A few hours later, the dash/wiring was out. The chassis braced




Now for the underside. Ohhhhhh, I forgot about the SFC's I welded under this car years ago. Cutting them out was a major PITA. A couple of hours and the chassis is ready to cut up




Floor is out. Pretty simple, the sheetmetal is very thin



Front frame was a major pain. Much more substantial metal up there. Sawzall did the job well, but got a few new blisters to show for it



There's one last hunk of frame under the firewall remaining. I need to figure out a method to support the chassis by the lift that won't get in the way of the new frame. I'll also have to figure out a wheeled structure under the front bumper to be able to move the car around the shop. TBD

 

I've got a pile of parts off this 91 TA if anyone near NC is doing a LS swap

Modified k-member, AC notch, removable center section. Cut WS6 spring, stock A-arms
34mm holley WS6/IROC sway bar
Intact T-top fiberglass
Rust free floor pan
AC box with OE copper heater core

 

How long is the rear driveshaft going to be? 24 inches?

 

There abouts

Not the shortest DS I've ever done, that goes to a wranger I built a few years ago. Thankfully, this car isn't on 35's, so a proper pinion angle is feasible

IIRC, it's 17" U joint CL to CL

 

I settled on a 97 thunderbird rack. It's much more compact than the BMW rack and has about the same specs. It's also the standard for Mustang II suspension retrofits, so it should readily be available for a long time
Still 6" of travel so, 3rd gen spindles still don't have a match. S10 only needs 6" so, win



Time to chop up the frame some more. The drag link idler "hump" needs to go an the top flange on the crossmember




I ended up chopping the whole crossmember off. Simple tubes are stronger and much more compact




I also chopped the rear half of the LCA mounts off to make room. They will have to be added back though
Flipped right side up, the last of the upper flange is removed



Tons of room. The oil pan will need to come back before the steering rack mounts and LCA flange can be finalized

 

I'd like a low mount AC compressor to work with the system eventually. Dirty Dingo mount, SD7 compressor. Borrowing this from another build




A little notch




Great, time to cap the holes and finish the crossmember
I'll be grinding all the welds down on the S10 frame. The inside is slathered with under coating and no good way to clean it off, so the welds are fair at best. Still better than the original S10 frame welds though
Front frame is cut down and everything ground






Crude sketch of the to-do fab remaining



That's quite a difference



Pretty substantial amount of trimmings this round. I think the suspension locations are the only thing S10 remaining

 

Back to the TA, I fabricated a cross beam to support the car. The vertical posts clip over the lift risers. I built them for undercoating car bodies on the lift. Seemed like a good use for this build too
Last of the firewall frame section cut out and toe board trimmed up to clear the new frame




Here we go!



Uhhhh, bit of a miss



Ended up needing to chop the TA frame all the way up to the radiator shroud



Sawzall time



Time to mock up the suspension. OMG it actually fits!





The rear chassis will tie in like ordinary box SFCs, weld at the rear LCA mounts and stitch along the pinch welds
The fronts will need a short length of frame fabricated to go from the narrow S10 to wider 3rd gen
Strut towers to floors will all be simple tin work



That's as far as I got before the day was done

 

Looks great. I love this project and this type of work.

 

The progress is amazing

 

Those are done. Whew, what a job!
Radiator/fan should have plenty of clearance now

 

Love seeing the updates
This thread is fabrication ****! Lol

 

Love seeing good fabrication work. Know what you want to do and have the skills to do it. Too many people asking "how can I make this work on my car" sort of questions. If you have to ask, you shouldn't be doing it.

I want to go back to that driveshaft. I can understand the CV joint on such a short driveshaft but why have a slip yoke that goes into the transmission and also have a slip joint on the driveshaft? I'm not sure the CV joint will like that plus if the driveshaft slip joint expands through movement, wouldn't that risk pushing the slip yoke even farther into the transmission? I see that setup as the CV joint is floating and it's position can move up or down the length of the driveshaft. It just doesn't look right.

