end will be the following
Holley 750DP (with HP mainbody)
Edelbrock Torker 2 Intake
Hooker Supercomp Full length headers
and swapping in my new roller rockers i bought when i thought i was gonna just build

so what do you guys think.. any input would be appreciated as i'm kinda stumped as to which route to go..

also one thing that did kinda throw me is the note at the bottom of the page on jeg's website "All Blueprint Chevy 383 engines include a balance plate and require the use of a neutral balance flywheel/flexplate"

now pardon my engine newbieness, as i'm still learnin here, but can someone point me out to a flywheel i can use for this.. i plan on putting my t5 behind this thing and after reading this i'm guessing i can't just reuse the one off my old engine.

thanks
-Bob

Apeiron

The Torker 2 is a mistake. What heads are you planning on using?

Dracul

I know a lot of people don't like the torker 2, but my buddy runs it on all 3 of his chevelle's and i can find no faults with it.. and i'll be using the heads that come with the engines which are vortec heads i think 64cc

Apeiron

The only fault with it is that there are better designs available. Every one of your friend's 3 Chevelles would do better with a different intake.

Dracul

maybe, but i already have it so i'm gonna use it..

back to the main topic.. does anyone have opinions on these crate engines?

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

You mean there's only ONE?

Not to be cruel or anything, but....

I can't see any point in wasting your money on "blueprinting", whatever that might mean to whoever is saying it at the moment, if you're going to put an obsolete intake on it that has a decades-long history of getting beat by practically every other intake. That way, when you lose, you can tell them you only have {fill-in-the-blank with a lowball number here} in it, and an intake that you scraped up off your garage floor.

I also see no point in spending a dime more than you have to, if $150 for an intake is significant to you (in other words, if using that ancient worthless garbage "because you already have it" is more important than whether it runs good or not).

What's your goal here? to just get it back on the road as quick as possible, and you're determined to use that cast-off junk on top of it? If so, go with the cheeeepo "Goodwrench" 350.

If your goal is to build something good, then forget about that intake you "already have", open your mind, and maybe we can talk about what runs good.

Just FYI, I have LOTS and LOTS of old stuff myself; but it's all just sitting on the shelf, and I'm not running it just "because I already have it". So I practice what I preach, so to speak. I'm waiting for "the greater fool" to come along.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

you might be able to dump your current motor off at a machine shop/engine builder, and have it back, ready to run, for cheaper than a crate motor. A toast motor is a large paperweight, and a waste of space to keep around, if you can use it might as well.
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That only goes for the motor in the car, the intake has been discussed already FWIW edelbrock performer RPM is THE mainstay intake, and somewhere like $112 from summit, or $99 for the summit knockoff (which i'm pretty sure is the professional products knockoff, or the edelbrock brand, with the casting stamp ground off).

Your current motor can probably be rebuilt by a dedicated machine shop in the time it takes to get a crate motor truck freight-ed to you. If you're worried about downtime that is.

Dracul

yeah i was considering the crate motor mainly due to down time.. as i really want this car on the road before winter comes...

and the reason i bought the torker is because, as my buddy explained it to me, the nice thing about the single plane intake is that all cylinders get the same amount of fuel and the dual planes tend to lean some cylinders out.. plus the rpm range matches the cam he told me i should get.. (the crane 100172)

I dunno i'll do some thinkin on the intake, but i liked his logic, and the fact that his slowest chevelle (lot heavier car) runs a 11 sec quarter. i figured it was the way to go even though a lot of people are against it.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

theory is alright, in that a single plane would match your RPM band and give a more even fuel distribution (didn't see your cam, but i'll trust you)
So then your choice is a Victor junior, or the like.

Well you might want to phone around and see how the machine shops workload it looking. Otherwise, post a few crate motor links here (specific part #'s) and we can toss out some suggestions

Apeiron

That's a good theory, but especially on a small volume single plane like the Torker, you've got a case where #7 has to draw its intake charge right after #5 next door has just depleted the plenum, which isn't the best thing for charge distribution.

The Torker and Torker II are 30 year old designs that tried to even out the poor high RPM performance of a dual plane with the poor low RPM performance of a single plane. The result was something that performed fairly poorly across the whole range. That's there the idea of "RPM range" comes from. RPM range indicates in whishy-washy marketing terms where the intake will make its peak power. With the Torker, the power never peaks.

A more modern dual plane design like a Performer RPM will outperform a Torker across the board.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

OK, so his car runs 11s. Not too bad.

So, how does he know, or more importantly, how do YOU know, that his car wouldn't run 10s with a better intake???

Most people who have those things nowadays got them for free. I hope you did too, otherwise you paid too much. What those of us who have been around for a while hear from people who have them, is something like "I got this from my racer buddy that has a fast car and has been racing since before I was born so it's got to be something good, it was sitting around and he just gave it to me." Well, DUH - if it was any good, it'd be on his car, not on the floor under his storage shelf!!

A Perf RPM dual-plane will VASTLY outrun that Stone Age T2 on any engine that you might think "needs" the compromise of the T2 (i.e. not big enough for a single-plane). Any of a long list of single-planes, such as a Vic or Vic Jr or a Brodix or a Dart and so forth, will outrun it on any motor that ACTUALLY NEEDS a single-plane. In other words, there is NO APPLICATION for which it is the best intake. Period. No matter what motor you put it on, IT WILL GO SLOWER than the right intake.

