I have an 88 Iroc with the 305 tbi well its still good but the oil pan is caved in and cant be reused for my 350 build. i found one on ebay but it has windage trays? it says its for circle track racing? would this be good for a street drivin 350? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2449375536

 

It will work well with a 305/350 or a 383.

 

I just looked at the oil pan you're considering on ebay. I'll bet my bottom dollar it's probably for a two piece rear main seal instead of the newer one piece rear seal engines (i.e. '87 and up). If you're really on a budget, you can usually fix a caved in oil pan no problem with a big hammer and a 2x4 or 4x4 block of wood and just pound it back out. Either that, or check your local junkyard or post a wanted ad on here to buy another used stock pan for probably less than $20.

 

thanks guys the pan has a part where its creased where it caved in and had a leak i put some jbweld to hold it while it sat and i could move it around. i emailed the guy to find out if it is a 1 piece or 2 piece rear main. I'm very new to building engines, and i figure if im gonna do it i'm going all out. (within realistic means for a college kid) what do you guys suggest for heads? i was thinking of 2 from www.gmpartsdirect.com 12480092 and 12558060(if i can use vortec heads, dont know if i can) but i want to go with the edelbrock performer rpm air gap intake either way, anyone have experience with these? thanks for your help

 

I would go for the Vortec heads. They're cheaper, and will flow more than the 092's. Since you're already buying all new parts, all you need is to buy the intake specific for the Vortec heads, and some self-aligning rocker arms. I love Vortecs....

 

yeah they have the performer rpm air gap vortec, i didnt know if the heads bolted up or if they had to be drilled for the heads to fit since they were made for the newer blocks

 

what kind of cam should i run? I want something that'll give me decent economy, but power on demand. I was thinking about the comp cam extreme energy? the xe 268 maybe? i dont know anything about cams and lifters

 

Hey 87,

I am also new to building engines and a college kid in Ohio near the Dayton area. Lets just say my first 305 engine kind of went through. I saw you were going from an 305 tbi to a 350. Are you going to say with the tbi, carb, or fi? I am just seeing on how you went about it because I also have a 305tbi and I am going to a 350 Carb. If you are goin this route let me know because I have some questions

Rupert

 

Hey good to know theres someone close I'm in Middletown pretty close to dayton. well anyway im wanting to stay with the tbi so i can keep the computer (for tuning/chip burning afterwards) im also gonna stay with the emissions if possible (e-check sucks ***, and i work there) but i'm looking for a 454 throttle body. it flows alot more air than the stocker, but also comes with a heavier price tag for a new one. if you have aim or yahoo messenger give me a yell my screen name is DeliriousAmI on both.

 

i've been talking to people about the vortecs and they say they're not very good except down low because they're "truck" heads. is this true? what's an affordable set of heads for someone on a ****ty budget $8 /h

 

well well well.... the list grows ever bigger, i live near troy, north of dayton.

what a special bunch huh?

Brandon

 

i bought an iroc from a guy in troy about 3 months ago (i think) maybe longer purple 89 iroc

we should start a list of everyone thats around here... maybe convoy to one of the f-body gatherings. that would be cool

 

So the thing we need to know is what are you going to stay with, tbi? What is your compression with 64cc an 76 cc heads? New pistons i take it? I can give you a good combo from there.

 

First of all yes i am staying with TBI unless a complete tpi setup comes to my front door at minimal cost. everything in the block will be new. it's a 92' 350 block out of a truck. bare block. Im looking at a rebuild kit from www.summitracing.com

FEM-CSMHP761-000

thats what it comes with says 9.35 compression w 64cc heads i dont know about 76cc heads it doesnt say. but it would be less than that. as stated before im very new to building engines. taken them apart never built one.

 

here's what ive come up with so far:

www.gmpartsdirect.com
12480092 high performance head 2.02/1.60
12558060 vortec head 1.94/1.50 able to go to 2.02/160(cheaper)
(dont know which ones better)

comp cam xtreme energy 270/276 hyd. roller cam

the rebuild kit posted above

Edelbrock performer rpm air gap vortec or
edelbrock performer rpm air gap (depends on heads i get)

probably the holley 670cfm throttle body (way outta my price range motors gonna have to have asthmatics for awhile)

anything i forgot?