 

The jeep driveshaft was a list of compromises using what the owner already had to make something work. I posted it because it's comically small. It's not really relevant to this build

I did a rough measure on the 91 today and it's 30" flange seal to seal from the hollow 10 bolt to the t-case rear. Add the slip yokes and a small amount of pull out and 24" u-joint to joint is pretty close for being a wild guess
The rear shaft on the 91 will be traditional, albeit much shorter than usual. Nothing crazy like the jeep

 

I dropped the mock ups into the 91 to get a feel for the fitment and floor height




I checked if the AC notch was sufficient too. I never did a full test fit after the notch. Well it fits, but I totally spaced on the steering rack. The little tensioner is in the same space. I may re-engineer the AC bracket or just nix the whole system. TBD




I am going to have to deepen the header notch on the PS. Not sure how I missed this being so close before. It's about 1/8" off the frame notch. Too close for me



I'm going to have to modify/build from scratch the front trans tunnel section. It's got hard contact on the RH up front and rear. Was really hoping this would clear because the front tunnel section is the hardest to fabricate. The middle section definitely would be a fab, but those are simple by comparison
I'll either do relief cuts/patches or raise the section on the firewall a bit. Really dont want to redo that section
It also helps set the toeboard location

My first priority is tying the new 2x4 frame to the firewall section. There is a noticeable amount of chassis flex with the new frame only supported on the ends
After that I can begin the floor reconstruction. PS won't change much but the DR has quite a bit going on
I'll also have to make a decision on custom coil overs up front or engineer the S10 torsion bars in
If I go bars, I'll have to figure out a way to make the mount super adjustable. I can't find any good reading on how to spec bars, so they'd be a bunch of guess n check. That's why coilovers look so much better, but expensive



I measured 30" from the front of the hollow 10 bolt to the t-case tail. That's roughly 24" joint to joint
The old style torque arm is just there to move the car around. I have a maximum motorsports underslung TA built for mustangs running 8.8's. It's about 10" shorter than stock and should end around the center of the t-case. Fabricating that crossmember is still TBD. I need to fully assemble the 8.8 I built and add it to the mix



Lastly, I'll be swapping trans mount. The OG 4x4 mount bolts right on, but is the lowest point on the car. A universal mount is much more compact. A simple flat bracket should do the trick
I can even reuse the S10 x-member mount bracket

 

This project is just great!!

 

I love the problem solving portions of these projects. I think that is the best part and what I personally like the best is when you "free your mind" from convention/rules/"this is how it is"...and then you can come up with fantastic solutions that others wouldn't think about. THAT is what makes builds like this so interesting, unique...I could stand there for hours looking at a car like this at a car show, C&C, etc. looking at details and having "Ah, that's how he solved this/that", moments. LOVE it.

The Kart had "problems" that had to be solved but nothing like these packaging issues. We swapped a Jeep 4.0 into a Unimog, at work, and that had a lot of packaging, electrical, plumbing and mechanical "problems" that required solutions for...that one was really fun and rewarding. Anyway, watching this project is wicked....love the attitude that it CAN be done and your unyielding vision/motivation to keep pushing it forward.

 

This is an amazing project. I absolutely love the concept. When it is finished it will be an epic, unmatched, one of a kind build. Bravo!

 

What an amazing amount of progress in a short time. Great job!

 

Not much time today

I mocked up the suspension and wheels. Ride height will end up roughly where stock 3rd gens are. I think slamming it is questionable
If this was a low powered build, I'd use 16" wheels. Swap F/R so the fronts can recess slightly more and the rears can fill out the wells better. I don't think LS1 12" brakes can put enough woah on this train though. Hopefully the 13" C5's can because thats all that can fit under the repop 17"s
The GNX site sells black GTA wheels in +18" if I need more brakes. TBD much later




Just speculating, but I threw in the old S10 torsion bars to see what sort of structure/bracket they would need. Hard contact with both header collectors. Makes the decision on coilovers easy



I also whipped up the beginnings of the main trans crossmember. I need it a small as possible for exhaust clearance, as low and narrow as possible to clear the front DS and sturdy enough to tie the L/F rockers and support the seat mounts too. Asking quite a bit of some simple 1.5" square. GM did all that with clever sheetmetal stampings



I also bit the bullet on a bead roller. Time to learn a new tool

 

This build is shaping up to be the real deal.
You make it look much easier than it is. It's impressive how easily you figure out problems.

 

Impressive work.

 

A couple small updates

I tried in vain to get the cheap A-arm ball joints out to begin chopping them up. Instead I ordered bolt in BJ plates. That should make it easier

I also ordered new seat brackets. These are the same as what Sparco uses, so they should be fine. The important part is they're slightly narrower than stock and can be further narrowed as needed



Back to the car, I tied the A-pillar and rockers to the SFCs. I plugged the old harness and antennae holes for good measure. The rockers were stitch welded along the pinch seam every 8" or so




Then this baby showed up. Can't wait

 

I was fiddling with an old seat track when I noticed a big DO'H!




