Who hates knight rider? Don't get me wrong, the show was cool, but I hate Knight Rider only for the fact that it's getting harder and harder to find good parts and the parts only going to people who want to make a KITT conversion. Everything on ebay it seems mentions Knight Rider for any part for the early '82-'84 firebirds. I've been on Ebay for a while looking for some stuff for my '82 TA, wheels and hubcaps especially. I lost 2 auctions both ending minutes apart for the hubcaps and both auctions were won by the same guy. I lost by a dollar at the last minute. Who needs 2 sets? This guy was just sniping anyway because he made his first bid right at the end. Then you got the people selling the wheels targeted to knight rider conversionists. Even the Daytona Aero wheels. A read about this guy who gets firebird parts and says that all the conversion companines buy from him. This is rediculous. Then they want to jack the price way up because everything is "rare" and they think if it has to do with Knight Rider it is worth more. Sixty bucks for 4 caps is a steal, even if they are 14". Everyone wants the 15" but people will take anything. All I want to do is resore my car because yes, these cars are getting harder and harder to find in good shape but now I also have to compete with pepole to want to make a knight rider conversion. And how many of these conversions are actually good? People will ruin perfectly good firebirds and take parts that other people could use just to make a KITT. I'm not trying to offend anyone here because I know some of you have done conversions, and that is fine. People can do whatever they want. It just gets frustrating when you want make your car look original.

just my $0.02

 

It's not the Kitt conversions that I worry about, it's the David Hasselhoff conversions kits that scare me.

 

I thought I was the only one in the world......

My '83 originally came with the N89's....

Goodluck finding them for a good price.

Well said 1982TA!

 

No you did not. The eBay bidding automatically puts in bids for someone one bid increment over the next highest bidder. If you'd have bid 32$ on something, and he bid 40$, his bid would have been automatically placed for 33$.

You could have lost by lots more than that. The bottom line is that he bid more than you, and that's what won the auction.

 

I agree totally. Dont get me wrong, I love the show and I even had a KITT replica up until 3 years ago. But when I was building mine I obviously needed the famous N89 "Knight Rider" wheels... , and I piced up a nice set from a junkyard for $200 with all the caps. They were even 15's. I sold those wheels and caps when I put the car back to stock and had a hard time selling them for $450! Now, in the past couple of years, these jagoffs have since jacked the price of these wheels to as high as $1500 a set with caps. And these morons are actually buying them for that price!!! Now I have my 82 TA that actually came with the 15" N89 wheels and "PMD" seats, as they love to call them and I cant find a remotely reasonable set of 15's anywhere. Im stuck with 14's for right now. I am still in need of one cap and these people are all asking upwards of $100 for one 14" cap. Im sorry, but thats out of line. You guys cant tell me that if there were no Knight Rider conversionists, these parts would be very affordable. Because really, how many people are restoring 82-83 TA all original? Not that many. Thank *** I still have the correct seats still in the car (driver side power), or I dont know what I'd do.

Not to mention, why destroy all the TA's that are the hardest to find? 85-92 are the easiest to find in decent condition. They change so much stuff on thier cars when they destroy them, what difference does it make if they have to fill GFX holes, or swap a console? Or what about an 82-84 Firebird? You cant find a clean 82-84 TA anymore. And lets not forget the fact that 99% of their "dream cars" never get finished anyway. Then, theres all the idiots that see my 82 and say, "you should turn that into the Knight Rider car". Some guy actually asked me at a gas station a couple of days ago if it actually talked! And he was serious! It all boils down to this...it was a good show, even if a little corny, but a Knight Rider replica is a complete and total waste of a car. Just like a General Lee replica is a waste of a Charger. The moral of my rant is this...To all KR conversionists: STOP DESTROYING RARE CARS!!!!!!

Im done

 

Yah, thats possible. Whatever he bid though he beat me by a dollar. He could have put $100 for all I know. I guess it doesn't matter cause I lost.

 

I like Knight Rider, and I would build a replica after I finished with my GTA. But it'd have larger rims on it, no 15's for me as I'm not that focused on perfection. If it looks like KITT on the outside, then its good enough. I couldn't live with a Knight Rider dash anyways.

