Nic

I know this doesn't have any street racing content, but the majority of the guys in this forum have street cars with exhaust systems on them, so I think this story may be of some interest here.

Anti-Noise Group Honked-Off At Noisy Hot Rods
By Michael L. Betsch
CNSNews.com Staff Writer
November 05, 2002
(CNSNews.com) - A national organization devoted to fighting noise pollution has taken its battle to the streets, to combat loud exhaust systems installed in cars after they are sold.

Noise Free America spokesman Mark Huber says the manufacturers of hot rod mufflers are selling a product that is "lawlessly terrorizing" neighborhoods across America.

The Richmond, Va.-based group insists that noise pollution is a serious health hazard. It mentions hearing damage, sleep deprivation, aggression, chronic fatigue and high blood pressure as specific maladies stemming from our noisy world.

Noise Free America recently awarded Flowmaster, Inc., a manufacturer of high- performance, after-market mufflers and exhaust systems, with its Noisy Dozen award, an "honor" given to the nation's worst noise polluters.

According to Huber, Flowmaster was singled out for aggressively marketing products that bother people and are even illegal in some states. He said Flowmaster and other companies that distribute the noisy mufflers systems specifically boast about the "deep aggressive tone" or "deep throaty rumble" that their products produce.

A diverse cross-section of teens and twenty-somethings are installing the equipment that sells for thousands of dollars.

An article in Flowmaster's customer magazine, Power Press, acknowledges that there's a strong demand for loud exhaust systems: "Market surveys continually show...that many buyers purchase a Flowmaster system because of its unique and distinctive sound."

But Huber said he sees nothing desirable in Flowmaster's product line.

"For some reason, both fans of after-market exhausts and 'boom cars' seem to be obsessed with the lower frequency noises, which can disturb more people at a greater distance in all directions from their vehicle," he said. "Sounds of a lower pitch or frequency travel further and penetrate solids, such as windows and exterior walls of homes more easily than sounds of a higher pitch."

Illegal equipment

According to Huber, it is completely legal for manufacturers such as Flowmaster to market and sell their exhaust systems. However, he said, as soon as the car owner installs the equipment and hits the road, that car owner could be breaking the law.

Huber said approximately 40 states prohibit the modification of exhaust systems contrary to factory specifications. Virginia is one such state, he said.

Virginia's State Code (Sec. 46.2-1049) specifically states, "No person shall drive and no owner of a motor vehicle shall permit or allow the operation of any vehicle on a highway unless it is equipped with an exhaust system of a type installed as standard factory equipment, or comparable to that designed for use on the particular vehicle as standard factory equipment, in good working order and in constant operation to prevent excessive or unusual noise."

But he said local and state police are lax in their enforcement of the state code in cases where vehicles equipped with noisy after-market exhaust systems are clearly in violation of the law.

Contrary to Huber's observation, Virginia State Police spokesman Sergeant Morris said the law enforcement officers statewide are cracking down on illegally installed exhaust systems; it's just that some counties don't enforce the law as strictly as others, he said.

"Different people have different things that they go after, fortunately or unfortunately," Morris said. "They have some police officers in Chesterfield County who are sticklers for those mufflers."

He said Chesterfield County's local police force writes a lot of tickets for vehicles with noisy mufflers because the devices are not standard factory equipment, nor are they compatible with standard factory equipment, as state code mandates.

However, Morris said judges in Virginia's county court system often rule against officers who issued tickets for noise violations. "Some will convict, some won't," he said.

Assault on freedom

Huber believes that people who purchase noisy mufflers see them as "some sort of extension of their personality that they want to share with the whole world."

"That's where the line is crossed," he said. "That's where they take away my freedom and they rob quiet off of my property and out of my personal space."

Aside from being a threat to public safety and an assault on the quality of life, Huber believes the tailpipe rumblings also affect the property values of homes within earshot of the hot rods.

He pointed to studies showing that homes located near airports lose almost two percent of their property value per decibel level emitted by jumbo jets. Similarly, he said, owners of vehicles that produce "aggressive, muscle car sound" may decrease the value of homes.

