Limpperi

Anyone has even a tiniest clue how fast a 1991 Formula 350 with 300hp and 450 lb ft would do the 1/4 mile? tires are 255/50 R16 and no weight reductions etc etc. It has the four-speed automatic w/ OD. (700r4) stock gears and so on.

13,5:ish? or even faster? slower? any toughts? no race tracks near so i could test it out.. car has 80k miles on it and it runs really great, like a new!

midias

What did you do to it to get 300 hp and 450 tq?

I would guess a 13.5is

Limpperi

it has headers, heads, manifold, mild cam, atleast. not many other things to my mind. last owner did these. V8 magazine (finnish american car magazine) had once a camaro with exact same mods and it had a bit over 300hp and 450 lb ft and my car has same parts so..

Indeed you read right, exhaust is still to be bought

Phenom-1

For '91 & '92 Stock the L98 with 240hp/340lbs torque & 3.23 gears & 700r4 could pull out a 14.5 1/4 mile time under great conditions, so I think 300hp is good for breaking 14 down to the 13 number, and am extra 110lbs of torque could possibly make it to the mid 12s if a stock LS1 Trans Am with 325hp/350trq hits 13.5 1/4 mile with a 6sp, then with 300hp/450trq & some 17" SS or WS6 wheels you could get into the 12.8 - 12.7 1/4 I would say.

89IrocZ350TPI

Are we talking rear wheel hp/tq here? or flywheel?

Limpperi

flywheel hp/tq

neeb_usmc

iTrader: (2)

thats what I was going to ask

89IrocZ350TPI

With your mods you are probably around 260rwh / 350rwt. I would guess low 13's, but there are alot of other factors skill/conditions/weather/ect.


Also you cant compare the numbers to a stock ls1 because the numbers were underrated to make the covette look better. All ls1's have 350hp at the engine.

paul_huryk

300hp out of a 350 - yes... 450lb-ft out of the same motor - not likely...

Still, 300hp is a mid 13 second car if everything works right together.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Stock GTA here on this vid. mid 14's. The while car obvously.

So Id say yes a 300BHP= 240RWHP assuming 20% drivetrain loss with a 700R. I would assume it would make 13's easy, but there are so many factors like others said as to weither it would be a low 13 sec car or a high 13 sec car. And 450 Tq?? If you have tq like that and no slicks, its going to come down to your launch weither the race is good or just horrible.

Curious but do you happend to know what its race weight would be??

92droptopws6

iTrader: (10)

You are definitely gonna have to run at the track...... I can see good 60' flesh with Tq numbers like that.
My silver Z was a bolt on Lt1 6spd 320hp/336tq and ran 12.9@106 with DA at3000+ feet
3560lbs.

Kevin Lee 487

High 13s sounds like the best bet.

The best running stock LT1s can pull high 13s out in the right conditions and they have 275hp/325tq at the crank.

Auto LT1s put 231 to the wheels on average.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

With TPI it can EASILY make that kind of torque at the flywheel. My very mild 9:1 383 put down 425 ft/lbs to the rear wheels through a 700r4 with an unlocked 2,800 stall 2.5 str converter, a heavy 2 piece driveshaft with carrier bearing, and 9.5" corporate 14 bolt rear end. Even if I am only losing 18% through the drivetrain that was 540+ ft/lbs of torque. A 350 would easily make 430-450 setup the same way. I had a weak 350 TBI that wasn't even at 9:1 compression with its 18cc dished pistons, running a little tiny GM LT4 camshaft, an edelbrock 3704 TBI performer, a small block 2 bbl TBI unit and a set of doug thorley headers. It dyno'd 253 RWHP and 325 RWTQ through an unlocked 2,800 stalled 700r4, a heavy 2 piece driveshaft with carrier bearing, and 9.5" ring gear GM corporate 14 bolt rear end. I estimate the little 8.75:1 compression TBI 350 was 310 HP and 400 TQ at the flywheel. TPI easily adds 20-30 ft/lbs over the TBI in the midrange.