The t-case was pretty close to horizontal looking. Being so high, it made real estate for the drivers seat very limited
T-case removed to better see the intended angle. The bottom is supposed to be nearly flat


You can really see it compared to the level crossmember bar. The level says 11* off, big miss on my part



The cause was me making an assumption way back when I was making the adapter for the trans tail. C5's were designed around the 4L60E. As such, the rear end shares alot of the same sims as well. When the T56 was shoehorned in, the diff was minimally modified to suit

As such, 3/6 T56 tail bolts lined up exactly with the old 4L60E extension housing which was horizontal on the bottom mount. It turns out the C5 engineers also clocked this flange slightly. Glad I caught that before building the tunnel
Oh well, just means redrilling the housing



That's better. It still needs a narrowed/raised bracket, but nowhere near as much

 

Last bit for the day, I drug out the old 8.8 I build 8-10 years ago

It's a new edge mustang GT axle. 3rd gens measure 62" WMS to WMS, 99-04 mustangs 62.5", close enough. I cut the brackets off a junk 10 bolt and welded them onto the 8.8. Only thing missing was the torque arm mount. Maximum motorsports makes a TA kit for late model mustangs, so I snagged that. It's low slung under the driveshaft, so exhaust/body clearance is maximized as a cost of ground clearance. It's also a great place to mount DS safety loops

I need to order 31sp axles for it and decide which disc brake to use. Already have a 31sp yukon locker and new gears to go in it. Also got a 1350 pinion yoke because I really don't trust flat flanges under severe torque





I'm going to fabricate some sort of top saddle to distribute the load. As-is, all upward rotational force is exerted on two 1/2 bolts in tension. They should hold, but the axle mount is exclusively the cast iron 1/2" webs next to the snout. That makes me leery of catastrophic failure. More problems to solve...

Setting the car down, it seems promising. Ground clearance isn't terrible



I think I goofed on the panhard mount...an adjustible bar should fix that. Assuming the LCA brackets are positioned correctly...
Or I could chop them all off and sendcutsend some fresh brackets




Luckily the TA stub landed in a very favorable position. I can always shorten the arm if I need more t-case clearance

 

The oil pan came back from the welded today. Atleast for phase 1. It still need a floor, front and new diff bosses added
It was enough to do a full suspension mock-up. Hadn't done that at all yet, much less in the final car

The dots are from a pin hammer peening the welds, not porosity. It helps keep warping under control. Not the prettiest, but I'm interested in function first


Like a glove. Time to see if the front diff is as much of a PITA as trailblazers
Turns out the PS motor mount has to be unbolted and the engine raised 1". It swings the pan away from the A-arm pockets just enough to get the diff in. Not the worst job on the car


I sourced a good TB front diff to replace the exploded mock-up. It turns out a missing chunk has an external web that needed a little more notch on the A-arm pocket



Perfect, now to trim the front of the diff off to clear the steering rack


I got the suspension all assembled and tried to cram the rack in. No dice. Had to strip one side, slide it in then reassemble. The strap is holding the suspension at ride height-ish vs full droop



Lots going on in that little tiny space

 

Dropped down to approximate ride height. I forgot to measure CV angles, but they are definitely less than 24*(max)
Going by catalog numbers, HHR tie rod ends should fit the rack's threaded studs, be the correct length and be the correct stud taper. I bought a cheap set off amazon to try. I'll return then and get a good set of moog's if they fit properly. Should also be enough to allow rack mounts to be fabricated





It should end up around stock ride height




With the front diff mounted, I was able to measure for a front driveshaft. Once that's in place, the drivers thigh armor can be added and the rest of the floor tied in. Explorer rzeppa joint and stub ordered



And lastly, the goof of the week. I've been so focused on steering rack fab, that I totally forgot about the alternator that's supposed to go there too. Oh well, can always go holley high mount for the main accy drive. Too late to go back to a steering box

 

This is looking awesome. I'd be a bit worried about the boot and joint life on the CV shafts....if it's meant to be a driver. If not, NM

 

Front CV's should be fine

Their max continuous angle is 24*. The previous measurement was 12* during mock-up. Well within range

 

Last week was very limited on free time, so not much progress

The no-name tie rods came in, so I mocked up the steering. This will require ALOT of compromises. So many, that I'm weighing the conversion back to a drag link/box

The plywood strips are to maintain a consistent gap to the oil pan
The first consideration is the rack mounts are not evenly spaced. Centering based on the mounts would cause the car to turn tighter in one direction vs the other
The PS mount has ample clearance, the DR not so much. Remember, I also have to add the rear half of the LCA mount pocket back. Same space as the steering rack




I think the solution is to grind off the DR mount entirely, then replace it with a much smaller exhaust clamp. The entire rack needs to be easy to unbolt and shift forward for almost any service to the oil pan/diff. I'd swap the PS rubber for a solid aluminum bushing. The soft mounts are to reduce vibration and feedback to the steering wheel which aren't a big concern for this build