Noise Free America takes a grassroots approach to noise pollution. It lobbies politicians, even supplying model legislation, to address what it perceives as a health problem.

Flowmaster defends its products

"We have been in the business for over 20 years - and not by advocating that people break the law," said a Flowmaster spokesman who refused to identify himself to CNSNews.com . "That's why we make off-road products and products for street and emission vehicles as well."

According to the Flowmaster spokesman, the company designs exhaust systems for "race cars" based on the good-faith assumption that they will be installed on track-based race cars - not open-road passenger vehicles.

However, he said, "People, when they buy their cars and trucks, are free to do whatever they want, to a point. They go beyond that, oftentimes, and get in trouble."




For anyone who would like to contact the tree huggers:

Virginia

Richmond
• Lyman Flynn, 1724 Betty Lane, Richmond, Virginia 23226
(804-282-6095)
• Mark Huber: markjhuber@earthlink.net
• Steve Schrass: oregonbreeze@cs.com
• Randy Throckmorton: noisewarrior@juno.com

or to pay them a visit:

http://maps.yahoo.com/py/maps.py?BFC...%A0Map=Get+Map

3.1EyeCandy

iTrader: (3)

hehe...."pay them a visit"....this could be fun.

Burnouts in front of their headquarters w/an exhaust cutout. hehehehehe. bwahahaha. They shall learn to love my rumbly exhaust.

But seriously....I love the sound of my car. It's not excessively loud (and no I don't have a cutout....yet) and It's actually relaxing to me. If you don't want to listen to cars in the city...don't live in the city. It's that simple. People are stupid.

BigErns90IrocZ

Some people are just retarded. Probally as a kid, he tried to fit into the hot rod scene, but his horse and buggy were too slow, so he holds a grudge.

Well I think that him speaking is violating my property and my personal space, so does that mean I can start a campaign to get rid of him or something?

Mark A Shields

What a ***, have people NOT realized yet, that Flowmasters or any other american performance muffler is no longer all that loud.

Why don't they go pick on that annoying pissed off bee sound, or fart cannons.

striker19o

1.this is one of the most pathetic things i have ever seen.

2. just to put this in perspective, these people believe that car exhaust systems cause more noise pollution then: buses, garbage trucks, 18 wheelers, UPS trucks, fedex trucks, lawn mowers, landscapers and their trucks, trains, airplanes, high school marching bands, fire trucks, police and ambulance sirens, groups of people talking, and dogs barking.
i can wake up, drive to work, work (outside), and drive home 1 day, and hear all the things i listed, and not hear a SINGLE loud exhaust from a "hot rod"


3.all this does is make me want to work a few extra hours to save up for my exhaust system

Mark A Shields

Ever heard a Harley accelerating, I mean now that is loud chit.

curt86iroc

what a bunch of idiots. i hope they realize that a lot of aftermarket systems are 50 state legal like my edelbrock, dynomax and some flowmasters. i guess they have nothing better to do.

Black 91 Z28

Nuff said!

MdFormula350

if its legal MD then who cares what others think!!

we all know Flowmaster gets you laid!!

i would run it even though its apperntly illegal in VA!!

DakotaSLT

Damn hippies. They're contradicting themselves anyway. By not allowing me to run my beautiful flowmaster exhaust because it invades his rights, he's invading mine!!!!!!! I live in VA and there is no way in hell my exhaust is going back to stock. One of you guys mentioned a "group outing" past their headquarters, If we can organize enough cars, I'm up for that .

Oh and:

"The Richmond, Va.-based group insists that noise pollution is a serious health hazard. It mentions hearing damage, sleep deprivation, aggression, chronic fatigue and high blood pressure as specific maladies stemming from our noisy world."

That's not from our exhausts, those symptoms come from the 6-foot poles up their asses.

Nic

We're already in the process of planning it What part of Va are you from?