Now go out there and beat your racer buddy.

Dracul

thanks for clearing everything up on the torker, i did pay for it but i dunno, guess i'll either sell it or put it on a shelf..

but things just took a turn for the worse as i just got back from the bank and was only cleared for 2500 bucks.. due to my excessive student loans..

so now its time for me to figure out a way to get an engine installed in this thing for 2500..

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

you shouldn't have to break a sweat with that. Rebuild what you've got. Assuming you can re-use most of it, you should be set. A carbed setup without anything exotic in it is fairly cheap.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

How bad off is your existing motor? What's still good? (Pistons, heads, crank, ???)

$2500 isn't going to put you into much of "performance" territory, if you start from scratch. If on the other hand your block and pistons are re-useable, and you can just tear it down and clean the metal shavings out of it and put it back together, your odds improve considerably. Especially if whatever heads you have (what casting are they???) are something decent, and not 70s smoggers or swirlies.

Dracul

yeah, i think i am going to end up reusing most everything that i have.. i know i want new heads, so here is a question.. I think i read before that stock 350 heads from like the late 60's or whatever year it was were actually decent.. and i looked last month at heads on our system at advance, and i can get heads for like 130 each.. so what years of stock vehicles had good heads that i could throw on this thing..

i'm gonna call a machine shop in the morning and get some prices on machine work in the morning, and price out a few more things..

Apeiron

They were decent by late 60's standards. You can do a lot better now, though. For $130 you'd probably end up with a rebuilt lightweight smogger castings. Power comes from the heads, so that's where you want to make sure you're getting the best you can.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

Drop off the motor at the machine shop and hold your breath. Don't go spending money you don't have yet (so to speak).
After you know the bare minimum of $ it'll take to get your 350 back into working condition, then think about upgrades.

Would you rather have a 300HP car you can drive now, or a 400HP car that's parked over the winter? (for the next 6 months, or whatever it may be,,,)

Dracul

yeah, i think i'm gonna try to get the engine out this week..

the fun part will be how to do it without scratching my new paint job.. as when i yanked it last time the engine hoist slid forward and scratched up the front nose of the bumper.

and i sure as hell don't want my new paint job messed up. i'm tryin to price some stuff out just to spec out the engine, and so far it is lookin like i'll be able to do it depending on the condition of my block.. working at advance might actually come in handy since i can get performer rpm heads for like $795

once i get the engine torn down, is there anyways for me to find out the compression ratio by lookin at the pistons? so i can make sure i don't go too high on overall compression

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

yes, but you'd be wasting your time finding out what your current CR is, if you're not sure if you're able to reuse those pists/heads so...

United Engine and Machine Co.

There's a nice internet calculator I like to use.

Main things to look for are:

piston style / piston dish size

deck height, stock is roughly .025", but that's what machine work is for, to tweak that.

Cylinder head chamber volume (cc's)

stroke and bore should be no brainers, after machine work that is

gasket can be played with, but the "main" choice is roughly 4.150" .039" thick.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Aluminum Heads Vs. Ported Iron Heads – Comparison, Test – Hot Rod

The T2 is a piece of JUNK. Performer RPM is definately the way to go.

Dracul

thanks for the links..

i'm assuming i'd be better off just getting different pistons (new plus i can pick my compression ratio)... so if i just got different pistons, i'm asssuming i can reuse my rods as long as they aren't damaged, correct?

and as for the intake, its gonna depend on what kinda of money i have left after the engine is done.. my options are either the torker 2 or the performer that is on it right now.

if the money is there i may get a new intake.. (could probably sell some stuff i have layin around for decent cash ( ac delete box, and a mini dv cam).. so i may just get a new intake and try to sell my old ones after they get cleaned up..

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

IMO, the performer intake will run better than the torker 2 for what you are trying to achieve. In fact I would probably go with a stock Q-Jet iron intake (slightly tweaked) over the torker 2. Nothing says that you cannot get a better intake when you can afford it.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

you can swap intakes later, but budget in intake gaskets, $20, and probably some coolant that you'll spill, $10, and 2hrs of time or so. It's not really worth swapping later. I mean when you can get it for $125 or so from summit, it's hard to say no.
You can sell your performer and Torker2 and get that much out of the both of them, IMHO, and be ahead of the game.

I wouldn't plan any motor build things until you know the damage. Hopefully the rods are ok, but really, who knows.

What motor anyway? 1983 with a 350... So i'm guessing it's some '70s smogger 350 that the previous owner tossed in? Or...? You say it's only got 30k on it, perhaps some nice performance goodies are in there that you can reuse.

Dracul

well when i bought the car i was told the 350 had only 30k.. but with all the stuff i have found that the PO lied about, i have no idea if that's actually true... and when i had the motor out last i ran the numbers and it is a 78 block..

yeah, that is a good point about the intakes.. since i'll have 2 to sell, i may throw an rpm air gap on it.. but like you said, i'm not ordering anything till i get a result on the engine..