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iTrader: (6)

I'm hoping to start taking my Camaro out to the local AutoX again soon. One thing that has been on my wish list for years is a front brake upgrade. I still have the stock 10.5" disks that came my '82. The only real"upgrade" up front is carbon metallic pads. I have 4th gen, LT1, PBR's in back.

This is not a daily driver. It never has any thing but DOT race tires on it. Current wheels are 17x9 with 275-40-17 all the way around. Comfort, noise and all the things that people like in street cars are of no concern to me.

I'm not concerned with matching the rear brakes, as those are bound to be upgraded again at some point. The front disks are the weakest link and I want them to instead be the strongest.

In looking over the commercially available brake upgrades, the 5th gen 14" Brembo brakes seem to be the best choice. I am aware that they likely will not fit my current rims.

I am also wondering if the added weight of the 14" rotor and the heavier 18" rims that will probably be needed might offset the gains in braking power over something like the all too common C5 brake upgrade.

If anyone has any auto X experience with the 5th gen Camaro brakes, I would like to hear from you.

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

No wouldn't offset the gains in breaking you there are some light weight wheel options in 18 and 17" ctw wheels specifically granted the 14" is a heavy setup as compared to the wilwood 4 piston setup

Read pbr setup is more than enough
Brembo will over power tires tho depending on tire choice so recommend stickier and wider but I'm bias and like squared 10+ all around

C5 would be a cheaper and far better than stock

There is also the c7 brembo setup that fits under 17s no problem and is slightly smaller than 14"

esc

iTrader: (6)

Hi Zach,

Thanks for the input.

C5 is what everyone is doing. I want more.
I may consider the C7 option.

I only run DOT race tires, so traction is good, even with measly 275-40's up front. Right now, I have WAY more traction than brake up front.

I would like to go with a wider wheel, but light weight wheels that will hold up to DOT race tires while going around corners can be elusive. I've destroyed (warped/cracked) many sets of aluminum wheels.

As far as the weight, it is (unsprung weights effect on handling and rotational momentum's effect on acceleration) vs increased stopping power that I am concerned with. Just trying to find a good compromise.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

This will fit, behind the right wheel. Needs a ton of spoke clearance. I have 2 sets, one with hawks red padlets, the others with red 1pc pads. Works just fine and sure brakes a hell of a lot better than the C5s which are a lot better than the stockers. You may want to consider the C6Z51 setup, uses a 13 something rotor, larger than the C5. All you need is the C6 abutments and rotors (and they are directional L & R, unlike the oem Z06 which are directional but they are both the same so one is reversed)

esc

iTrader: (6)

Which calipers are those?

572_Rat

I just purchased the Wilwood 140-11275-D and upgraded the caliper to the new Dynapro 6a 6 piston calipers for just over 1000.00, if this interest you I will give you the name of a guy you can talk to since this is a custom package

paul_huryk

You only really need a 13" kit with 4 piston calipers - 2pc rotors if you generate enough heat to warp 1pc rotors. 14" is overkill and complicates things in terms of weight and wheel selection.

As a point of reference, a kit like mentioned above will stop a 3rd gen from 60 to 0 in about 100 feet on 275-40-17 summer tires. That is going to drop into the 90 to 95ft range with racing tires - better than any car coming out of any factory new at any price range today.

esc

iTrader: (6)

Hi 572_Rat,

Have you installed the Willwood's yet?
What do you like the most (or the least) about them?

I see they are 12.19". I would like to go bigger than that. I'm also inclined to get something that can use off-the-shelf pads.

Thanks,

esc

iTrader: (6)

Less than 100 feet IS pretty respectable...


It seems inevitable that rotor sizes will always get bigger, and 12" is pretty common these days (C5). So I'm inclined to get something with at least a 13" rotor.


But I still like the idea of being able to buy calipers and pads at a parts store if required. So I'm inclined to go with one of the Camaro or Corvette kits.

Not to mention, having a caliper that says "Brembo" would not hurt my feelings any.

On a side note - I had to edit this post about 10 times before I discovered that starting a sentence with a "lessthan" sign caused the rest of the message to get cut off.

572_Rat

I have not installed them as yet, they arrive tomorrow, but I have the 4 piston Dynalite on the rear, have aerospace on the front, but since everything else is Wilwood I decided to change the front. I only have 15" wheels so that is why the 12.19 will work for me. If you decide to go with Wilwood I will pass a person on to you. Gave me the best price of anyone and will mix and match products to give you what you want

Stangski09

iTrader: (10)

Baer T4 13".

esc

iTrader: (6)

Those look interesting.
13" is decent.
It used 4th gen LS1 brake pads, so that is good.
But it is a little pricey at about $2K.

paul_huryk

Barely any exotics crack 100ft and they have really sophisticated ABS systems. So no ABS and an off the shelf brake kit does wonders.

C5 is 12.7" or so - not much smaller than a 13".

I have the Baer Track kit (13" 2 piston) on my Camaro and (still on the shelf) a wilwood 13" 4 piston kit for the GTA.