DakotaSLT

Leesburg/Sterling area, outside of DC. I'm down in Blacksburg at school right now though. If you do get this thing together, send me an IM (BigRedDogC), and I will go get my car, just for this . Nothing I like better than pissing off enviromental crazies.

rezinn

Since I started reading this two rice rockets have driven by. I agree that these cars need to be stopped-they absolutely create a rediculous amount of noise pollution. I live a quarter mile from any street, and I can still hear them revving those little engines for absolutely no reason. Maybe we can get these people to attack the fast and the furious and that sort of film. The school I go to is, like most unversities I've seen, mostly asian. These guys have some kind of complex where they need to make up for their small penises with a large, annoying buzzing sound from the back of their cars. Lots of white and black guys have gotten into it too, following this stupid trend. I despise these cars. They are SO DAMN ANNOYING. That said, yes any car that drives the way they do should be ticketed. Sure, my car COULD be louder than theirs, but it isn't because I'm not a moron. I rarely race, and if I do it's not next to a residential area. I don't peel out as I turn through the intersection, making screetching noises and "bzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ" "reeeeeeEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"

Okay. I've just seen all these idiots driving these cars as of late. I hate them. I think something needs to be done, but it likely will not be the correct thing because the people who will create the laws are ignorant of where the sounds are coming from. They don't know where the problem lies, they just know it's there and are saying it's "hot rods," when it actually isn't most of the time.

Mark A Shields

Exactly rezinn, at my college it is crazy too. My dorm room is next to a small thru street, well, I was tryin to watch this show one day, and a ***** went by, loud as crap, I literally couldn't hear the tv, and the guy was goin slow as ballz.

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

The grown up and mature thing to do is to post these links on every forum you can think of and make sure that every single person you know sends them an email telling them how they are singling out a group of people unfairly and to go live in the forest in hippie bliss . I personally think motorcycles are a far bigger problem.

Nic

Is that a joke? Cuz I did that... A few of the hippies on AllFordMustangs.com were offended by my usage of the term "tree hugger"

You go to tech? I went there freshman year then transfered back home. It was too cold walking across that drillfield at 8 am I was astounded at the number of tree huggers on campus up there. Made me wish I had my 5.0 w the tree killer pipe with me.

5.0mustang

Wow, I didn't know I was killing people and driving down the costs of homes! I mean the $700,000-$800,000 houses on my street must only be worth a couple grand, because of my dam* car! It is a good thing I know this now!

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

LoL i did exactly what i said, emailed em told em cities were all about noise pollution and if they didnt like it they can go live in the *** damn forrest. heh if i lived in virginia i would mount up my old rims and tires and do a 1st 2nd 3rd, go until they burnout in front of their ****ing headquarters.

chacane67

If you can believe this, I e-mailed Mr. Huber and got a response from a guy in New Zealand, barking at me. Here is his response:

Just received a copy of your email to Mark Huber. I live on the other side of the world in New Zealand, and believe it or not, we get noise pollution problems from selfish automobile users too. Would you like it if I played loud classical music outside your bedroom window at 3 am?

I have considerable empathy for the American people in general, and totally support President Bush in his initiatives against terrorism. I am beginning to see however why America is hated in so many countries, if selfish morons like yourself are representative of it's people.

With freedom comes responsibility.

Rod Rowlands

I would love to post my reply to this....but it didnt look good if you were on the receiving end. I wont unless someone wants to see it.

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

I got that same exact email back word for word. I replied to him that i felt that flowmaster was the wrong company to be after. Import cars far out number domestic cars in not only numbers but sound decibels (a lot of times) as well.

CrashStitches

Dear Mr. Huber,

I have recently had the misfortune of coming across one of your self-righteous, biased, and misinformed crusades stemming from noise pollution from so-called "hot rods." I can do little but laugh at your "reasoning" skills.

***Noise Free America spokesman Mark Huber says the manufacturers of hot rod mufflers are selling a product that is "lawlessly terrorizing" neighborhoods across America.***

Lawlessly terrorizing. Realize that many of the exhaust products sold to the public are 50-state legal. That would seem to take care of that. And comparing law-abiding citizens to terrorists who maim and kill is a step that few have the audacity to take.