 

Well, i got it using vortec heads and a 670 witha performer rpm. The cam is a xe268 which will fit on them heads with no valve grinding and stock spring. You are looking at 380 hp at around 5500 and around 380 lb ft at 4500 with around 250 at 2000 but at 250, have 300. So my advice.. get a high stall converter and go with that setup. Cheapest and a great amount of power.

 

Wonderful thing is that it is a 6 speed, well not officially, not until i get the bellhousing and crossmember but thats in the future hopefully near future. Anyone wanna donate? lol Its for the poor white college kid, fast car fund. Its a good cause i promise! I need the lottery....

 

will the 270 fit without modifications? or is the 268 the highest i can go? when i get my vortecs should i leave them alone or have a valve job done and the bigger valves put in?

if im right the 270 would only shift the powerband a little higher correct?

 

alright i found an intake on ebay that is very similiar to the edelbrock but its not edelbrock. Would it be worth it? here is the link http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2453912357

it's about $100 - $150 cheaper than the edelbrock piece. what do you think?

 

sorry for all this guys if you havent noticed i need alot of help. should i stay with tbi? or should i go tpi? the entire car is stripped at the moment and neither one would be a problem. just a little more money, if in a hurry to build my car but i'm not in a hurry to cut corners and such im gonna do it right. would tpi be good for this motor since the hp numbers are above 4500 rpm's? and my peak torque numbers are right at 4500 rpms. like i said sorry for so many questions.

 

I say if you're on a budget stick with TBI you can make power like that with a ~$250 Holley 670. If you switch to TPI you'll restrict it because you'd just be going horizontally to another stock system and won't be able to support all that power without going aftermarket, and aftermarket parts for TPI are very expensive. Since you already have TBI stick with it and get a Holley and do some tuning and you'll be happy.

Also, I think sdpc sells vortecs already machined for higher lift and bigger valves, that could be a good deal. Look into some single plane intake manifolds as well, that could be a good route for you with TBI you don't lose the low-end torque that you would with a carb.

 

alright i've come up with something else as of some extensive searching. there are people who are drilling out the nitrous bosses in the air gap intake and putting injectors in there. now if i do that with fuel rails and all and put the 1000cfm 4bbl throttle body on top that solves the dilemma. im gonna convert the computer over to speed density, so that i dont have to mess with a MAF sensor. Good idea or not? i have some pictures of what desktop dyno is giving me numbers wise with this setup (even though im told it exaggerates) they are still nice numbers. I'm told the 670 holley in reality only flows about 400cfm's so i'm scrapping that idea. And what do i need to do to the bottom end to get it to rev to 6000 - 6500rpms on occasion?

 

nobody has any ideas? im open to any ideas as long as they're realistic

 

well apparently no one has any ideas or facts to help me out i guess im on my own.

 

anyone have a similiar setup? maybe? I dont know alot about Tuned Port Cars and if this is a headache i mihgt try something else

 

Also does anyone know where i can get a forged crankshaft for a decent price? What i've come up with they are all $450 - $500

 

Well Well Well. I live in NYC. I purchased a 86 TA 305 4bbl just to see my girl in middletown twice a month. my car runs well, I even got a ticket for going 115 ph in PA.

I roughly have 165 HP and the push at acceleration is not there. with such a heavy car. I want ta change da engine but there is nothing wrong with it. It just wont die. So I was tinking of changing the cylinder heads, intake manifold and I don't know what else...

Do you think that I can get 275 HP after modifications?

Help in need of puppy power :?)-

 

If i were you, i would go carbuartion if you are computer illiterate. But there is alot of help if you want to go TBI. A holley 670 really flows that much, but i would rather recomend a edelbrock for street use. ARe you using NOS? THat should be the only really good reason you need a froged crank. If you are getting a new crank, you my as well stroke the engine for the few extra $$$ as it is well worth it. The computer will limit your duration on cams unless you get a custom chip which you will probly need anways. But i guess i am just a carb guy, much more easier tuning and very rarely have any problems.

