J.C. Denton

iTrader: (1)

Ok guys, I have very strange problem which I am not able to locate.
1992 Firebird LH0 3.1 Liter V6.
Following situation: I turn on the ignition, everything works fine, all instruments work and so on. I turn the key to the START position, I can hear the starter solenoid click but it doesn't crank the engine. When I turn to start a few times, it suddenly cranks like nothing happened an the engine fires up without any issues. That problem dosn't occur always, most of the time the starter cranks absolutely well.
What I did:
- Bought a new Delco Remy starter, same problem.
- Cleaned battery terminals, ground terminal on engine block, positive terminal on junction block and all terminals on the solenoid terminals
- Installed NEW battery cables, positive and negative one, double checked all terminals and all screwing points
- Bought a new Optima Red Top battery
- Changed the starter enable relay
- Changed the crank fuse
- Changed the P/N switch at the shifter
- Bought a new starter again, whole new AC Delco unit this time

Nothing changed. The car runs and drives absolutely perfect, battery ist good, alternator is good, all connections are tight and clean. Security / VATS is good. I don't get it... And I do hear the starter solenoid click, so I guess everything from the ignition key to the solenoid terminal works fine.
80% of the time the starter cranks powerfull and strong at the first try, but sometimes it just clicks and nothing happens. Also the lights dont go out or something else, so battery voltage is not the problem. Double checked with another battery anyways...
I am a bit lost right now, anyone here has an idea what ghost is hunting me here?

Thanks, Oli

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

With the list of parts you say you replaced , the most logical conclusion , provided the new parts are indeed 100% functional , would be that the starter isn't shimmed right and that occasionally the starter gear isn't being pushed far enough into the ring gear for the solenoid to activate the switch in itself that actually sends the starter motor it's power .

J.C. Denton

iTrader: (1)

I've thought about that also... but the problem is, that the original starter that were factory installed, did the same. Because of that I bought the Delco Remy unit. I installed the original shim from the old starter on the new unit. Also I don't recognize any unwanted noise when the engine cranks that would lead me to a not correct shimmed starter... I can try to add one more factory shim, maybe this will solve the problem... and maybe the factory starter was bad after 24 years and both new starters need more shims... maybe tomorrow I will give it a try. If I can find the old shim from my long gone parts car...

dlinger

iTrader: (4)

I would get car in air, pull flexplate/flywheel cover and check the clearance as per figure 3 (read instructions 4) http://www.allstarperformance.com/downloads/instruction_sheets//ALL80525_Street_Performance_Mini_Starter.pdf

Check it all the way around to verify it is not warped. It is a pain, and not fun to do lying underneath.

Shims will move starter away so you use them if there is not enough clearance on engagement. You usually hear it grinding if shims are needed.

J.C. Denton

iTrader: (1)

Found the problem!


I did what you guys said. I've checked the shims between starter and flywheel. Distance was perfect. I added another shim, nothing changed. Without any shims, the gear hits the flywheel.


My last idea was to change the starter again. I had an old Made-in-China starter lying around from a donor engine. I didn't even know if it worked before... But what should I say... after nearly 3 weeks of testing everything works perfect with this starter.
So definitely BOTH NEW STARTERS, Delco and Delco Remy are defective! I am very angry about that but what should I do... I am happy that everything works now and I can drive where I want without any fear of a non-starting engine.


Thank you guys for your help!

paulo57509

Not to be a kill-joy, but if the problem ever returns, try moving the ignition key between run/start, rapidly. The starter should engage.

My '92 Lumina does the same thing. I've gotten tired of replacing starters. The above work around works every time.