i'm looking to swap out my 6 for a 8
but why is it that almost everyone here
that i've spoken to seem to perfer the ls1
over a worked 350 what am i missing

yea ok i'm new to all this and even a tab
stupid b/c there is still a hell of a lot that i don't
understand about most of this but i'm trying

so really what is the difference other then the $$$$$

 

It's a pretty similar pain factor upgrading from a V6 to a regular smallblock, LS1, or LT1. Wiring harness must be modified, fuel system must be upgraded, engine mounts must be changed, etc.

The LS1 becomes worth it only if you want cookbook power, they respond to upgrades very well and predictably.

Build up a 350 TPI engine with decent heads, cam, etc. and you're making about as much power as a stock LS1 with nothing more than an air filter lid modification.

 

or build up a performance 350 with a non TPI intake and you're whomping LS1s for half the price... but that takes a lil more knowlage then just swapping in a factory LS1.

 

hummm ok but if thats the case why is everyone running off to get an LS1 and dropping all that cash??????

what are the pro's and con's of both these swap's

my 3.1 needs about 1600 worth of work and my tranny is on it's last legs as we speek so i was planing on parking her indoors for the rest of the winter and working on a complete 4th gen interior swap and figured while i was at it i'd shot for the enigne and tranny as well i just don't know

what would be better in the long run

 

ok i just looked at the ls1 yet again and is everyone really paying 6/7 grand for these and for that cash why only 320hp

the 350 is offering the same hp for 1500

even more so then B 4

 

like i said.. knowlage..

on one hand, with a LS1 swap, you get a known amount of power, daily driver reliablility, good gas miliage... easy.


on the other, anything you can do with a LS1, you can do with a SBC, BUT you have to know what you're doing. knowing what you're doing and having a plan is the diff between the kid with the 13 second car that has 7k in it, and the old guy with 2k in the car running 11s. the more you know, the better the decision you can make.

if you want a pro/con list, there shold be one in one of the main LS1 swap threads.

 

I looked at doing an LS1 swap, in the end i decided to go with a gen 1 SBC. the mods for an LS1 are more expensive, the engine and tranny are more expensive. but the fuel injection is nice on them, and they are lighter.

the list of pros and cons can go on forever. in the end, its all about what you want, and the money you want to spend.

 

A few of the Pro's are great driveability, smooth power band and super high "cool factor." You can add some ported heads and a big cam to an LS1, make 450+ at the crank and have it idle like silk. Now many Gen1's or GenII's do that very easy. But mostly for the cool factor.

 

Stock and lightly-modded LS1s, yes. I did it for years with my L98 block and it felt great seeing "that look" on their drivers' faces at the track.

So...if that was a jab at me, it's both incorrectly placed and has grade-school spelling errors. If not, well, it's still got bad spelling.

Soon as the LS1 guys throw in a cam and bolt on a set of heads, they're over 400 very reliable hp at the wheels and still passing emission tests. At that point you can't touch them without sacrificing streetability on a 350, or upgrading to 383/406 displacement...and spending dollar for dollar what they do.

 

let's see if i read all this right your telling me

400+ great drive ability

& emissions to boot

i think i might be leaning towards the LS1

ok so on that note should i search around for a donor
for the engine of should i just try for a crate from gm????

 

Donor vehicle is the cheaper route. LS1 crate engines, no tranny, sell for $5800 or so. I paid $4400 for my '01 complete with T56.

Check with contemporarycorvette.com located in Bristol, PA.

Neither a standard SBC or LS1 swap is plug 'n play, you have wiring harness and other modifications to do and there isn't a step-by-step procedure for it. Too many variations in the 3rd gen chassis harnesses, and LS1 engine harnesses, for this to happen.

If you're up for the challenge, go for whichever makes you happy. My TPI/350 really woke the car up from it's CFI/305 slumber years ago, and it's been a fun ride.

-Kevin

 

The lt1 swap is also a good one to go with, much cheaper than the LS1, not as much power but you can get an engine and t-56 tranny for $2000-$3000

 

AS far as the LS1 goes, it isn't that much more in weight to my 3800 that's going in.

$1600 in work for the 3.1 can get you a new GM 3.4 for a more "painless" swap.

And if you have connections, a complete drivetrain swap can cost less than $400

 

If you consider winning races painful, then yup you'll be pretty "painless" with that engine.

 

Yup, who'd even think about wanting a 13.5 sec 3.4, let alone actually driving it DAILY

 

Its nothing a sbc cant do.