 

im gonna be burning my own chips soon im saving up to buy the autoprom from craig moates. www.moates.net seems like a good deal. I was thinking about maybe a 100-shot of NOS How much extra would it be to stroke the engine? I've thought about it but i'd like to have something i can rev kinda high thats why i thought i would have to use forged parts for high revving or is that more of a balancing issue? I've thought about going carb. But my dad refuses to work on cars anymore and im 19 my generation is mainly fuel injection of some sort.


Yep I was born and raised in Middletown. if i was you i'd put in a bigger cam also f-bodys came with a weak *** cam 275hp is a little high for a 305 with stock internals you'd need an exhaust and headers also more than likely.

 

Why do you need to rev high. There is no reason. A 383 will only cost you slightly more as you will have to have the block clearenaced. And with that 100 shot, u need forged internals. That $$$$ if you got it.

 

well i consider revving high 6000 - 6500 rpms thats where desktop dyno placed my peak hp is at 6000 thats why i was asking. i'm not definate on the NOS though until i see how powerful my setup is

 

All i want from my motor is the ability to run 11's to low 12's im upgrading my entire suspension to compensate the power. It's gonna be a street car daily driven so i want street manners. ya know the next time a jetta or mustang tries to run me leave em sitting in smoke and rubber. My 87 305tpi stops at 115 but its only at 3000 rpms! thats where the jetta got me going down the highway. nothing pisses me off more than that, that just adds the fuel to the fire to build this car.

 

I dont know if you are going to run 11's. It gets expensive to run them times. Mid 12's will beat any stock street car, well at least most of them imports and mustangs. WAtch out for them new cobras as they are quick. I doubt yoru engine will need to rev that high with a cam that small. Ignore your desktop dyno, put it on a true dyno after you get her built and see. You will need a good 100 shot to get in the 11's. If you really want to know a guy who knows how to build killer engines. go to www.cheavytalk.com and go in performance related board and talk to grumpy vette. He got an additional 40 hp outta an engine a guy was gonna build because he switch the intake and cam. It even had more torque all around. Great guy, and very smart.

 

i'm gonna try talking to him, i want a good combo that i know is gonna make good power. I can only afford to do this once as of now maybe later but im young and have very few bills im in college and still living at home so i have the cc,phone,internet,boarding and the rest goes to my car so i want it to be quick and im using my cousins garage so i have to get this done by summer. after that i wont have a garage to switch things (cams,heads etc.) but thanks for your help i appreciate it alot i get discouraged when i dont get any reply's to my questions. they arent the best but its what i need to know. i appreciate it alot.

 

ok I read the thread, heres the basics as I see it,(LET ME KNOW IF I GOT THIS WRONG)

your 19, (no extensive mechanical expertize yet)you make $8 an hour and have a BUSTED 305, you want to go much faster but moneys very tight and you want to maximize the results per dollar spent, (hey we all started about that way, so yeah I know how you feel, but lets try to do this correctly)
remember KNOWING WHAT YOUR DOING AND WHY YOUR DOING IT BEFORE YOU SPEND MONEY IS THE KEY TO A GOOD COMBO....GET AND READ THE BOOKS BELOW BEFORE GOING ANY FURTHER

QUESTIONS

do you CURRENTLY HAVE a differant engine or are you just looking into building one!? (have you bought ANY new arts yet?)

do you have access to a place, tools and knowledgable friends to help you?

do you need to pass EMMISSIONS TESTING?

whats your CURRENT REAR GEAR RATIO? TRANS?

youll have much better results if you take the time to THINK IT THRU,BEFORE spending money you can,t afford to waste

while I doubt that you can afford to build an 11 second car as your first project that in no way means you can,t build a kick butt ride PROVIDED you get the combo well thought out BEFORE you start and don,t fall for the trap 97% of the guys do of "BUYING THE GREAT DEAL PARTS "that don,t match your goals

if you do nothing else buy and read these books BEFORE starting the engine build, and buy ,or borrow [color:"red"] a quality engine stand like the one below It will save you hours of wasted effort,make the engine assembly far easier,and much safer ,SAVE THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS WASTED and YEARS OF LEARN TIME[/color]
check list
if theres any one tool you need its a good engine stand
stand info
you don,t need anywhere near a full selection of tools but be very carefull checking clearances and I highly advise buying a damper installation tool
IF THERES ONE RULE YOU MUST NEVER IGNORE ITS CHECK ALL CLEARANCES TWICE AND MAKE DAMN SURE THAT YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY SHOULD BE AND WHY