You haven't been around the track much have you???

I race with a GIRL that had a bone stock down to the paper filter 1997 LT1/Auto Camaro that ran 13.40s @ 101-102 on street rubber. I have seen a LT1 Corvette run even better. I have another buddy that had his 97 Camaro SS with SLP loudmouth exhaust and K&N drop in on a Mustang Dyno and made nearly 270 RWHP/310 RWTQ.

Kevin Lee 487

Every piece of info I've seen on Camaro Z28.com and Ls1lt1.com puts LT1s at high 13s - high 14s which sounds about right considering L98 thirdgens ran mid to high 14s and the LT1s don't have much more power while being the same weight.

I'm not calling you a liar or anything, its just what I've read from multiple sources. You'll have to excuse us if anyone else finds 13.4 in a bone stock auto 97 LT1 run as good as lightly modded LS1s...

GenX'Motorsport

F-Body stock auto LT1's mid 14's Corevettes lower 14's to high 13's.
The chick is either lying, or dosent know about the Hotcam, headers, stall and tune the car would have to have to run a 13.4

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

Agreed. My buddies friend brought his 95 T/A auto to the track one day with us, and ran 14.5 all day long, every run. My dad also owned a 95 T/A for 2 years, and also a 92 Vette LT1. He never had them at the track, but those times feel right for them when compared to my GTA with the butt dyno. Not sure she would need the stall or cam, but intake, headers, emissions delete, better gears, and tune would probably get her there, like it did me with my L98.

89rs454

Is that the same with the LT1s? or did we get the Sh8tty end of the stick.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Nope no cams, no stall or any of that. Its literally the way it rolled down the line. A well driven LT1 corvette is a mid 13 second car. Hell the 91 TPI Vettes ran 14.00. I have also seen a stock LB9 1LE car run 13.90 as well.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

Sorry dude and no offense, but I call bull. You show me a video of a dead stock factory auto LT1 F body hitting 13.4's, and I'll believe it. And if it is the way they came, you shouldn't have trouble finding quite a few. I also want to see a dead stock factory LB9 hit 13's.

paul_huryk

A 383 is going to have a pretty large TQ advantage over a 350 in every case, if not more. The thing is that while TPI boost midrange, it limits airflow to a relatively low TQ peak rpm and volumetric efficiency across the board. I have seen and heard of a few 450 TQ 350s, but they were higher revving engines (none were TPI motors) with higher RPM TQ peaks and volumetric efficiency.

89rs454

If this thing can get into the 13s then i'm ******* sure a stock Lt1 could break 13s some way some how. https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/orga...o-my-84-h.html

ninetyone

iTrader: (2)

what heads are on it?

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

He has drag radials, 4.10 gears, a 2800 stall converter, no cat, and UD's, so not stock.
The guy says a factory bone stock LT1 auto F body on street tires can do 13.4, and a stock LB9 3rd gen can hit 13's, and I say bull. My GTA is only 35 HP short of an LT1 from the factory, and I made up for that plus more with just the intake and tune, and still only ran a 14.2. Now that I am full bolt on and making well above a stock LT1, have taken some weight off, and have a better gear ratio than an auto L98 or LT1 can even have from the factory, I still only ran a mid 13 on my one run out. And if magazines say they can only get a 15.1 out of a 92 B4C L98, then I doubt the less powerful LB9 is ever touching 13's dead stock. https://www.thirdgen.org/adhering_law_autoweek_may_1992

89rs454

here is just a hint of proof it can happen, he has slicks but don't we all.




I can go on on and lol theirs alot of proof backing up my claim.
In a thirdgen it could be couple of tenths faster because it's lighter car with better aerodynamics imo.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

I don't see a timeslip, or view of the clock.

http://www.dragtimes.com/Chevrolet-C...lip-13262.html (stock)

http://www.dragtimes.com/Pontiac-Tra...lip-23392.html (shift kit,stall, slicks)

http://www.dragtimes.com/Pontiac-Tra...lip-21576.html (stock)

http://www.dragtimes.com/Pontiac-Tra...lip-13917.html (stock 6 spd.)