Besides, I always liked KARR more. :lala:

 

I totally agree with you. I have read about a guy who found a Recaro Trans Am and made it a KITT conversion. This is just wrong in my opinion. How many GOOD Recaro's have you seen? How many Recaro's have you seen period?? I can see your point on how people should use the later years since they are more common, but I can also see the other side as well. Maybe people who want to do a KITT should just stick to an '82 from the get go. Then they have all the parts. They don't need to gut the parts to put in a later model to make it a half assed KITT that doesn't get finished anyway. I saw a guy where I worked that had a KITT conversion. It was an '89 Formula but it had gray interior. He did have the tan PMD seats however and the shifter. It was kinda cool but these are the majority of the conversions I think. It was kind of a waste in my opinion. They just get certain items and ruin the car. I think the parts are way overpriced also. I lost 4 caps at $62. To me that is a steal since I have seen people who wanted $100 a PIECE and the repos are about $80 if they even make them anymore. I was more mad that I lost because it was such a good price. They will probably just resell them to try and make a profit or go to a KITT car. Or it could be for a legitimate restore who knows. Another auction for 3 caps went for about $80. The same seller had some '84 Firebird hubcaps that have the slots cut out in them and the firebird logo in the center. I've never seen them before but they were at about $40 and no bids last time I checked. Don't know what they ended at but If they were on Knight Rider you can bet they were expensive. And you know what people will do with them when their screen name has "knight" in it. There is an auction for the 15" rims starting at $700 and the reserve is not met! It's stupid!!There was another auction for the Daytona rims for about $600. These aren't even the correct wheels for a KITT yet the description says they will be good for that "KITT conversion" I'm sure someone with an actual Daytona would rather have them, but I have heard of them being used anyway. There was an article in HPP that had a mint '83 Daytona that was an actual pace car. The original owner kept it thinking it would go up in value. It actually deprecieated in value just because they weren't that desireable due to lower performance. I think these cars (82-84)are still at the low end of the spectrum as far as value just because I think they are overlooked for higher performace firebirds. I think they might go up eventually though. People want $1000 for PMD seats, shifters are also high. It's not even the shifter, it's just the **** and button. I got an overdrive shifter for $8 freaking dollars, but the ***** goes to $100+. It's crazy. Just because someone says something is rare doesn't mean it's worth alot. just for a little comparison a 70-81 shift **** is going for $15.00. Granted it's not the exact same, but it is similar. There is nothing special about it. 15" snowflake rims are going for about $175 and no bids. How are these any less rare than the third gen parts? I've come to realize everyone on Ebay thinks that what they sell is "rare" and that means it's worth more. Anything is only worth what people will buy it for. One KITT conversion site sells premade KITT's for $40,000. How many amature conversions will get that much, even professional? Again, it's only a third gen bird and right now I don't care how rare or special you think your's is right now it's not going to get that much. Also I think some of these conversions will probably go down in value. Well, I've done enough ranting for now

 

I love the TV show. Id bet thats part of the reason I have my 84 T/A (I was brainwashed as a child by watching it all the time!).

What I do not love are the half-a$$ed hack job KITT replicas running around that have ruined perfectly good 82-84 Birds.

I have seen many well done replicas, and I give credit to their owners, but its the hundreds of other cars that are trashed in the name of Knight Rider, that bug me. I like seeing a nicely built KITT replica.

IMO they just shouldnt be built off of 83 DT500 Replicas or Recaro cars, etc...

And of course the prices for N89's are totally insane. A few years ago I literally threw a set out in the garbage I thought they were shot, but I guess I couldve gotten some $. I wont even sell my extra parts unless I know they are going to a good cause (a stock-appearing resto).

 

i actually laughed aloud at that one...

