Here's some pics of what I am trying to accomplish...









These are heads from a '04 3500 Malibu...




^^^ the timing cover needs to be clearanced, but that's not a major issue.



^^^ Here's the top end put together, the flow is so much better on these heads over the stock iron units. The engine these cam off of makes 200hp and 221lb-ft. I need help figuring out how I can mount the alt, P/S, and A/C. You can see in these pics, how I was using plexi-glass to try and make a template. The problem is when I get them in a location that's going to be convienient, the belt isn't going to work.


BTW, the problem stems from wanting to leave enough room to make some forward facing headers to mount turbo, or two . I'm leaning toward twins, so room for downpipe/s is also a must....








Sorry about the lighting, but it's dusk.



EDIT: Oh yeah, there's more pics HERE and HERE

Thanks in advance .

 

No love? I would like to finish this next weekend. Are there any smaller A/C or P/S pumps I could look for? Even if they were off another mfgr's car.

If I don't figure this out, P/S has to go in place of an S10 unit

 

passenger side:
I've recently developed a taste for low mounted alternators. They make the engine look clean and will leave room higher in the engine compartment for gravity-drained fun-parts.

Driverside:
If you used a hydraboost brake assist setup like on the late astro vans you could get rid of the huge diaphram/vacuum brake booster. You'd have to keep power steering though. Having power steering and power brakes, too bad right? Seriously though... maybe just cheat downward with mounting the P/S pump and cheat high with the A/C.

 

If I made the alt any lower, the belt configuration doesn't work well. I'm thinking on the pass side, to have the headers go up and over the belt leaving plenty of room for a downpipe(s).

I will look for a booster, that should help a bit. With a smaller booster and nixing the cruise canister should help. I was also thinking if I could find a smaller P/S pump (or just find/make a smaller resivior even), or a smaller A/C compressor, it might make things easier.



Why do I have to keep P/S? I know it can be inconvienient, but my car isn't a DD.

Does anybody know if an electric P/S pump is available?

 

You;d have to keep P/S because the hydraboost brake booster uses the P/S pump instead of vacuum to assist the power brakes.

 

Gotcha. So if I find/build an electric P/S pump, I could save a ton of room? I'm going to look into it for sure, now.

 

I had time to stop quick at the yard today. I saw the booster ttype was talking about. It came with the body style change in the GMC Safari and Chevy Astro. I wasn't sure if it was worht the effort because I wouldn't be saving th room near the front of the motor, where I need it.

However, I did find a prospective P/S pump, though. It was from a Acura Integra (I think it was Integra). The pump was smaller than our pulley, the pulley was smaller, used the same size/style belt, AND there is an external resivoir - the most tempting part. This would mean I could keep the current A/C compressor. I also saw a couple of GM compressors that were smaller in diameter, but deeper (longer), and has the same fittings as the current compressor. This means if I grab the P/S pump, and it doesn't allow enough room, I can get the compressor as well (expensive, though). They wanted $100 for the Astro booster and $40 for the P/S pump.

 

Have you tried brackets that were stock for that enginethe heads came off? Surely you could use parts of them or modify them to suit your needs.

 

They would work with modification, but I won't have room for the turbo headers .

 

Well I got a suggestion from a member on another site...
http://store.summitracing.com/egnsea...=+115&y=9&x=30

 

I took a few minutes to look at a different yard today (doing a job about 30mi from home), and they had the same pump as the Summit unit (they came in 3100/3400 V6's). They should work on V8 cars as well. I went to ask for a price list, and the guy asked me what I was looking for. Well, I told him I saw a couple sets of 4th gen of seats in good shape, and the P/S pump. He said if I pull them, he would give the front/rear seats and pump for $140! The pupm even comes with a warrantee. I saw some pumps in other yards, but not in this good of shape, it's in a '99 Sunfire 3100. I will be going back in the next couple of days with some tools, and let you know how it goes.

 

That pump was/is not used on the 3100 or 3400. The 31/400s use a pump that has a resevoir that is clipped directly onto the pump, and does not use a spigot to attach a hose.