 

If you understand how a camshaft works you can make any motor streetable and still make good horsepower. The reason LS1 motors seem so tame is that their camshafts are ground with wide LSA's.

 

Yes you are correct and I am aware of this however it is not the norm to see a 450+hp gen1 without some noticable lope. For LS1's it is commonplace.

 

That is because the majority of 450+hp gen 1 motors are carbed, and thus run a tighter lobe separation. I understand what you are saying, but slap a set of 18* or 14* heads on a gen 1 chevy along with a roller cam and you are easily in the 600-700 horsepower range.

 

Yea we are on the same page. I was assuming Gen1 carb applications without wild multi port set-ups. And since the LS1 is pretty new and high tech aftermarket wise, you get the wide LSA's with minimal cam selections compaired to Gen1. Todays market demands drivabilty and that is an easy task with the LS1 aftermarket and tuning capabilities.

 

I have my LT1 swap nearly done... its fuel injected ---- do any of your recommend switching to carb ? --- more power ? or can i make just as much with the fi ?

 

Keep the FI. It is so much better and you can make scary power with new style multi port set-ups.

 

You may be thinking of the LS6 cam and it's huge 117.5deg LSA.

The bulk of the aftermarket cams you see on ls1tech.com and whatnot are actually in the 112deg LSA range.

 

And easily spending dollar for dollar, if not more, what the LS1 guys spend to get there...the argument for keeping the gen-1 SBC was lower cost, right?

 

Blah blah "my car will be fast some day" yadda yadda...come back with a time slip.

PS: the guy on that link you posted had a turbocharger...kinda interesting when you consider GN and TTA cars with V6 engines run in the 12's...

 

bigger engines, lower compression, and more boost. Yeah they suck

On turbo buick.com, I think 12's are slow, but haven't been there in while. I'll be glad just to have my swap run & not catch on fire this time.

 

WOW!!!

like i said guy's i'm really new to this and don't understand more then half of what you've all been talking about.............

anyway mu uncle said he'd help me with either but that i just need to be sure that i get all the nessary parts together before he starts so now i just really really need to make up my mind so i can start shopping around for parts that is after i make up my mind............

in short if i wanted to get her up into the 400's i'll end up spending about the same amount of cash either way or did i miss something?

 

Pretty much same cash outlay...if you get a junkyard LS1 or LT1 it'll have a guarantee and be recent enough that it shouldn't need rebuilt. The LT1 will be cheaper, baseline lower hp than the LS1, but with little more than a cam and springs you're pushing the same ~300hp at the rear wheels as the LS1.

Get a TPI engine, and you either have a used-up longblock or a rebuild of unknown quality...so you're in for a rebuild. Throw in aftermarket heads, intake and whatnot just to get up to ~300hp at the wheels, and you're in the same financial ballpark as the LS1 would have cost in the first place.

 

umm... i dont see how it can be a jab at you..

doesnt matter though... i dont have a clue what you have, and im not even going to look... so you guys can just continue talking...im doing it... :lala:

 

ok so what would an ls1 used run me (more or less) and how much would a rebuild cost part wise (again more of less)

just trying to figure things out in my head b/4 i go back to my uncle.............


thanks again guys

 

$1500 to $3000 is what I see them go for. Depending on condition and mileage. As for a rebuild that is touch. You can reabuild the bottom and and put new pistons and such but if you want a bigger bore then have to re-sleeve the block. This is hwere you get into $$$. I would look at a slightly used one and maybe pay the price differernce. You would not have to rebuild it and you could throw some go fast parts on it and be on your way.

 

I spent $4400 for a complete '01 LS1, T56 trans, harness, PCM, accessories, etc. at Contemporary Corvette. I'm in about another $400 in misc parts and upgrades (hoses, belt, engine mounts, oil pump, timing set...) on top of that.

I'm sure their prices vary, I showed up with a credit card and my truck ready to haul it off immediately so they were likely motivated to make the sale.

 

wow cool thats what i'm thinking about trying

seprate question for ya
what kind of mod's are you planing?

 

I'm more focused on getting it installed and running. There's no step-by-step procedure for it, so plenty of reading. I'm currently doing pin-maps of the '01 harness and my '82 chassis connectors.

 

pin outs are fun , even the just the 85 to 88 gauge cluster had it's issues.

 

Definitely. This is the 2nd upgrade this '82 has had, first one was TPI and lots of pinout work was needed. GM changed so many pin locations between those years...fuel pump, 12VDC feed, TCC control, oil pressure gauge, starter trigger...it was a buncha work and not much less than this LS1 is taking.