 

Boy!
You guys have issues!
All this hate!
You talk about rare?
What is rare? An 1982-1983 Trans Am? The wheels? Almost every 1982-1983 Trans Am had them! The shifter ****? Again, they all had them! The hubcaps were big $$$ direct from Pontiac, way back! Check the prices in the parts catalog! People are ruining perfectly good 1982-1983 Trans Ams? I sure haven't seen any that jump out to me as perfect!
Last time I checked, the '70-'81 auto shifter ***** are climbing! The have been disco'ed by Pontiac!
You want to talk about rare? Check out the 4-speed gear shifter **** for a second gen bird! Up to, and over $350.00!
You guys want you own car to be rare, and worth big $$$, right? It will cost you! If your car already has these things, good! Your car is worth more, right?
Try owning a '89 Turbo Trans Am! All the parts are skyhigh! The owner's kit pulls up to $650.00! The door decals are pulling over $250.00! The sparkplug wires are pulling up to $100.00 for used!!!!!! Over $300.00 for NOS! That's just 6 stupid wires!
Look how many clone Special Editions are roaming around! Gee, check Ebay for those! They still pull super big $$$$! As fakes! Are you and everyone going to blame Smokey and the Bandit? Some do! But the fact is, the cars looked great, all black, with gold pinstripes!
Come on, it was a show for entertainment! George Barris put most of them together (as I just met him at the Sema 2004 show, nice guy to chat with), and I don't see him making copies to sell to everyone!
Were any of you people around during the show (when it ran on prime time)? Thanks to the show, the real Trans Ams sold!
The show was sponsered by Pontiac back then! I know, I taped them! I got good commercials on the Trans Ams and other Pontiac models during the shows!
Watching the shows got people intrested in the cars. If someone wants to make a copy, that's their choice.
You people should be glad it's a Trans Am, instead of slamming them! Go pick on the imports! Not another Pontiac!
BTW, I liked the show, and every show that shows a Firebird or Trans Am!
We should be helping all owners of Birds here, not cutting and slamming them!

George

 

And I was begining to think that nobody cared

 

One reason I don't like them is cause I have a Black 89 Formula 350 and everybody calls it KITT
There are very few nice KITT cars, most are really nasty looking...
I see a ton of them at the T/A Nats

 

Ya know, I had to laugh when you brought up the TTA. Ive seen more of them than decent 82-84 TA's. Sure theres a bunch of early thirdgen birds running around, trashed by some wetback or ******* that could care less what the car looks like. Youre missing the whole point. There are expensive parts for pretty much all cars out there, included your TTA. But a lot of the parts for the early ones would be nowhere as high if it werent for the KR replicas. BTW, there are more Recaros, DT500's and even a few 15th anniversaries that have died because of KR than you think. Mentioning parts for sale...Im talking about all these jerks out there on e-bay especially that are listing these parts incorrectly just to jack up the prices. Im sorry but "Knight Rider 15" wheels for sale", "Knight Rider style seats for sale". HELLO!!! They are stock TA parts, not KR parts. These people need to get it through their heads

 

And you proved my point. An 89 TTA was not a car that was prouced in great numbers. So its right for parts to be expensive. 82-83 TA's were everywhere when they were new. Pontiac made 10's of thousands of them, therefore the parts were common. The wheels, seats, hubcaps, shift ****. If there were so many of them, why the skyhigh prices? Ive seen it myself. A guy with a professionally build KITT replica, bidding on 2 or 3 sets of N89 wheels and caps....for what? He has a car already with the wheels on it. Why? So he can sell them for 3 times what he paid for them to some 19 year old kid trying to build a KR car. Makes a lot of sense dosent it? I dont think so.

 

Pontiac 6000's also had the "PMD" seats, they just didn't fold foward.
As for the wheels i just sold a set ofr $90.00 cause they were just in my way.

and granted TTA's were a low production but i see them all the time, at shows and out driving around, but i don't see any early t/a's any more. I miss my 83 some jerk plowed into it.

 

Well,
It does make sense. Things in demand go for more money!
Have you ever tried nice to post over at the Knight Rider Club site, to see if anyone would sell you any caps?
I asked someone not to long ago, and they quoted me $15.00 each, used. Sounds like a good price to me!
You should feel lucky that there are people out there with an intrest in your year car! To many people, even the '79s and up, are dog years! Except for the later fourth gens.
It's all in people's personnal preference, I guess.
1979 is the best year for the Firebirds, including the Trans Am. Have you seen the prices lately? They are climbing up in price on ebay all the time! Why? They made the most that year.
Probably because everyone seems to remember 1979 was a good year.
I've even seen '81s going for big $$$ on ebay.
I hope you can finsh your car the way you want. You'll find a good price out there. Keep looking.

