whats your opinion of a modified car?

how do you determine the difference between that and a highly modified?

what can possibly be above highly modified?



i was out the other day going over classifications for a major show and while speaking with one of the heads we had quite a difference on what the word modified means.

many shows have classifications like stock, street, modified, etc. what do these mean to you? when do you know you have a particular class of vehicle? too comon today the car show scene tends to lead towards 3 or more subtle modifications as a modified car.

a typical example is a show that classifies a stereo headunit change, chrome valve covers, and tail light blackouts as a modified car. while i don't agree with this, it seems to be more becoming as the car show scene grows.

 

I agree with you on that one, modified to me is not chrome valve covers, air cleaner, ect... to me modified should be major modification to a vehicle. like flared fenders, suicide doors, 4th gen dash in a third gen, things like that.

 

Im dont really have a "highly modified" car but my opinion of this would be:
Modified: some slight changes to the car, K&N filter, plugs, wires, shocks, throttle body air foil, exhaust, ect....just small yet effective things.
Highly Modified: I think this would go into detail meaning: Large tube runners, headers, SuperRam or Stealth Ram, stroker kit, blower, 32 valve LT5..lol....like the pic i saw of that camaro. Just major mods to the engine and custom body work. IMO.

IMO and im not putting anyone down on this at all......just my opinion but i wouldnt call a car "modified" or "highly modified" if someone installed a comp chip or had one custom burned. I think that building a motor so that it puts out alot of power....can handle it all.....and was built to do what your asking it to do....thats modification. If a factory built a motor to run a certain way you should leave it at that...not modify the chip so that the comp gets different signals. IMO though...just my O.

 

modified to me means that something minor has been done, rims, exhaust, etc. just my$.02


Tim:rockon

 

i see this as a very simple subject, but i constantly run into differences with others.

original is as it came from the factory wether it has 100,000 miles or 10. if it's all original to the tires then it's original.

stock is everything in stock form. you could replace your original tires with the exact same but new and be stock.

street is anything that has been "modified" in minor ways....you change the stereo, add an exhaust, add a shifter, anything that is moderate yet still closer to stock form.

modified is anything that you have done to alter it from stock in a major way. example being a body modification, drivetrain swap, major interior overhaul, etc.

i think the lines of modified and heavily modified are really kind of silly............you should either be modified or not. why should a car with a fully tubbed out rear and tubular front end be in the same class as a car with 18's and a 2,500 dollar stereo?

 

I agree with you, I see that all the time at shows. I just don't understand how bolt ons can classify you into modified.

 

I agree, some shows with my truck I was in mild, others I was in wild, were now im in radical.

I like the show at greenville mississippi put on buy associated minis.

Different mods count as different points.

Where shaving, body drops, engine swaps, bagged/hydro created more points (say like 20) where bolt on crap like lights, air filters, etc was less points (say 1-5).

Then add up all the points, and had 4 classes

Just as "representation"

1-20 points, "stock"
20-60 points, "mild"
60-90 points, "wild"
90+ points, "radical"

I had so many other minor mods, engine, and body mods, I had just a lowered suspension and was being put in radical along with fully bagged/body dropped trucks. I didn't have a chance, but I like the system they used. I started being creative and doing mods that wasn't on the list, but "stood out" so it wouldn't count towards points, but looked cool.

 

I think for stock is stock. like if u change ur air filter to a K&N its still stock.

for a mod. vehicle i would say. mild to major engine work, drivetrain swap, anything that is a big step up from stock interior. like from stock seats to reacro (sp) seats or some name brand.

now highly mod. for me would be a blown alcohol camaro thats set up to run 7's (tubbed out and tube chassie ,etc.) to me thats highly modded.

my car i would say is modded its got drivetrain parts swap, mild motor work done to it, the interior hasnt changed besides a swap from a 86 sport coupe just becuz it was a parts car and had a black interior but they might change soon. but the only thing that is modded on the external of the car is the hood, i consider that a mod since your replacing a stock factory piece with something that never came from the factory for our cars.

thats my opion (sp) on this

 

This is an excellent topic.

I'm not really sure of how to answer. I agree with your point of view in that modified is modified, but there also has to be something to seperate the two.

