Im just curious as to what the hotter car was back in the day, (the '80's that is) Mustang, Camaro, or Firebird? Of the three, which was faster, Ford or GM? And if the GMs were faster (hopefully) was the Camaro faster than a Firebird, or vice versa? Which models were rare sights (Camaro & Firebird) What car did you see more of? (I mostly see Mustangs or Camaros...) Was advertising of the cars fierce? (ie: GM vs Ford) Lastly, what varient of Camaro, or Firebird, or Mustang made you go, "Whoa... Check it out!"
I can't really answer the history part because I was a product of the '80's and my Formula has been a big part of my life and as a result I like 'birds over 'maros.
I'm hoping for unbiased answers...
Derek

 

In the 80's third gens were the sh*t PERIOD

 

well, why was that?

 

... lol maybe in 82 they werent, IMO GM didnt start picking up until 85 when ford released it's ho 302, and got better in 87 with the introduction of a 350.

 

Corvette was the best. Esp 87-89... Or the Gran Nationals

 

As far as camaros vs. firebirds vs. mustangs, the mustangs were always faster. You can read many magizine shoot out articles in the articles section of TGO's homepage...and basically in almost every one...the mustang was faster, however the f-body handled MUCH better. I dont think any car in particular held the throne (but i woudlnt know personally), but **** if i was back in the 80's i would want a nice freakin trans am or GTA.

 

if u read in some old articles youll see that the L98 3rd gen beat the 302 5 speed in a couple tenths...............

 

ah well sorry to say that when chevy and pontiac were told to send any camaro and firebird of their choice to compete with the Mustangs....they sent lb9 5 speed cars. Theres atleast 3 articles in that section in which Chevy and Pontiac dont send a l98, but a lb9 to compete in those shootouts. See where im coming from???

 

Third Gen Camaro's were THE car to have in the 80's and an L98 G92 car vs. a 5.0 M5 LX was a drivers race. There was faster stuff than both but nothing else had the same popularity or overall performance for the price.

 

1987 and after
1- speed
the L98 iroc and the mustang were very close and the firebird
was a little slower but not much differnt

2- handling the iroc is known as best handling american car
and i think it handled better than most euro cars,the fire bird handled great but not as good as iroc's specifically,the ford handling was worse

3-styling
the mustang looked like a 93 opel kadett(really pathetic)
the firebird looked great but the camaro was a real
piece of art because it looks agressive and pretty at the same time which is rarley matched,
the best looking would have to be the convertible camaro
because it was like 20 years ahead of time,and it could turn
heads even better than the corvette,

4- price
now this is were the mustang kicks *** it averaged arond
4000$ less than the other two and thats why it sold as many cars as GM sold ,

i personnally believe that the best car of the 80's was the iroc camaro

 

The Mustang, period. GM had to produce a $23k car to compete with a car that was sold for $14k.

As for handling, the Iroc couldn't handle the WS6 based cars.

Stying, I love my Mustangs looks, but the Firebird looked way better than the Camaro did, the flipup headlights, taillights that went all the way across the back vs having the license plate right in the middle, the Camaro dash just sucked, period. Pontiac had the orange lights in a 4 pod gauge cluster with a checkerboard style, purely awesome.

And the big thing that made the Firebird/Trans Am/GTA better than the Camaro......

It didn't have a bowtie on it.

 

The Formula was "The most Fun to drive" as per some articles. Also called a "tactical street fighter" Especially the 350 models.

John

 

I'm gonna hate saying this.

Which one would i own from the 80's?

89 Turbo Trans AM. Guranteed to deliver the stomp on pretty much anything at the time.(wait, I actually own one :-))

Best looking?

Prolly go with the GTA's again, although I like the Irocs too. Kind of a draw I guess.(Niether compare to the 91-92 birds imho)

Best bargain?