Steering rack tilt is limited by the front diff. No biggie, but it does mean it will need expensive double U-joints to snake past the frame/header



Thankfully the PS has tons of room



Here's where the biggest compromises will come in




The tie rod angles are pretty severe, I'd wager 5* or more. This will affect the ackerman/anti in a big way. I need to get some more accurate measurements to see if this thing will even be driveable

The alternative is to go back to the original style steering box. Thankfully, 2/3 of the original holes are still exposed. I'd have to fab a new idler arm mount for sure, but that's pretty minor by comparison
The S10 center link does clear the pan and diff, but the DR inner tie rod drives strait into the diff. I think heim joint inner/outer tie rods will clear the assembly and work well with a bump steer kit
Definitely plan B as the box/drag link will consume most of the real estate in front of the engine

Mo' problems, mo' fun

 

Another possibility is to move the drivetrain back some. It will introduce more angle to the CV axles and limit how much the chassis can drop, but steering will be better

 

Very cool build! I don't ask this at all as a snub against your work, just something that hit my head when I saw your rear end setup.

You might have mentioned this further up thread but why not go IRS?

 

Post 24 https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/fabr...ml#post6525412

 

Is the rack in the way of a stretch belt? They aren't available in every possible size, but have been on GM engines for 20yrs? and my DD for 5.

 

I honestly hadn't considered stretch belts

 

So I nixed the steering rack completely. I did a rough bump steer test and it failed miserably. Around 4* over 4" of suspension travel, that's undriveable
To correct it, the bump steer kit would have to move the tie rod down to the middle of the steering arm (impossible) or move the steering rack up into the engine. Also impossible

I think I've thoroughly explored R&P for this build. Just cant swing it with my current setup

Back to the old heavy steering box. I went down a rabbit hole after reading that 82-92 Fbody boxes have internal stops limiting travel
Apparently everything non-Fbody has 42* of swing each way. F-body 34*. I was hoping to use the old WS6 box to keep the quick ratio on the build. I couldn't find any info on the S10 box, so I measured travel on both. It turns out this S10 box has the same travel as the WS6 box. Crisis averted

Also strange is that both the WS6 quick ratio box and the standard ratio S10 both have "Z" cast into them. That was the typical identifier in the past. Maybe this S10 had a reman box at some point with mix-matched guts?
Who knows

Anyways, I ordered new Moog drag link wear items and speedway tie rods. I also bought a 88-97 C1500 drag link for parts. They're $13 on rock auto
For this build, I'll need to cut/weld the drag link. Thankfully it's a non-wear item, so I'll only have to do this once. I'm leery of welding on steering components but it seems that it's really just forged steel, not iron or anything exotic. Grind test and drill test indicate common steel, not iron. Hopefully the new drag link is the same

I need to offset the middle part of the drag link somewhat to clear the oil pan. Without, the air gap will be around 1/4". Motor mount sag and engine twist will likely cause contact. No good



3rd gens don't have much room near the box for fans already. The S10 is even more forward and 4" inset. That's going to be a trick


Here is the AC tensioner with the drag link roughly centered. The idler arm has hard contact. At full lock left turn, the idler nearly hit the pan. Too close for comfort


I think the solution is to move the idler out 2" or so. Since it's a simple parallelogram linkage, as long as the dimensional relationship stays the same, then it should work. The frame may need a little grind, but nothing major



Lastly, the goof of the week
The S10 has a pretty beefy 33mm solid sway bar, similar to the WS6 hollow 34mm. I decided to mock it up and check clearance to the tie rods. Can't even bolt the tie rods on it hits so hard



Well, that's not how you mount a S10 sway bar, they're under slung. Way to make a simple task difficult



I also tried the WS6 bar. The mounts are way off (easy cut/weld), but the big 17x9 wheels don't clear at full turn. The solution is to move the bar rearward, but then I'd have to redesign the whole a-arm.... nah, S10 bar it is!

 

I just recently came across this thread and am quite impressed with the amount of fabrication involved and the high level of craftsmanship displayed. I also understand and am very empathetic to all the design work and rework that is involved in a major project of this sort. I designed and built the "homebrew road racer" on this forum so very familiar with the process. That being said, a lot of your packaging problems could be alleviated by moving the front wheels forward several inches. In my build moving the wheels forward was always part of the plan for weight distribution reasons. I had planed on 4" but ended up moving them forward 5", which is about the max without making the wheel opening look out of place on the fender. Your pretty far along on the project so this probably isn't an option but thought I'd throw it out there.