Some of us try so hard make our cars original, some try so hard to keep them original.

Think about that for a minute, and then try to decide how to seperate everyone in between into show categories.

 

It depends on interpretation of the word 'modified'. If you interpret it strictly, then anything that has been changed, even just a head unit or blackouts, is a modification. If you interpret it loosely, then only major changes, like drivetrain or interior would be considered 'modified'. Either way, there will always be grey areas as to whats what.

I do agree though, that a car with just a new head unit and blackouts shouldn't be considered 'modified'.

 

but if someone has an all original car and then theres someone tryin to make there car orignial its still considered not modified becuz ur just replacein factory parts with stock factory replacemnt parts to keep it lookin orignial.

and if u were put into classes the car weather its originally stock or u worked on it to keep it all stock u would still be put in a origianl or stock class.

 

look to my post above as i see those classifications as the "only" way to do.

i certainly welcome some constructive criticism as to change my mind though.

1982chevycamaroz28, an all original car is one that has absolutely nothing changed since it was picked up new from the date of purchase. you can have an original car with all stock parts, but you can't have a stock car with all original parts. it's either original or it's stock. if you have to replace something no matter what it is that piece is no longer original.........the piece may be identical to the original and a stock form, but it isn't original to the car.

i agree that something as insignificant as a switch shouldn't keep you out of original; however if you have a 69 ss with a rebuilt 396 it may be stock but it isn't original.

i'm not picking your statements apart, you just bring up valid points that most are trying to make and i don't see it as vague.

i don't agree with your K&N comment either simply because a K&N is not only an aftermarket product but it performs differently then original manufacturer intentions. while i don't think a single air filter should keep you from stock classifications; i do think it should keep you out of original and enough of these little "mods" should definately put you in a street class.

you are all making valid points and i greatly appreciate everyone's input and if it seems like i'm trying to push buttons i am. i want to know everyones opinions and it's the only way to do so. many shows make more general classifications to keep the classes larger for the contestants......while this is nice, shows that have large showings shouldn't do this i don't think. do you?

 

OK, here's one for ya'....

How would YOU classify Redraif? ...and how would you classify yourself?

I don't know most of the rules.....but I'm sure that for every show, and every rule, there'd be some guy with some car that got the short end of the stick.

 

I'm going to add to the pot a little....

My goal for my car is this. I wan't it to look stock. However, there are things that I think would've looked better than stock, that still have that "stock/factory" look. Confused? Let me explain.

Joe guy on the street who sees a thirdgen with 18" chrome TT2's knows that there not stock. They look fantastic in my opinion, but they are nowhere near stock. Now take 17" aftermarket Iroc rims. Polished up all nice with grey or black accents, just like the original iroc rims. That's what I like. You're almost not sure if it came that way. That's the kind of mods I like. The one's that make you do a double take. 4th gen exhaust tips. Anniversery stripes. Custom badges. etc. etc.

Now that's no where near original, and not quite stock.....certainly modified, but where does it fit in? I probably couldn't stand up to "modified" judging....because it hardly would LOOK modified, but it's certainly not stock, because judges would look for factory options/wheels/tips, etc. Everyone has there own idea and goal in mind, and it can't always fit into a category I guess.

Scott Moyer...who has that beautiful ORIGINAL Iroc, said recently that he lost a point in judging because he used some touch-up paint on some minor little chips, and that was considered restoration. Does that mean he shouldn't strive to keep his car perfect? From a judges standpoint, YES, that's exactly what it means. But I'll tell you what, I'm gonna be out there with the touch-up!!!

I'm not sure what my point is, just throwin' in some food for thought.

I'd be curious to hear more of Scott's opinion on this topic.

 

i forget what classification scott was in but if it was original then it was fair!

however....touch up paint is a deduction no matter what because it's imperfection in any category. while to note it as restoration leaves it room for a stock class or essentially a stock/restored class which is what i believe he was in.

scotts car is truly beautiful....it is in every possible way one of the finest examples of an iroc. however in an original classification it isn't going to do as well as say a 100 mile vehicle. it just isn't possible.

that's why in certain shows like camaro superfest where this was debated they have a trailerd and a driven version of all 4 classifications to keep things fair. why should scotts 10,000 mile iroc go against john does 12 mile iroc with the packaging still on the seats?