Not trying to offend you,

George

 

According to the Standard Catalog of Firebird by John Gunnell, there were 1550 Turbo V6 Firebirds made. Is it rare because of the numbers? Not only that but it is an Anniversary model also so I could imagine that people will think it's valuabe. According to the price guide it should sell in mint condition for about 20,000. Factory price new was $32,000.

In '82 there was a total production of 116,364 Firebirds made. In '83 it dropped to 74,897. There were about 2000 Recaros made in '82. '83 and '84 Recaro data is unavailable. '83 Daytonas numbered at around 2500, and '84 15th Anniversary models numbered in at about 1500. SO by the numbers these should be the rare models.

'82 Trans Am production was 52,960
'83 Trans Am production was 31,930

According the the book, I belive all Trans Am's came with the Turbocast aluminum wheels with the black caps and Firebird S/E's came with body colored caps. (14" turbocast alluminum) Base firebirds came with wire or a chrome looking hubcap with firebird logo in center.

Here are the codes:
N24 : WHEEL I5 X 7 ALUMINUM CAST, 5 INCH BOLT CIRCLE
N89 : WHEEL, TURBO ALUMINUM
N90 : WHEEL, 15 X 7,ALUMINUM CAST,4.75 INCH BOLT CIRCLE
N91 : COVER, SIMULATED WIRE WHEEL, LOCK
P20 : HUBCAPS, WHEEL, STYLED

Is P20 the code for the "Bowling ball" cap? In the book it says "bright aluminum hubcap, available for Firebird S/E or Trans Am with WS6/WS7 only. (No Cost). I have seen silver ones before (unpainted)

Are N89 Code wheels 15" or 14". If they come on a crossfire car with WS6/WS7 they should be 15" correct? If N89 are 15" what is the code for 14" Also why the different bolt circle of N24 and N90?

N91: wire wheel covers base firebird only.
N90: Silver or Gold Cast alluminum wheels except base firebird.
N24: 15x7 Finned turbocast alluminum with WS6/WS7 only (Gold)

Recaro's got the 15" Gold wheels standard (N24)


so what code is for the finned rims that look like the turbocast rims but cannot use the hubcap? It's starting to get confusing and the descriptions of the RPO's are a little vague or similar. If N24 is a Turbocast wheel with hubcap, why does the RPO just say Aluminum cast? Can anyone clear up this RPO code and wheel confusion?

Anyway, what I'm trying to show is that pretty much all Trans Am's at that time had the hubcap rims. Weather 14" or 15". IF you got a Trans Am with the Crossfire (LU5) package you automatically got the 15" rims, as did with the WS6/WS7 package. Recaro's got everything at no cost IF you got the Crossfire. with a 4barrel V8 the package was $2486 and 4speed manual trans was required. IF you had the LU5 it was considered part of the package but the Y84 still cost $2,968 and an additional $72 cost for the automatic trans. I guess you could say "standard" Trans Am's (no LU5, WS6/WS7) got the 14" rims. Are they rare? I'd have to say NO by looking at the production numbers. Weather they are hard to get or find now doesn't matter. It's how many were made in the first place.

 

The only '80/'81's worth getting in my opinion are the 301 Turbo's. But how many of those can you find in good shape and with the original engine? I know you can build up the 301 to get awesome power with it. I've heard of people getting into the 11's with the stock engine, but since everyone thinks the motor is junk they swap them out all the time. I wanted a Special Edition 301 Turbo for awhile.

 

yah, not only 6000's but I believe early (82) Grand Prix's had them as did '82 Grand Am's and early Corvettes...so I've heard.

 

I found a web site that might clear up the wheel differences.
Firebird/Trans Am wheel Identity Chart

1982-1983
N89: Turbocast aluminum 15x7 black or bright cap
RPO for standard 14" turbocast aluminum not given

1984
N89: Turbocast aluminum wheels 14" ONLY
N24: Turbofinned aluminum

All Models: 14x7 Silver/Charcoal or Gold
15x7 Special Performance Package Only
14x7 Firebird w/Handling Package
14x6 Firebird (Charcoal Only)

 

It's pricey to build one, but recently the actual KITT car, or one of them, was up for auction (not eBay!). I want the TV show DVD package to tell ya the truth. Also liked the Dukes of Hazzard and other car shows like Miami Vice that I still want on DVD...with it's many featured guests and hot music soundtracks that could be the reason it's NOT on DVD! [licensing the multiple BIG artists]

 

James Knight -the guy on the left?
I have that pic from the GTA SA forum- also on line... congrats on your 'gay thread', It features Gary Coleman, from Diff'rent Strokes and former Calif gov. candidate!
Funny as it is, David Hasselhoff, though corny in the role, was better then Baywatch...ugh! hehe
Bill

 

I liked that quote so much, I just had to show mine

It's spending the winter along side my 83 T/A.