 

Damn...at that point, you've almost built a C4. That's a lot of work!

 

a tremendous amount of work for sure, but I knew that going into the project. I never understood why GM put the front wheels so far back, making the car so nose heavy. They could have moved the wheel wells forward where the battery sits and put battery behind at the firewall. The factory measured overhang from spindle centerline to leading edge of bumper is nearly 40" which is absurd.

 

As for the sway bar, what about adapting a universal rear anti roll bar to work in the front?

 

I got some time this afternoon to fiddle with the drag link

Key parts are the CK1500 drag link I'll be chopping up and the 1" round stock for the middle section. <$50 total



Jig made. I moved the tie rod attachment points forward 1/2" by adding an extra nut to the alignment threaded rods. That should clear the diff
I used electrical tape to fill the voids once the top nuts clamp down, the tape will melt away. hopefully the clamp force will hold them still



Then I prepped the donor drag link pieces. I did a grind and drill test to rule out this being cast iron. This piece bending vs snapping instantly was the final confirmation I needed. Mild steel, weld away



Just need these 4 chunks



I couldn't juggle the torch and phone together, so I skipped to the end. Preheated this super thick steel and gave it 3-4 passes on each side. With the amount of heat that went into this, I can't imagine it will have an issue



The dog leg ends just irked me, so I made some quick 1/4" plate gussets. I doubt they will make any difference, but visually it looks better



Quick fit up with a hot potato. Not enough time to let it cool down
Looks to fit well

 

AC is still a challenge
Tensioner still has hard contact



Maybe the compressor can go up to clear. Let's test on the LSA, see if the WP clears enough for that
Nope, the block sticks out where the upper bracket attaches. Can't go up anymore



Alright, how about old school manual tensioning. Swing it on a bracket and tighten a slot or clevis
Nope, not enough frame clearance



I think the solution is to use a stretch belt, but the bracket will need a redesign. Stretch belts barely jump on stock 4 rib compressors. This sanden is a 6 rib and the bracket is designed for the REAR 4/6 ribs to be used. No way I can make a belt jump to the back. So, the bracket will need to be redesigned to adjust the compressor rearward exactly two ribs. Thankfully the frame and motor mount have ample clearance to allow this

The next time it's on the lift I'll finalize the idler arm mount so the steering can be finished. I ordered heim joints, threaded tube for the tie rods and a bump steer kit to really dial in the system
I know heims and street aren't a great mix, but this thing shouldn't get all that much use during the year



My front driveshaft is finished, so I can modify the bellhousing and begin on the floor

Lots to do

 

Fabrication to-do list

Steering idler arm frame mount

LCA mount half sections

Finish oil pan

Torque arm mount that can be removed and is adjustable for pinion angle changes

Finalize trans crossmember

Modify bellhousing to clear front DS

Fab thigh armor around front DS

F/R DS loops

Floors/tunnel

Strut towers to frame

Coil over mounts to tie S10 frame and strut towers together

Figure out a shifter

Mount seat brackets, narrow DS, PS standard

Start building the exhaust

 

Holy mackerel. An AWD 3rd gen. You've always been one to challenge yourself!

~New2

 

I love seeing fabrication stuff. Gives me so many ideas.

 

This is cool! Man, Pocket, it's been a while....how've you been?

 

Back at it for a bit

Modifying the scattershield to clear the front driveshaft. Close up the fork hole, chop off the LH starter ear, plate the holes with 1/4". It'll never pass tech due to mods, but should be enough to protect my feet on the street





Plenty of room for the shaft





I like it when a plan comes together

 

Starting on the floors

Corner brace



Toeboard is my first attempt at beadrolling. It does the job, but is no metal artwork some guys can make





Outline of the tunnel. Top cap is 18ga to easily anchor whatever shift boot I come up with

 

Second attempt at bead rolling, much better results. I clamped the roller down to full depth for a single pass and only ran the motor one direction. Running the motor at a snails pace made this easier to control and the results are much better. Swinging the corners evenly and running over a previous edge is still a challenge. Probably just need more practice

This complex piece took 4hrs to fabricate. Ooof





Welded in. Top will be removable until the DR side is finished. Still haven't decided what I'm doing for the tunnel to firewall flange



3/16" driveshaft sleeve should be ready next week. That'll run the length of the frt shaft to protect my leg if the shaft lets go. That will be the base for the DR floor pan. More to come soon

 

Just came across the shell you are selling on marketplace - I thought that looked familiar! nice work as always you are making really good progress. You aren't far from me I might have to see this beast in person when its done!

 

Amazing work this build is amazing