***The Richmond, Va.-based group insists that noise pollution is a serious health hazard. It mentions hearing damage, sleep deprivation, aggression, chronic fatigue and high blood pressure as specific maladies stemming from our noisy world.***

I live in the same world that you do. For some reason, I attribute none of these things to "noise pollution" or "hot rod exhausts." It's pretty easy to start a crusade using common "maladies" blamed on something you disagree with. In the same vein, I could easily claim that reading your rhetoric is causing me aggression and high-blood pressure, resulting in traumatic stress episodes.

***According to Huber, Flowmaster was singled out for aggressively marketing products that bother people...***

Products that bother people? So now anything that bothers you should be illegal? What kind of high-minded thinking is that? Your useless crusade and rhetoric bother me. Does that make it illegal? Should it be? Of course not. Such a ludicrous point of contention.

***Virginia's State Code (Sec. 46.2-1049) specifically states, "No person shall drive and no owner of a motor vehicle shall permit or allow the operation of any vehicle on a highway unless it is equipped with an exhaust system of a type installed as standard factory equipment, or comparable to that designed for use on the particular vehicle as standard factory equipment, in good working order and in constant operation to prevent excessive or unusual noise." ***

Ok, let me explain how that wording makes these exhaust systems legal. What Flowmaster markets as legal are these bolt-on exhaust systems that are direct replacements of factory pieces, in other words, "an exhaust system of a type installed as standard factory equipment, or comparable to that designed for use on the particular vehicle as standard factory equipment". Let me explain that, incase you don't get it. A stock, standard muffler is of a chambered and baffled design, meaning a case that contains several channels for exhaust to be routed through, and baffles to move the gases around, cooling them. Guess what....so do most aftermarket performance mufflers. All they do is ease restriction of flow, which in turn creates power, and as a side-effect, a bit more noise. However, the design is such that it complies with the letter of the law. An example of an illegal exhaust by the law's definition would be a welded-on muffler of a straight-through design, such as many import cars use. That would be illegal in the eyes of the law because the exhaust is not of a type comparable to that installed by the factory.

***Huber believes that people who purchase noisy mufflers see them as "some sort of extension of their personality that they want to share with the whole world." ***

Hmmm...such as this crusade against law-abiding citizens? We don't live in a quiet world. If you desire peace and quiet, there are plenty of places they can be found. You can't live in a heavily populated area and expect everything to go your way. And, referring to your ignorant statement above: the reason the noise is there is not because we want you to hear it. It's because we are working to improve the performance of our vehicles within the bounds of the law, something that most of us manage to do.

***"That's where the line is crossed," he said. "That's where they take away my freedom and they rob quiet off of my property and out of my personal space." ***

As stated above...some places just are not quiet. That is a fact of life. Your obsessive behavior in this persuit are indications that you may be a very insecure person. The rest of the world does not owe you for these insecurities. Laws are laws, and until they are changed, you will toil in futility should you continue this insignificant persuit.


***Aside from being a threat to public safety and an assault on the quality of life, Huber believes the tailpipe rumblings also affect the property values of homes within earshot of the hot rods.
He pointed to studies showing that homes located near airports lose almost two percent of their property value per decibel level emitted by jumbo jets. Similarly, he said, owners of vehicles that produce "aggressive, muscle car sound" may decrease the value of homes. ***

Sorry, but that was the most ignorant statement I have read yet. You must be grasping at straws. Comparing the decibel levels generated by jetplanes to those generated by passenger cars? That's on another level entirely. I mean, unless you are 3 feet from a vehicle with NO exhaust muffling at high RPM at wide-open throttle, there isn't even a comparison. And flight paths and approach patterns to airports are predictable things, homes built near airports are predictable. A car driving past your house at 10pm is not. There is no basis for that argument.

I hope that I have pointed out some of the MAJOR flaws in your "reasoning" behind this cause. Maybe eventually you'll realize that there are more important things to devote your energy towards.