Abubaca, you make a very good point and i'm glad you brought them up.

redraifs car is modified to just about every extent......if a certain area isn't, it will be.

my car is street........however because so many things here and there have been slightly altered they consider it modified. this is why i don't agree.

your car as you describe your wants would also be classified as street in my eyes.

a street car is modifying to any major extent yet keeping the general lines and looks to the car. just because i change the shade of my red does that mean i have a heavily modified car? no! it means i have a nice street car that will do better than the average 100,000 mile car with original paint.

however, if i were to say mold my gfx's to blend into the car and go as extreme to add graphics of sorts then yes i'd say the body is modified.

i think a certain classification requires a number of major mods that apply to each in order to move on. if you are to "tub" out a 86 iroc but leave everything stock you should be put in modified......why? well you have gone way out of your way to alter at least 3 major pieces of the vehicle.

there are only so many categories you can truly put a vehicle.

1. driveline
2. suspension
3. body
4. interior
5. paint and wheels can be broken up into the other categories or used as individual sections.

this is typically why shows have the "best of" classes that way people who prefer to go on in a particular area can do so without fear.

again it comes down to the whole point..........who wants to be in the same category as a fully custom show truck when all you did was put some 18's and a in-dash tv? at the same time that guy who spent 80,000 to make his truck truly unique doesn't want to be in the same class as someone who's just starting in the game with a new set of rims and tires.

like i said, i'm not looking to get into it with everyone. i would love for someone to make a valid point against any of my arguments so i can understand that it's more than making it so everyone can play.

seriously, what would you think if i told you i won best of show highly modified and all i did was throw some chrome valve covers and some simulated disc brakes in order to attend?

 

I understand completely, but I think that you'll never see complete equality.....and there's no clear cut "fair" way to do it.

I was at a SuperChevy show a few years back at "TheRock" here in NC and a spotless Y2K vette won "best vette". I'm not sure how it technically won, but it was certainly not my choice. I almost wish there was a way to measure your dedication and appreciation for your car. ...but i'll keep wishin'...

 

 

I believe that the people with truely "modified" cars dont try to classify them into modified car catagories. Worry about how you build your car, worry about how you drive your car, but dont worry about what you call your car. It's a Camaro [or bird] and that's all that matters.

 

just a topic that's open for discussion........nothing more, nothing less.


i completely agree with what all of you are saying; just like to hear ideas from other people thats all.

 

To me, a stock class should mean stock...everything should be either original, or an exact reproduction. No Overrestoration either...which often means runs, oversprayed parts, wavy quarters (Corvettes). If a car is overrestored, poorly restored, or has incorrect parts or finishes, it should still be considered stock class...it just won't be a winner.

Street class should be similar, but with a handful of bolton changes...stereo, wheels/tires, exhaust, aftermarket shifters, etc. Lots of cars that people consider "restored" would fall in this category.

Modified would be the same, only with more obvious changes like nonstock material in the interior, different induction, bolton body mods like hoods and spoilers. Nonstock colors also.

Pro Street...anything sticking through the hood (tunnel ram, blower, etc), narrowed rearends, full cages, etc. Also engine swaps into vehicles they were never offered from the factory in (big block 3rd gens, small block Fieros and S10s, etc)

Mild custom...like modified, but with shaved handles, gas fillers, antennas, drip rails (older cars), filled seams, etc. Any body mod that isn't a bolt on, but doesn't require major surgery. I'd put Redraif's car in this category, since someone brought it up. Candy or other type custom paint.

Full custom...chopped tops, channeling, sectioning, suicide or gullwing type doors, convertible conversions (vehicles that there wasn't a factory convertible made, like 66 Nova or 70 Monte Carlo for example). Basically anything that makes a permanent modification to the body shell.