Alsoi that was not a sunfire you saw, or it wasn't a 3100. J-bodies from '95+ were never available with a V6.

Notch the frame and run a low mount alternator, it's teh best way to make the headers fit nice, and it helpos save your alternator, since the alternator will not be sitting high up in the hot engine compartment.

I've been toying with the idea of using the FWD front cover and remotoe mounting the water pump, so that I have access to the front of the cam, easily, well for other reasons. But this would make belt routing even more difficult.

I will most likely be using a 2.0 OHC Sunbird PS pump, it's small, will accept the V6 pulley, and has a seperate resevior, AND they are cheap and plentiful.

Are you sure the Acura uses the same width belt? Every one I have seen, uses a 4 rib, where as the 660 uses a 6 rib.

 

Perhaps I got confused because I saw so many cars in a short amount of time, but the pump is definately the same as the link from Summit I gave (and I knwo it was a 3100 ). The pump from Summit already has the resivoir removed and a press-in fitting installed to make it a remote resivoir.

Again, the Acura was a quick look, but I'm almost positive I counted 6 ribs. It was tha only Acura/Honda that I saw with a serp belt at all, the rest were v's.

 

No, you are mistaken, the genIII 660 pump is drastically different than the pump in the summit picture, trust me on this, I know the 660s inside and out.

Andf if you mean that it was a 3100 in the Sunfire, again, you are gravely mistaken, no 3rd gen J-body was equipped with a V6 from the factory.

The one in the summit link is more like the 2.0L OHC PS pump, but I don't believe it is the same.

Honda/Acura has not used V-belts in years, probably since the early '90s, and even then it wasn't many models. They just used a seperate serp belt for each belt driven accessory, again, most were 4 rib.
Integras were this way, so if you saw a single belt system on an Acura it was NOT an Integra. All B-series (most commonly used in the 'Tegs) were multiple serp belts.
Some of the 2001+ Hondas/Acuras were single belt, I believe it started with the K series, V6s went to single belt earlier.

I forgot to mention earlier, that any bracket that attaches to teh heads (I.E A/C compressor), will need to be custom. The FWD brackets set the pulleys too far rearward (in a longitudily mounted vehicle), to use a hybrid of accessory belt system, and the RWD brackets will need to be modified so much, that I don't know that I would trust them attached to the FWD heads, for stability, and longevity.

 

The PS bracket still will bolt to the wp, and almost fits the lower right bolt in the 3500 heads, but I'm making all new brackets for everything.

What I meant was the engine was a 3100, hard to mistake with the logo on the UIM . The pump was located right were my TB would be in the RWD configuration (and a 3x00 top end).

Here's where I got the idea (CNCGuy from 60*V6)...

http://60degreev6.com/showthread.php?t=37826

 

I can't look at that site, I are banneshed from thar.

Besides, I will bet $1000 that thst is NOT a 660 pump, seriously, I know for a fact 11tybillion percent that is not a 660 pump with a tube in it.

ALL FWD 660 pumps, genII and III use a three bolt pattern that surrounds the drive pretty closley, that pump in the picture uses the older RWD style bolt fitment that is recessed from the drive, look at the very top of the pump in the pic, that notch is where the bolt passes through. That pump in the pic does not have a receiving area for the resevoir to slide into nor has the grove for the resevoir retainers.
Like I said before it looks more like the 2.0L OHC Sunbird (Grand Am) pump, I just don't recall how the pressure line comes off those pumps, it may point down, like that fitting would, since I do recall the return tube pointed straight back (toward the firewall), I really wouldn't be surprised if it was the same pump.

 

I've seen street rods having their alternators mounted on the rear end axle. No idea HOW they did it, as far as a belt, pulley, etc. But the one problem I see is, at red lights, slow moving through a parking lot, there wouldn't be enough driveshaft RPM to spin the alternator enough, to produce enough amperage, to recharge the battery, so I dunno how they get away with it. GOOD battery?