I know with some tires and a driver, high 13's could be done in an LT1, but no way am I gonna believe a 13.4 dead stock on steet rubber like he said.

89rs454

Have you ever heard of the term Factory alien?

89rs454

In the right conditions with a manual 6spd are you really going to tell me a stock LT1 couldn't break into the 13s? It's beyond all comprehension how simple this sounds with the right driver.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

now here we go with the factory freak talk. No car got built that magically and for no reason has an extra 75 HP over the rest of them, sorry.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

Dude, pay attention. I already said I know it could do a high 13, but not a 13.4. And this isn't about manuals, he said auto on street rubber.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

40-50°F weather and negative DA makes a huge difference. My hemi ram was 3-4 tenths quicker in the 1/8 in -500 da as opposed to 3500+ in the summer. My bone stock 2012 Titan crew cab rated at 317 hp at t'he flywheel went 14.7 @ 93 despite weighing in over 5350 lbs with me in the drivers seat in 200 da. I later ran a 15.03 @92 with a cai and catback exhaust in 2200 da. I then put a programmer on it and ran 14.50s almost all summer in 2,800-3,100 da. As soon as it cooled down again it went 14.20s @ 96 mph. If I can get low 14s in a 5350 lbs truck that only makes 295 rwhp I think a car that makes near 250 rwhp and weighs 1500 lbs less will more than be able to run mid 13s.

89rs454

So out of all the Lt1s with auto not one of them ever could have pulled off 6 tenths of a second faster then the rest are you kidding me? No way a perfect launch could have happened and bam 13.4s came out of that b*tch? No way no how huh the meaning of drag racing is anything can happen. It might be one and a million but were arguing over 6-8 tenths of a second here.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I have witnessed variations in cars that would amount to more than 50 hp difference between two stock cars. Some just run better than others. Its called tolerance stacking.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I have the numbers from the slip and she went 13.46 @ 101.68 on a 1.84s 60'. My quad cab Hemi Ram went 13.592 @ 98.40 on a 1.98s 60'. I got her at the light but broke out of my 13.60 dial. She has no reason to lie, she has been a friend for a while, runs as part of the TMCC races, and no way would her dad would let her mod a V8 camaro for a 23 year old college girl driver. Its stock and sounds identical to the LT1 camned Vortec I ran for months in my G-van.

I guess this new Stock Coyote Mustang I watched run down Dallas dragway a few fridays ago didn't run 12.70s with dealer tags on it either, lmao. LT4 Vette went 12.90s out there too.

89rs454

Right on man i believe you, I think that dude had a problem because you said she was a girl driver.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

Then if it is so easy and can happen, why can't I find one on dragtimes it happened to? The only guys there anywhere near those times have mods and slicks. Plus as I said, I didn't just fall off the damn truck. I've been drag racing for 15+ years, and it all started in the LT1 days. I also know about weather, but even at -500 DA I don't see an auto dead stock LT1 hitting 13.4 on street tires.
It's all common sense. Look at all the times on dragtimes in the mid 13's for a LT1 F body, and all of them have mods. There is one on there at 300 ft. DA and mods like headers and tune, and still only running 13.6.
I'm going to bed man, been fun arguing with you lol.

89rs454

Motor trend and car and driver, and all them boys averaged there drag times out, they even said in one episode that they got some blow out times that was way faster then others. What are you trying to prove here man? It's your word against his, your being an As$hole.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

Whatever man, you guys can go on believing what you want. I'm one of 3 people who posted up already and said those times are unbelievable, but I guess none of us here have any clue what we are talking about.
Either way, I'm done with the conversation. I'm proved my point over and over, nothing left to say.