:hail: performance exhaust!

Dragroc

Nuff said! Wait, I have one thing to add...What a bunch of sissies!

chacane67

I have had three replys to my innitial e-mail to Mr. Huber from whomever these people are, just so that they could impression me with it being all my fault.

So I sent all of them that replyed to me, CrashStitches post (hope you didnt mind, as there were no names attached) as the response from "The automotive community"..........

I cant wait to see the replys!!!!!

CrashStitches

yeah, I actually emailed that to Mr. Huber...he'll get an earful

TunedPortZ

well done, i think you hit the nail on the head with that one. if i was a self indulgent *****, you would have changed my mind.


Mr. Huber:lala:

Jokerman

And while we are at it lets make the only color availible on cars a nice medium flat grey. Every car should look the same and perform the same as well. Oh and the only music that should be played should be white noise, or easy listening. Dogs must have a mute button installed, and ice cream can only come in vanilla. All soda should taste like sprite, and chocolate should be outlawed.

Jesus people, lets just get rid of everything fun because it bothers one little hitler wanna be munchkin in VA. People like this scare me.

afterburn

I think the one thing they don't get:

We put performance exhausts on our cars more for the benefits in power than the sound. We aren't doing it soley to annoy them.

afterburn

I had to email him...couldn't resist:

Mr. Huber,

I have recently read an article regarding "Noise Free America" and its attack on Flowmaster, Corp. I know you probably get a lot of emails from performance car owners like myself. A slight few of these, no doubt, are incredibly ignorant, and probably make you more sure of your stance on this issue (there are some of those people in every group – and they are usually the loudest).

I would like to make something clear that I think is misunderstood - performance exhausts are not put on cars solely to make your life miserable. There is a significant gain in power, which is important to people with a passion for powerful cars.

My exhaust is 100% street legal in 50 states. Yes, it is louder than normal, but I guarantee you cannot hear it inside your house unless I am revving my engine (which you would be able to hear regardless of the exhaust system on it). At idle, you have to be within 25-35 feet to hear it, and at night I (as well as many others) am courteous with it.

What I think you should be attacking instead of performance based enthusiasts (you yourself are an enthusiast of anti-noise pollution, so you understand what it is like to have a passion), is to attack straight pipe exhaust (Harley-Davidson motorcycles), or exhaust tips.

Exhaust tips have absolutely NO performance gains, and are placed on the care SOLEY to make it louder. If you wish to attack the use of either straight pipe or exhaust tips on the street, you'd have my support.

You might turn around and say that I'm being selfish with my car's performance; not being courteous enough to all the other citizens of this country. However, I can think of a number of other things that people do that make noise pollution. Lawn mowers, airplanes, talking outside, dogs, etc., etc. Each one of those products/actions has benefits, and it also has downsides. Don't attack ours just because you don't understand it.

Craig84Z

iTrader: (2)

Thanks Nic for the info.

Quote:

Since I started reading this two rice rockets have driven by. I agree that these cars need to be stopped-they absolutely create a rediculous amount of noise pollution.

I wouldn't even direct these people to motorcycles or cars with fart cans. Don't give them any more ideas. With the emails you guys sent maybe they will better understand - probably not.

I wish I was in Virginia to get them an exhaust drive-by. Let us know how the drive goes.

Craig

17camaro83

I"m all for the burnout. when and where

17camaro83

you know what would be cool. I would do it too. I would find his car and cut off a small portionof his exhaust system and when the guy would leave his headquarters, and turns on his car.it would be loud as hell in front of everyone he would look like a hypocryte. of course thats just an Idea

92superram

What a fu(king moron. I freedom is not free. It is absolutely impossible for everyone to have every freedom. I am not free to kill a person(although sometimes I wish I could). Enheriently, freedom can only go so far before it inhibits the freedom of another. Yes, we should have the right to modify our cars. Yes, Mr Huber should have the right to live in a sound free world if he wants. It is totally impossible for that to happen. I hate how the article singles out "teens and twenty-somethings" That is totally stupid. My ex-girlfeind's dad has a chevy02 with a big block and race exhaust. He drives it on the street. I think that is well beyond the line of what should be on the street. My 50 year old boss has a 79 t/a with race exhaust. He also drives it on the street. I understand where he is coming from on that point. If either of those cars drove by my house at 3 in the morning, I would be pissed, but flowmaster is not the problem. They make factory replacement systems, and even with 80series mufflers, they are not as loud as jets or dumptrucks.

