ok ive got OK mig skills and im thinking about buying one of the pre bent and notched 8 point roll bars. now i know you cant dress up the welds but if you mess up can you grind it off and reweld it?
thanks guys

 

I don't see why not. Also the kits don't have all the cuts made for you. I had to cut the trans tunnel braces, main hoop ends for length, rear supports, and front sidebars.

 

ahhh ic. i was just lookin in my summit catalof and it says its pre notched and what not
thanks man!

 

Yeah, they usually come prenotched on some of them. I bought the S&W Race Car Kit. The same one Spohn sells on his site. They leave a lot up in the air so the buyer can customize them to there body types. The same cookie cutter operation wouldn't fit everyone's different heights and etc. It has some fish mouths, but you still have to cut several bars to length. I think we also had to make angle cuts to some bars too and redo some fish mouths, because of the angle changes. I just wanted to point that out to you.

 

oh yeah i know it wasnt just weld in and go. my biggest concern was if i make a mistake on the welds

 

If you mess up a weld, you can grid and weld it again. I made a mistake by applying bondo over the welds to make everything look smooth and clean. It looks great and I get great penetration on the welds, but I was informed that some tracks will not let you run especially if your car goes 9s or faster. They inspect the welds, etc.

Regarding the notched bars...you will have to cut and notch some of them.

Later,

 

yeah my IHRA rule book says the welds cant be dressed up

 

Let me say its alittle bigger job then what you think. I have welding skills so I bought the cage kit from summit. Man that cage was alot of work. I actully had to get some help from my fabrication buddy just to finish it. One of the harder parts is welding the steal plates to the floor. Sounds dumb but you will burn through the floor more then a few times.

 

ohi expect it to be a pain in the ***. luckily i know alot of awesome welders that can help me out

 

After its all said and done I love my cage. I went from stock to a cage, sfc, lowering springs, and boxed control arms. Let me just say the car feels a bit stiffer.

 

yeah im putting in ladder bars when i put the cage in

 

Heh, that was where my brother started… when he finally gave up I spent a few hours reparing all the holes that he blasted in the floor pan just trying to weld the renforcement plates down…

Yea, you can always cut out a bad weld, you just can’t clean up the finished, proper weld…

 

haha well i was reading my IHRA rule book and they mandate that cages must be bolted to the floor on unibodys

 

Bolted with a reinforcement plate bolted on either side of it or a single reinforcement plate welded to one side…

 

right-o

 

When I first put a simple roll bar into my car, I considered the "bolt in" option. Where the main hoop sits inside the car, it's just about impossible to mount a plate on the underside for it to bolt to.

"Weld in" is the best choice. A minimum of a 6" x 6" x 1/8" plate is welded to the floor where every tube will go. It can be shaped to the contour of the floor. The roll bar/cage tube is then welded to this plate.

 

Is it required for the crossmember hoop to transmission tunnel diagonal braces? I know I made the mistake of accidently cutting some plates to fit there properly only to find out S&W only sent me 6 plates. I just had the welding shop provide 2 more 6" square by 1/8" plates.

 

I've never seen anywhere where the diagonal braces are manditory. At least not in the 8.50 and slower cars. Technically, the diagonal braces are supposed to be attached to the SFC "if possible". My SFC run under my seat and there are a bunch of commercial versions that run along the rockers so it just isn't possible. If you had SFC that you could weld the diagonal braces to, you cut a hole in the floor for access, weld the brace to the SFC then weld a section of the floor back in around the tube. That's how a full frame car is done.

 

You can sort of interpret the rules as not needing the doubler plates for the main hoop on these things since it would tie right into the rear “frame,” which is mostly what is in the way of putting a bottom plate on.

In my case I’m 6’4” and although I haven’t done it yet, I’d most likely have to put my main hoop mounts on the doubled up/braced section under the rear seat to get it close enough to upright to be technically legal.

I believe it’s that either the main hoop or if it doesn’t you need diagonal braces connected into either the rocker sills or the suspension pickup points. On our cars it’s easy enough to tie the reinforcing plates into the rocker sills so it’s a non issue, but being **** retentive I’d probably still put diagonal bars to the other side of the suspension pick up points since it could add significantly to the rigidity of the car without adding much weight.

I’ve wondered if I could get away with something similar for the lower door bars on a 9.99 -8.50 legal cage in that I would actually mount the lower bars that are supposed to go across the door opening below the floor behind the rocker and have the main hoop and the front down bars go through the floor and connect to it there.

I can’t seem to get a real answer and the closest I’ve gotten so far is that it appears that many of the tech inspectors consider those particular bars as optional so in many cases you can get away without them (I got that answer when I was wondering how so many cars that I see at the track don’t have them but appear to have cage certs).

Now getting back to the real world… if you have a car that runs 9.99’s and slower all this doesn’t really matter. I’ve never seen tech guys get really serious about checking out the required 5pt, checking mounting points, materials, construction…, just if it’s there you’re OK, if not “get something in there or don’t run the number.” 9.99, where you start needing a real cage is where you end up having to get the thing certified and it actually is inspected on how it’s mounted to the floor, welded, material size…

 

Well the diagonal bars we were talking about go from the underside of the main hoop crossmember to the transmission tunnel hump.

I dunno I just went ahead and had them done. I figured since I was planning/now running a Spohn Tq Arm having a little extra bracing in that area can't hurt. I also put the main hoop where the rear seats should have been.

Like you have stated though, it all depends on the track.

 

whats the best way to notch the tubes? i have a hand grinder, but i think that might be to much of a hack job, normaly im not opposed to that sort of thing, haha, but i dont want to **** this cage up, would it be best to just get a table top grinder, and just keep resizing? or is there some specialty tool? thanks, pat

 

I used a 4" hand grinder to do all mine.

 

Use a hole saw in a bench top drill press. They sell the "notching"/fish-mouthing kit from a few places. Probably summit, harbor freight, etc. $50 or so and it's got an alignment gizmo.