Oh, I can see both sides to this issue. I think it's great to have people interested in Trans Ams, but if alot of them could just follow through with the conversions, and have something worth while, it would make more sence. I've seen some of these "conversions", and I have to laugh. I meen, come on, just because a guy cuts an opening in the front bumpercover for some red LEDs, and spray cans the car black, doesn't make a conversion, all it's doing is hacking-up a car that might have been something, instead of a rolling knight-mare

Enjoy!

 

:hail:

 

Hello Guys

just FYI:

i sell reproductions in fiberglass of the 1982-1983 Turbo Cast Wheels GM Hubcaps nicknamed as "bowling *****".

they come in black gelcoat and they will need minior finishing work to look outstanding

you can see pictures here:

http://www.knightfoundation.net/vend...k_llaguno.html

also you can see pictures of my KARR replica here.

www.cardomain.com/id/california_karr

btw: i have putted a lot of efford in making my 1984 Pontiac Trans Am into KARR.

the car was originally a Hard top , now is a T Top.

i just want to help people with this issue about getting 15" caps.

ps: i have 2 14" GM original caps that i will sell at a good price

anyone who is interested in any of these shoot me an email to:

california_karr@hotmail.com

Thank you

Erick LLaguno

 

 

I had to edit mine down a bit but that's cool
I think the 1980s and late 70s was not really the best Firebird years... the decade long political intervention and oil shortage along with big engine and low HP means they looked good but more show then go.
The Smokey and the Bandit movies made the most awareness of all for Pontiac but the Knightrider show did have a similar effect.
My way of thinking is the 82-92 F cars have all the right ingredients from a design standpoint and a definate thumbs up to GM's design staff. In this case again though, I think things got better and better until GM pulled the plug. The 4th gens can figure into that in a slightly diffent aspect. I see MANY around hre in private use... You wouldn't know at all they had trouble selling but they are found on dealer lots... Don't know what to make of that really.

Here's the pic above as I first saw, and more amusingly:

 

I think I had a fault again, was distracted...what happened??
ugh
I guess things did work...my windows closed again for no dang reason... Hate that

 

Aww DAMNIT!! You guys won't beleive this, but I just got that same jacket a few days ago!! And I've never seen that pic before now! LOL

But the difference between me and Hasselhoff? I make that jacket look gooood!!

 

It's better then scoping him out in the 'trunks' hehehe
Bill (leather jacket guy as well!)

 

Ahahahaha, please make my day and post a pic.

 

 

Thing is, they don't have the Poniac emblem in the middle.

 

Not to mention theyre in Mexico. Hopefully they are better than those KR noses you were selling a couple of years ago.

 

Yah, I know...I got a catalog from Paddock.com. Doesn't seem to have a lot for 3rd gens, but it did have a center cap section. There it had the pontiac arrowhead logos for the silver centercaps that came on the rally wheels that were on some firebirds and Grand Prix's. I don't know if they would work or not. They may be too big to fit in the indentation. There was a guy on Ebay selling a set of unused arrowheads for the bowling ball hubcaps. I lost the auction, just because I missed it before I bid, buy they went for $5. I was surprised since I'm sure they are in demand. The description wasn't very good though so I'm sure that is why not a lot of bids on it...just 1.

 

1982t-topTA:

What are you talking about ?