5.0mustang

Mr Huber,
I was recently reading your article about noisy cars and how you feel this is an invasion on privacy, and injuring people. I feel that although you make some valid points about excessivly loud vehicles, I feel you are over exaggerating the affects it has on the population. You claim that these muffler Flowmaster sells invades your privacy. I live in a pretty wealthy neigborhood, and have a Flowmaster exhaust equipped on my Mustang. I have not had one complaint about it, and by now most neigbors have complimented me on my vehicle. I put this system on my car, not only for the sound, but for the added horsepower. This adding horsepower is my hobbie. I am 17 and would you rather have me adding power to my car via an exhaust system, or doing drugs, just because your privacy has been invaded.
Have you thought about the fact that one of the best selling motorcycle companie, Harley Davidson, designes motorcycles louder than most vehicles equipped with Flowmaster or any aftermarket muffler? But trying to force us to purchase what you want us to have you are in a way insulting us car enthusiests. When my mufflers rusted off, I had the opprotunity to spend lots of money installing a quiet kit with stock type mufflers, or spending a couple of hundred dollars and making my car more powerful, and more unique.
In my eyes somehow you feel this modifying of cars is directed at you or others to take notice and be annoyed. The truth is I do it because I enjoy the sound, and you should put up with it for the few seconds I am driving by your home. I feel all you want is for people to be lemmings in a way, and be driving the same basic transportation and have no actual way of expressing themselves. There are much more harmful ways I could get attention, and I chose to put a louder exhaust on my car.

Brian.

This is what I sent the moran! I tryed to be nice, and will probably get the same response as everyone else, telling us Americans are hated!

afterburn

::Screams:: Spell check!!

rezinn

There's this woman in my neighborhood at home that thinks I'm always racing and yells at me to slow down(going 15mph in a residential area) because my exhaust is loud. No, I'm not revving or driving fast, but obviously my car is going to make a bit more noise than her minivan, it having headers and full, street legal aftermarket exhaust. The same woman who forgot to set her parking brake and let her car roll backwards into someones garage where her car hit their lexus. Yup same woman with a minivan who lets her dog play on my lawn(thanks, yellow spots). It's ignorant people that know nothing about cars that are bothered by this. They see the news report on "hot rod hondas" and they hear them drive by and say hot rods really need to be stopped, when it's not even hot rods that are the majority of the problem.

I caught how that guy didn't recognize that aftermarket exhaust was already legal too, what an idiot.

92fire-audio

Yeah go try buying a house and hearing a loud car, then say "oh those damn loud cars depriciate the value.. I'll give you $5.."..

It's not like living under an airport for christs sake.. I emailed that sorry *** my thoughts.. He can kiss my *** and if I am ever around his house, I plan on driving by about 100 times in first gear at 7500 RPMS..

EAT A DICK MR HUBER!

Zeke3Elevn

Cool, makes me want to pipe every old person i see

EightyEightRS

well spoken! ;]

17camaro83

you see it's stupid people like that in this world that cause all the chaos. I wish there was a legal form of pimp slapping some sense into people like that mr. huber

pskel350

well i was pissed too so i had to email the jackazz. well here it is:

Michael

Well first of all i hope this isn't your whole job trying to outlaw loud mufflers. I read your article and i was extremly dissapointed in your shallow thinking. I am 18 and own a Camaro with a big V8 and a full exhaust system by Magna Flow, it is louder than the Flowmaster mufflers you are talking about. Flowmaster mufflers are from the 1960's, (ie. AMERICAN HISTORY) I even know that and I am only 18. Over 90% of the people in America would agree with me that your article is more annoying than loud American sportcars. If you dont like loud things like mufflers, where does it stop, killing every dog that barks, turning off police sirens, banning all music speakers in the world, and peddle your bike to work everyday. That sounds like an America with out any form of fun other than sitting at home doing nothin. Also exhaust systems get better gas milage than stock factory systems, that equals less gas used, in my book that is better than more gas used for stock factory systems. I think you should be worrying less about loud mufflers and more about something bad like drug use and underage pregnacy. Loud mufflers should be the last thing to worry about in the world today, at least the money didnt go towards drugs or something bad. Oh yeah, I never have gotten a ticket for either one of my loud cars and niether of them were stock factory systems.

-pat

ps. loud exhaust rulz




well i hope i get some dumba$$ to respond to me so i can make fun of him too.

chacane67

Just for the hell of it, I'll post my response to this individual, whom being unrelated to my e-mail to Mr.Huber, who felt it was required for him to respond. I think some of you got this same reply from him:

Just received a copy of your email to Mark Huber. I live on the other side of the world in New Zealand, and believe it or not, we get noise pollution problems from selfish automobile users too. Would you like it if I played loud classical music outside your bedroom window at 3 am?

I have considerable empathy for the American people in general, and totally support President Bush in his initiatives against terrorism. I am beginning to see however why America is hated in so many countries, if selfish morons like yourself are representative of it's people.

With freedom comes responsibility.

Rod Rowlands

**MY RESPONSE**

First of all Mr. Rowlands, if you would pull your head out of your *** and look at what the real problems are before you unjustly use your lack of intelligence and vocabulary, there might be something to learn from all if this. I am NO fan of loud, noisy and obnoxious vehicles, especially our prime suspects in the US- "The Import's" and to include motor cycles (yeah, even Harleys). I am a motor sport enthusiast and personally like to provide quite performance. But like your uninformed ignorance makes you out to be, just like the rest, who try everything they can to justify their sensitive point of view, geez thanks for your opinion. And to make you feel better, I love Classical music. I'll take that over a Honda and its 5 inch exhaust at 3:00am anytime.

Your empathy parallel's your ignorance. To point out this fact is to point out that the original e-mail was not even addressed to you at all, so why did you send me a reply !?!! Get back on the bus and go back to school. Reading your e-mail just shows the level of your education....or lack there of.

And I am so 'GLAD' you support MY President, geez we'll all sleep better at night knowing that. If your mouth is as big as your ego, get off your *** and do something to fight Terrorism, instead of replying to an e-mail that has nothing to do with YOU. Why are we hated? Its because you know that you and your country, along with SO many others, cant even take care of their own business and/or problems. It takes a country and its people THIS great to do all of the things you and yours can not. And WE think, your all jealous.

So maybe I do represent some of the people in this great Nation. Since I live here, I have a say. Since you don't, I'm guessing the responsibility that comes with freedom, is telling you to SHUT your pie hole! If you would like to voice your opinion, I guess after you move here and acquire a citizenship, some of us will lend you an ear. But until then, KEEP your mouth shut, because "Its selfish morons like yourself" (boy you're are a
true scholar) that give you Kiwi's the reputation that none of us want to have...... I worked with a few Kiwi's in Desert Storm, and other than their arrogance, they seemed to be good people. I guess your the exclusion to the rule. Think before you speak........

With freedom and its responsibility, also comes the knowledge of taking responsibility for the repercussions of your actions. Remember that.....Sleep tight sweetheart

Tom XXXX
United States Marine
Aerospace Engineer
Automotive Engineering Consultant

Bird_of_Prey

"people driving by at 3 am"..
*shrugs* it's just some 68 nova with a big block and exhaust cut outs comming back from the strip a bit late.. O.o

blame ricers.. they're the problems for most things (not import, but RICERS).. they got cops on full force on the street stopping us because "that tire there looks a bit bald.. i think i'll mesure the thread depth"... their the ones who are now bringing those tree huggers towards us..
like ****, who needs a 130 decible car (at 2000 rpm)?? i'm pretty sure that 70 decible would be achevable at that rpm and still be considered LOUD..
i agree with the tips thing..