Brembo is just a name these days - not 25 year ago when you had to have something special to get them. Subaru has them...

Beater79TA

We run a 12.19 inch rotor with Wilwood 4 piston calipers on the front of our GTA. It competes nationally at Pro-Touring and autox events. With Wilwood BP20 pads in the calipers for autox, the car will stop hard enough to flat spot a tire and, if done more than once at the same event, strip it down to the cords. And that is on 200 treadwear 275/40/17 tires. The 255/40/17 Rival S from BFG lasts longer and sticks better though. For road course we switch to the Polymatrix H pad compound for better stopping in high heat coming off 100+ mph runs into a corner.

Would a larger rotor be better? Depends on a lot of variables. I work directly with Wilwood when I have questions and they haven't given me bad information yet. But as Paul has said, there is a break even point between stopping power and the size of wheel , rotor, and caliper where bigger brakes are not always better. Your choice of pad compound may play a bigger role in a non-ABS car than overall brake rotor size.

NWFreerider

I recently did the C6 setup from Big Brake Upgrade. I wont have it on the track until spring but on my first test run I was easily able to lock up the tires which wasn't possible with the stock diameter front rotors. Braking performance is night and day. The setup was about $1600. The rotors are 14" and my 18" Boze wheels have about .75" of clearance to the caliper.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

The calipers and rotors kin my pic are all C6Z06 PBR calipers & brembo rotors (GM OEM)

esc

iTrader: (6)

I emailed Scott at BBU last night and he sent me a template for the C6 front brakes.
I'll try it out with my rims this afternoon and see where I stand.

TurboedTPI

These baer 12.7" C5 rotors with C5 calipers and a good motorsports pad will stop a thirdgen better than you can ask for.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

That's what I'm running om my gray iroc, the 13" brembos on my C4 stop a lot better than those.

these:

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iTrader: (6)

It looks like the C5 and standard C6 brakes are very similar. They have the same diameter rotor but different calipers. Are the C6 standard really better than the C5?

I tried the C6 standard template on my 17" rims and it contacted a little near the hub, but had a lot of room on the outside. I'm going to test fit the S6 Z51 template tonight.

Another option that has come up is Wilwood 4 piston calipers on a 13" C4HD rotors. Anyone running something like that?

paul_huryk

Hitting near the hub is bad - wheels won't work with that kit you templated for clearance...


I have that Wilwood kit - need to install it:

esc

iTrader: (6)

I tried the C6 Z51 template today. It does not hit near the hub like the other, but does just barely touch on the ID of the rim, near the front. With a 3/8" spacer it would probably fit.

But I don't really want to run a spacer if I can help it.

MoJoe

iTrader: (5)

The C4HD uses a 13" rotor, and will even fit behind factory 16" IROC wheels... IE lots a wheel clearance. You can you the Corvette base or GS calipers, or Wilwood... just determines the caliper mounts needed.

Paul's pictures is from 87350IROC (John). You can also search on "perdoch" for the brake kits he puts together.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/brak...brake-kit.html

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

You can not use the base caliper and abutment. You must use a j55 caliper and abutment either the optined one or from a zr1 or grabd sport...or the baer track 1 caliper. Its the same

esc

iTrader: (6)

Anyone have any opinion on the relative braking power and fade resistance of a C4HD 13" w/willwood 4 piston calipers vs. C6 Z51 with 13.38" disks?

esc

iTrader: (6)

OK, now I'm considering 2 separate option paths.

Option one is C4HD/Willwood.
Pro's: fits my current wheel and most others. Less expensive.
Cons: More expensive rotors (I hear). Non-factory pads that the average parts store will not carry. Good, but not best racing option.

Option 2: buy a set of CTW wheels and go with something like the 14" Camaro SS brakes.
Pros: Bigger better brakes, MUCH lighter, slightly wider wheels. Probably best racing option.
Cons: 2.5 x as expensive. Won't fit many other rims. Durability of rims?

I've warped/cracked/broken many aftermarket aluminum wheels before, not from hitting things, just hard use. So I'm a little concerned about the durability of the CTW wheels. I only run DOT race or stickier tires and want to be able to beat them up without any cares. I have no concerns doing that with my current wheels...but they are SOOO heavy.

I also need to research what rear sizes are available. I would REALLY like to run a wider rear tire...like a 315.



All opinions welcome.

esc

iTrader: (6)

It looks like the CTW wheel comes in 9.5" width only.
I read somewhere, in a post that was a couple of years old, that a wider wheel might one day appear. But it doesn't seem to have materialized so far...

Zach/90\irocZ

iTrader: (6)

Can always widen them but 9.5 with racing tires is a a lot of meat and more then adequate
And with 17" you won't beable to run much wider anyways

I've ran apex arc 8 wheels there stupid light 18x10 think like 19lb a wheel or less

Trying to fit 315 on 9.5 ? Gonna be a pinch think you like a 275 be better for feel and response

315 in rear prob won't feel as responsive