Front Noses?

i just sold like 2 noses and they were PRETTY GOOD (the one installed in my car is one of those and see it for yourself:



the replica caps can use the red pontiac emblem (i have done reproductions of those emblems too, but most people don´t use them because of the KR vehicles)

about the front noses , the crappy ones you see on ebay all the time are NOT mine, those are paper thin , they will warp , and also will have spider webs and will CRACK.

all my fiberglass pieces are manufactured by a place that makes reproduction body cars such speedster, Lamborghini, Ferraris, etc.

i also like nice stock cars , in fact i have a 1969 Pontiac Firebird converteable , with just 40K in the odometer, it used to be from my grandfather.

here is a picture of the finished cap mounted on my car:



PM me or email me for more details if anyone is interested.

shipping the bowling ball caps wont be expensive because is an small item i have send those to Austria ((Wolfgang), Spain (visit caballero2000.com for more info of him) , Germany , and Ohio.

i have been selling things of these kind since 1997 and have never ripped anybody off (that is pretty common on the internet), i lost 800 dolars when i tryed to buy some items from Knight Alternatives like 3 years ago.

ps: i don't sell KR Noses anymore because shipping one of those things to USA will cost like 350 dolars now in these days. but i still have 2 extra noses in my Tools room , if someone want to come to pick them up , i will give you some Enchiladas as breakfast LOL

i have another 3rd Gen trans am , its a 1985 TA with GFX with just 10k on the odometer , it still has that "new smell" on the interior. the exterior is white , and the interior is marron , it has an automatic transmision , and t tops (fully loaded , with rear cargo cover option).

i WILL never convert that car into a KR vehicle , because i would destroy it. that car is beautifull the way it is.

 

So the same pontiac arrow head from the older style centercap for the Pontiac Rally II wheels will fit the turbocast hubcap? Do you still make the reproduction ones? Like I said, the Paddock sells them for about $7.00 a piece. I thought they might fit and it would make sense for part interchangability, I just wanted to make sure they would really work.

 

1982TA:

i made 2 sets of reproductions emblems to a guy in Overseas , but that was like 1 year ago , i would need to check if the place that made the reproductions is still arround.

about the interchangability with the Paddock , i cannot really tell my friend

 

...

 

The pic is above

 

Ahh, I was hoping for a picture of you posing in the jacket the same way that David Hasselhoff was posing in his.

Nice jacket though!

 

The sad thing is it's only a hubcap. My favorites are the modest Cadillac wire ones (well constructed for standard options), those I've seen run the gamut on eBay prices as well as other sources. There were some custom old Cad rims as well I was trying for...went a bit high. Certain odds and ends will have a seemingly active market for them
I have the GTA 16" I'm quite happy to stick with, even though I like custom spoke rims most 'pimp ride' styles have...
Not to mention some people here.
>> Here's an old leather jacket shot of me with an odd example BC Rich Bich guitar I got off eBay about 2 years ago...for another use hehe
BILL

 

I want a KITT car now. With that headlight setup I could use it to get through early morning traffic.


:lala:

 

Planning on a conversion myself.. someday... but want to rip apart the cars I have now and bring them back to their prime first.

I do have a set of 14" caps in fair to good condition if anyone is interested in buying them. Bought them off e-bay so I had something to compare to for the 15". I was able to find one 15" cap at the Iola, Wi swap meet/car show. So that is really all I need.

I agree with the whole not using the Recaros or Anniversary cars, etc.. but really for the most part, the cars are not being "ruined" almost everything is reversible. So if the owner kept the original parts, they could just swap everything back if they wanted to.

Just my $0.02.

 

I like knightrider and everyting but seeing kitt on tv is enough for me.I would never do a conversion because it cost a lot of money to do it right and I would rather put that money towards my engine.

 

I like how that interior looks. Gotta love the S/E's.

How many miles does it have?

 

Santa was good to me this christmas. I got KR season one DVD set and the 1:18 KITT from Ertl.

Ive been watching Knight Rider for the past two days straight. And I love it! Hehe.

I also pulled the KITT diecast out of the box right away and started playing with it.

I love the show, but I would never turn my 84 into a KITT. I can just watch it on TV if I need to see it.

 

Lol.. I also got the DVD set from Santa..

 

The simple things affect my taste, the flashing LED, the all black monochromatic scheme, that was mostly all I needed to see. Looking at your own interior shot, I'm glad they softened the transmission console...that thing is JUST too squared off in the early gens. I also like the dash instrument moldings of later years the downside being they SCREAM PLASTIC hehe