92 Formula

iTrader: (2)

This is nothing but horse crap. None of my cars have anything remotely close to a stock exhaust, and as a Virginian, they never will either. I have been pulled over once in my '73 which is quite loud. The State Trooper looked under the car, apparently expecting cut outs, and while the exhaust was clearly not stock, including headers, he let me go once he saw there were no cut outs. He even complimented me about the car. I think some Police Officers might be a jerk enough to write you up, but I think it would be rare.

It really gets under my craw, however, when you have these complete morons doing stuff like this. In my mind, trivial.

I can remember back in the late '80 early '90's when the big thing was against aftermarket car stereo systems...always something.

V6canvas

iTrader: (1)

This is what I have sent him:

Mr. Huber,

I just read an article about you and your group this evening and am quite shocked at the level of ignorance found within. I personally have a Pontiac Trans Am with a 350 cubic inch v-8 engine. It has a high flow catalytic converter and a Flowmaster 30 series muffler installed. Following your logic, I have a noisy, overbearing exhaust that should be bannished from the land. Presumably I would have a lot of complaints from my neighbors, who's property values I have been lowering. The truth is, I have never once had someone tell me that my car was too noisy, in fact I have had many compliments, not only from my friends, but many of my neighbors have praised my car for its good looks and pleasant exhaust note too. In case you are wondering, there isn't a house that would sell for less than $270,000 in my area, so I'm sure someone would say something if they felt that their investment was at risk.

I'm not sure what a non-factory type exhaust is, but last time I checked, both factory systems and mine have pipes coming from the engine down to the catalytic converter, then through a pipe which leads to a chambered muffler which then is routed out the back of the vehicle. As far as how loud my car is, please let me come over to your house and if you hear me before I pull into your driveway, I'll fix my squeaky brakes. Also, if you cannot stand listening to my car for the 10 seconds that it is in earshot as it rolls past your house, you need to turn on the radio. Level one or two should do it, or perhaps you could start a conversation with someone, that would create enough noise to not notice my car. If you really want to hear very loud cars attend a CART or NASCAR race, this should put things in perspective for you. Then, start telling the people there how all that noise is lowering the track property owner's land values.

Do you really have nothing better to do with your time than go on a crusade against aftermarket exhaust systems? Are the nation's drug use, teen pregnancy rates or violence problems not enough of a challenge for you? I would have thought that someone with as much commitment as you obviously have could have found a more worthy cause.


Steve

KagA152

iTrader: (5)

tree huggers

maybe the noise they make protesting is disturbing me, even though my car isnt loud, i have all intentions of making it loud. i live in the U.S.A., i have the freedom to do that, dont i? all the cars i hear that are annoyingly loud are either 1. ricers 2. people who drive crap cars with no mufflers because they rusted and fell off. i live on a rather busy road, so i get lots of cars going by, and the thing that gets me the most is people with their stereos really loud. dont get me wrong, i love music, but it doesnt have to be that loud to be enjoyed. owell, im just blabbing now, im done

stupid hippies

FLYNLOW92rs

iTrader: (53)

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THIS GUY............






.........Who needs flowmaster exhaust, just cut the damn noise polluting mufflers off and put a pipe there.........that's what i did...... ......According to this guy, I'm helping his cause......

92fire-audio

In honor of this assclown, I say we do a group buy on exhaust cutouts!

LOL..

CobraKiller

ugh..this kind of crap makes me too mad to even think about replying to this *** clown. When they wanted to make aftermarket exhaust illegal in my state i sure as hell wrote alot of letters to alot of people against it...bleh it's people like this moron that will give me high bloodpressure. NOT my LS1 breathing through a flowmaster. That gives me joy.

Zeke3Elevn

Saw some old people today, thinking about what mr. huber said i piped em and they gave me that "uhh damn kids" look haha

Nic

Stuff like that doesn't help our cause any.