AND BTW, Dragtimes.com, not motor trend. Real timeslips, from real cars. No averages.

Limpperi

Edelbrock heads

ninetyone

iTrader: (2)

4th gen Lt1 is a low 14 sec. car

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Maybe in the heat of summer in Denver, LMAO. 0-60 is 5.8 seconds and the 1/4 mile usually comes in the high 13s although some run better.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

You didn't prove anything other than you know how to run your mouth. Real cars in varying weather conditions, varying overall conditions and states of tunes. I've seen stock LT1 cars lose 25 RWHP from weak valve springs and over 40 RWHP from bad optisparks that were still driving decently around town.

ninetyone

iTrader: (2)

a 5.8 0-60 is usually good for a lower 14 in the 1/4. Plus an Lt1 4th gen only traps 98mph in the 1/4.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

And the only thing you ever proved is you know how to mod crap that shouldn't be bothered with, and post in threads about it just to make yourself feel good, with no point to make. Every statement you make, you seem to either add 20 HP or drop .5 seconds under what the norm should be. I'd sure like to use that magic dyno and dragstrip you have.
You now have 3 people agreeing with my point of view, and 1 for you. I have done nothing but states facts, math, and proof, compared to you and your LT1 fanboy with nothing but mouth and meaningless videos that show nothing. Not looking good for imaginary land.
There is no excuses for what can be found on www.dragtimes.com. You find me on there a dead stock, down to the air filter auto LT1 F body that can do 13.4, and I'll apologize. Until then, your just talking dumb crap for attention to me. They have calculators on there for DA and a bunch of other stuff too. Try using them, and maybe you'll know why I'm not buying your crap.

budfreak1

iTrader: (7)

Specs for a 95 LT1 T/A are 14.0@100, and that is with a 6 spd.. I have it memorized, considering I grew up loving F bodies in the 90's, and my dad had one. And as I said already, my buddies friend brought his 95 auto to the track, and ran 14.5 all day dead stock. I want to see the weather conditions and meet the driver that can make up 1.1 seconds in a dead stock car.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Your opinon on what I mod is MEANINGLESS TO ME!!! A 305 HP LT1 dynos around 250 RWHP, more than enough to push a LT1 F-car to the mid 13s with decent traction.

The ones that break into the 13s STOCK are all bashed on by those that can't get there. PLENTY OF THEM ARE THERE AND ON VIDEO... WAKE UP






I also dyno on a Mustang Dyno these days and it is definately stingy compared to a Dynojet.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Hell better tell this guy that has a G92 equipped TPI 305 that he could only run a 15.1 bone stock. Got news the G92 1LE car that made it into the 13s was even lighter than this one.

ninetyone

iTrader: (2)

g92 and 1LE are basically the same. 14.7 is pretty good by the way for one of those.

project89

iTrader: (1)

just take it to the track and find out
my car runs very bottom 12's with 270rwhp and 370rwtq at a weight of 3455

Kevin Lee 487

Stock early LT1s with an auto dyno 230. I doubt an LT1 SS/WS6 dynos anything under 270 at the wheels. And no, they won't run mid 13s unless the conditions are absolutely perfect. Most LS1s run mid 13s and they have over 300 at the wheels. All of them. Assuming they're running correctly of course.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Another hypothetical bench racing statement. I have seen bone stock B-car engines make 218-230 at the wheels and they had a smaller cam, rated at 260 HP as well as automatics and a heavier 8.5" ring & pinon. Not all LS1s will dyno over 300 RWHP and I bet most of them will not touch 300 HP on a Mustang Dyno thats not inflated like a dynojet. I saw a LS2 powered G8 with an intake and catback exhaust not even hit 300 RWHP on a Mustang Dyno recently.

I doubt you see any dual cat LT1 auto or manual dyno under 260 RWHP/300 RWTQ. That is plenty of power to put the car into the mid 13s on a good day and low 13s on a great day with good track preap. I have seen several LS1s run low 13s in stock form.