http://www.73-87.com/chp/chp.htm

http://chevyhiperformance.com/techar...298/index.html

http://www.sa-motorsports.com/diyport.htm

http://www.ryanscarpage.50megs.com/combos1.html


DO YOURSELF A HUGE FAVOR
buy these books, FIRST it will be the best money you ever spent, read them, and you will be miles ahead of the average guy. youll save thousands of dollars and thousands of hours once youve got a good basic understanding of what your trying to do!

HOW TO BUILD THE SMALL BLOCK CHEVEROLET by LARRY ATHERTON&LARRY SCHREIB
.
HOW TO BUILD MAX PERFORMANCE CHEVY SMALL BLOCKS ON A BUDGET by DAVID VIZARD

.
JOHN LINGENFELTER on modifying small-block chevy engines

how to build & modify CHEVROLET small-block V-8 CAMSHAFTS & VALVTRAINS BY DAVID VIZARD

SMOKEY YUNICK,S POWER SECRETS

SMALL BLOCK CHEVY ENGINE BUILDUPS
]http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=6970&langId=-1&catalogId=4006970&PHOTOS=on&TEST=Y&productId=19884&categoryId=0[/url]

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...6&categoryId=0

 

I bought a oil pan with crank scraper and windage trays, and a throttle body for my new project and thats it so far. I want to make sure the parts work together really good. I do have to pass emissions. I have a rearend out of a 94' z28 with i believe 3.23 posi. i've bought all those books with the exception of lingenfelters modifying small block chevys. i dont care what the new parts cost i can save for them, i just want them to work well together and give me the best bang for my buck.

I did get the lingenfelter book, i dont remember which one i didnt get!?

ahh it was the how to build the small block chevy by LARRY ATHERTON & LARRY SCHREIB i have the engine builders handbook by tom monroe also and how to rebuild small block chevys by david vizard

 

WELL , BECAUSE you have not yet purchased a rotateing assembly, you might at this point want to decide on selling your parts and buy a 383 long block already assembled, and swap in the crane cam below.

http://www.online-racer.com/chevy_383_stroker.htm

if you decide to build from a bare block

Id highly sugguest you buy a 10:1 cpr 383 rotateing assembly and a cam like this crane flat tappet hydrolic,
link

it passes emission testing, and makes good power. youll want headers and a good set of heads, most of you potential power is in the displacement,cam,head combo, so don,t scrimp thereI don,t like vortecs if your buying new heads simply because by the time you get all the special, rockers,valve covers,intakes ETC. your running into the money range of better heads, I like the larger ports and lighter weight of the less expensive aluminum heads available as they really cost only slightly more that iron heads


http://store.summitracing.com/defaul...heads&x=13&y=9
whats a combo like that with TRICKFLOW HEADS AND CRANE CAM IN A 10:1 cpr 383, likely to produce if correctly assembled?
about 400 flywheel hp and about 420 flywheel tq or close to DOUBLE what the stock 305 had in most cases
remember this
http://www.73-87.com/chp/gm3505.htm


http://www.73-87.com/chp/dyno6.htm

well thats a lower compression 350, if you build the 383 and add compression the results will be better!PLUS IT STILL PASSES EMISSION TESTING UNLIKE THE 350 WITH ITS LARGER CAM

 

it looks like a rotating assembly costs more than building from a bare block. quite a bit more up front, im trying to do this a portion at a time.

 

Listen to grumpy, save up and buy it. He knows what he is talking about. Doing it forever. I woudl totally have to agree on buying a full roating assembly because most of them are already balenced. You live in ohio? Last time i herd, there were no emissions testing in ohio. ARe you sure about that, i live 5 minutes up the road in michigan and never knew about ohio.

 

not all of ohio has emissions testing. theres like 14 of the 88 counties that do have testing and i happen to live in one and work at one... i'm sure i can get my car to pass thats no problem. It's just if i'm still working there when i get this done.