 

I know I was amazed at the cars that ended up in the class with me at the TA nats. There were cars that were stock except for a stereo and hood. They don't need to be in heavy modified, but they were. It was this point system...they counted things like window tint, emblems, parts stickers, each minor color change (4th gen camaro mirrors painted body color versus black) Nit picky crap. And they placed you according to point totals. But a aftermarket hood threw you in heavily modified...crazy! The problem was tehy counted stupid little stuff. If you count stupid little stuff, you need to have catagories that are not 1-3 and 4-8 mods, etc... they should be more like 1-20 Stock, 20-40 modified...etc...and yes big things like engine swaps or after market hoods, or exotic paints shopuld be worth more then just a point.

One car I see that has a hard time is the GTAuto car. It has a wild paint job and a hood and spoiler, maybe rims... (can't remember the rims) Anyway...it gets thrown in heavily modified with me. Now they have a stock motor, and interior...so Either I need to be in a higher level, or they need to be in a lower level.

I see catagories like LT1Guy. He and I have had many conversations about it at shows. Kandied I think there are catagories beyond modified...I think we would do some good for light and heavy modified. A few bolt ons to a boat load of bolt ons and minor chroming. One or 2 big changes could land you here with an other wise stock car...Rims, hood, engine dress up, interior trim painting...

But there should be mild custom and full/wild custom, defined as LT1guy said....

Crazy engines and tubbing...ProStreet

Kandied...your paint is always going to put you in classes with me, even though the car has a very light modified look. I would put you in Modified based on your major mod being paint and having some other stuff thrown in. I have never seen your stereo set up so I can't say how radical it is....

Me...now with the new paint and being all shaved...I don't really think of my car as a custom, but there are enough mods (in Number) to put me there. But I would say light Custom. And yes every part of my car has been tweeked, even the engine now, but there are no major body mods. Its not bagged with 18-19 inch rims and a wild custom $10,000 paint job. Its not chopped or even a targa.

The 82...full on Custom...Targa, paint, 18, maybe 19 in rims... and a custom dash will definately make it so...

 

19's....my 18's are huge, your crazy!

as far as classes i know it's a blurred line when considering all the many possible solutions. i just don't see the point of having such a radical grading system.

just like you say with your car on how it's modified........does that mean that street should have a heavy street and a mild street?

true everyone should have a place in the game but not everyone deserves a trophy. were not talking about little township car shows. i'm talking state wide money winning shows like we have here in michigan. you can't afford to have 10,000 dollars in give aways and keep the cost of the show down. i know going into a show i'm not going to compete with someone who has 100,000 into there car and i don't want to do the same to someone just starting out.

you keep it nice and simple yet very straight to the point and the lines will be followed. when it comes to money everything must be black and white. while i share your interest to have all the different levels i do think that it can be to much. a car should be one thing or another. as far as custom or mild custom is concerned i agree that those are places cars can fit, however if someone is to go that far then those are the type of cars that are up for "best of show" or many of the other typical "best of" awards that you see.

i guess i just see things alot different which is fine, it brings different perspectives to everyone. i'm glad all of you are sharing the way you as it helps me to understand why things are the way they are.

 

Well I'm still only 2 years into showing and I have yet to hit any $ shows. They don't offer them around here. But for a large structured show, I believe there should be a guideline that everyone uses to determine classing. That way people could build a car to compete in a certain type of class. It just when you follow this vision you have, esp me... I tend to do things in way I come up with. I adapt versus buying aftermarket parts. So it always makes me hard to class.

My frustration is simply the inconsitancies from show to show....SLAP versus NOPI versus Whitlee versus the TA shows versus local shows....they are all different and have their own rules. Though I am about to the point that everyone sees me as a Custom. Lets everyone have a set of rules that all shows follow for classing.

Nopi in Atl still thinks the car is modified (no chopping, major body kit, bagging, insane stereo sys, or leather interior make over), but NOPI in TN. says custom (shaved, and # of changes). Now NOPI in Atl has a insane amount of modified cars because of this...in there case they need light and heavy to break it up...They have a stock class as well, but I really don't know what the cut off is. The Judges usually decide where you should go...In 3 years I have seen it break down tyipically like this: Usually there are 3-4 people in stock, 25-30 in modified and 1-2 in custom... Insane...each year I ask why I did not place, I'm told I was placed in the wrong class according to my mods. But its truely all politics in ATL. TN loves my car, but it is non NOPI affiliated group that judges.