 

I know Clark County has emissions 87, but anyway I had my car tagged in Michigan because I didnt want to have it e-checked even though I drive I spend 11 months out of the year in Ohio. Anyway 496 I have some questions for you if you would PM me about an engine setup I already PM grumpy but he hasnt answered yet. 87 a 383 would be cool, why are you trying to go so fast? Not that there is anything wrong with it :-)

Rupert

 

I don't want to go that fast i want 12's that about it. i'd be extremely happy with that. or even low 13's i dont have much money thats why i dont like the rotating assembly idea cause its too much up front and the car needs alot of other things. I'm building it from the bottom up it has no interior, no suspension, and no engine in it right now. i have most of the parts but im trying to upgrade to performance parts (suspension,engine) i want something that handles very well and can put the power down when i want it to. thats why i was thinking 350, but if a 383 is what i should do then i guess i will. i want to run like 89 octane also if i can get away with it. just cause gas around here has jumped quite a bit in the last few weeks. i was kinda counting on going with vortec heads cause they're cheap and flow good out of the box. and i cant afford $1500 for a set of heads or really even $1000. vortec heads are $450, $550 (around there) shipped to my door.

 

Vortecs will not get you into the 12's, at least it will take alot to do it. You will probly need some juice in that and will need to run 92. Save up the money, alum heads like grumpy suggested will save you more money in the long run, just look at what he said. Hes been doing it for a long time and i would have to agree. If you cant afford them, see if a machine shop has a used set. There are usually some out there with good ones. Calla round and ask. If anything, get fast burn, because even then, you will spend a few extra and get better flowing heads and the ability to run 89 much easier with alum heads.

 

alright im through with the vortec idea they were gonna cost me almost $700 to get here and have bigger valves put in. so i found this at www.summitracing.com TFS-30400006 or the TFS-30400006-CNC would these be a good heads to go with? they are about 400 - 700 more than the vortecs or should i go with TFS-30400007-CNC since they are only $100 more than the others? i need a book to enlighten me about cylinder heads. but i'll just have to wait a little longer to get it on the road then. which i guess i can do im just really excited that it's starting to come together.

 

go for the first one. Its great for what you need. You will really like the jump from vortecs to them heads. Find a rotating assembly with a 3.75 stroke for a 383 with a .030 over that has a 10:1 with 64 cc heads. That should make you good for around 89. But dont go higher than 10:1 or you will be detonating more than what you want. And are you staying tbi? If you are, get a new intake, something for 1500-6000 range. You will need 1 3/4 headers with a good at least 3 inch all the way out the back. The cam grumpy mentioned should work great, now its just time for you to get the engine built and tell us how she runs.

 

im going with a mpfi setup i got a 4 barrel dry throttle body and i was going to get either the victor efi intake or the rpm air gap and drill out the nitrous bosses for injectors Fuel injected 383 would be nice what about this 383 assembly 356-B13004L from www.jegs.com it's about 1175 it seems pretty well priced with a 9.7:1 compression ratio does that work well? and another question if a 383 rotating assembly is externally balanced will it work with a manual transmission? the flywheel is balanced right?

 

You should be in good shape. Yeah, call up jegs when you order, and they will appoint you to the right flywheel. From there, you will have on killer fuelie and be able to run with vettes for a fraction of the price.

 

Thanks alot for all your guys help I'll keep you posted as to how everything goes. hopefully by next spring i'll have her done and ready to go on the dyno to get some real numbers! and again thanks for the help. I might have some more questions later on, i'm ready books that i got today, i just finished John Lingenfelters guide to modifying small blocks. I understood most of it also! theres hope for me yet lol

 

Hi guys

If money is a main concern try these links.

http://www.enginekits.com/
http://www.speedomotive.com/Budget%20383.htm

If you go the 383 rotating assy route, make sure you check all the clearances of the rotating assy (i.e. make sure the rod clears the cam, etc)

Take care, be good...
Sara Lou

 

thanks that might help out. as i still havent decided on where im getting the assembly from. mainly because i dont have the money right now. but the one kinda scares me a bit from speedomotive thanks for the help