Hands down a 5.0, 5 spd Stang. Formula was still 2-3g$ more than it and the TA/GTA/Iroc was a whole lot more than it

later
Jeremy

 

I feel just the opposite as you on the Firebird vs Camaro. I can't stand the flip up lights, tail lights or the dash in the Firebirds. I guess that's why they sold both and why I have an Camaro and you a Firebird

 

I'm with panther on this one, but I guess if my first car was a firebird, I'd be kind of partial to those. I like when my co-workers/friends ride in my Iroc and say ' Man, I remember when these things were the shiznit.' Yea, and I guess now they suck?? Well, I guess comparatively, they are dinosaurs.

 

I agree, i never liked the camaro dash, i love my 4 pods and orange lights, and i love the tail lights on birds more than 'maros and i like how i have a side marker for each corner...

 

After owning both irocs and T/As,i definitely like the T/As way better.You just feel like your in a better designed car although they share basically everything.As far as the 80s go,i have a ton of magazines from then and in the early years the mustangs beat the TPIs,but 88-92 they really started coming back.

 

Good post aj, pretty accurate. Third Gen Camaro's actually outsold the M*stang 5 years by themselves, which never happened before. The F*rd has always been cheaper, but you got more car with an F-Body. The most Z28's ever were also sold during these years. There were also more F-Bodies made then M*stangs all together.

But let's stop with opinion and answer the questions:

"Im just curious as to what the hotter car was back in the day, (the '80's that is) Mustang, Camaro, or Firebird?"

Camaro's had the popularity, (especially IROC's) M*stang's were the attainable bargain, and Firebird's offered luxuries the others didn't have or care to have.

"Of the three, which was faster, Ford or GM?"

It was a tie with both companies top models being the L98 G92 vs. the 5.0 M5's.

"And if the GMs were faster (hopefully) was the Camaro faster than a Firebird, or vice versa?"

Regular production Camaro's had more power and tighter suspension, etc. The fastest cars were the IROC-Z's, later Z28's, and Formula's. Not counting special editions like TTA's.

"Which models were rare sights (Camaro & Firebird) What car did you see more of? (I mostly see Mustangs or Camaros...)"

L98 cars and LB9 M5 G92's were pretty rare even then because most F-Bodies were low model 305's and V6's by an extremely high percentage. 5.0 M*stang's were just everywhere. You should see mostly Camaro's and M*stang's because they were the most produced.

"Was advertising of the cars fierce? (ie: GM vs Ford)

Yes. They were all well advertised and competitvely so.

"Lastly, what varient of Camaro, or Firebird, or Mustang made you go, "Whoa... Check it out!"

IROC-Z's, Z28's, TA's/GTA's, Formula's, in that order. But especially IROC-Z's.

 

Thanks for the info IROCZ When i was little, now this was like 1994... i used to stare ate GTAs because i never saw em bfore n thought they were custom because of the wheels... but i dont recall IROC-Zs, i mean i see em now but i dont member seeing them before. And BTW my car happens to be one of those low buck 305s... argh... and to think when i was a kid i thought it was the best damn car on the block- told my friends it had the top motor, all the options ect... only to realize later its missing just about everything i said it had...

 

All the articles I've read comparing L69-powered F-bodies to 5.0 Mustangs (same years) the L69 always came out ahead of the 302.

 

Even if the Mustang was faster, a stock Fox-body won't take corners like a stock thirdgen can.

 

Wow, only one one refrence to the GN, and some talk about the TTA. I own a '86GN, my dad owns a 89 TTA, and I own a '91 305cid 1LE - the camaro can hide when it come to the quater, by far the TTA does it all well, but you can't bang the gears yourself.
In the '80's - 86-87GN's GNX and the 89 TTA. Some may even go as far as the Callaway Corvettes, but the cost of those monsters was quite a bit more than GN's and TTA.
Just my 2cents.
-Andrew

 

87 - Introduction to the L98. Of course this may be a little biased. Just imagine if Chevrolet would have let out 5 speed l98's...

 

Yup--a 305 (L69) ownjeds 83-84 Mustang 302s great engines--that were only surpassed by the LB9 5 speeds

 

I 2nd that.

I raced a ton of foxbody's and vettes back in 89-92 and
stomped a mudhole in the a$$ of all of them. Stoplight to stoplight TTA was hard to beat. With the technology of the day it took a worked 5.0 on the sauce to hang with a few bolt-ons in my TTA. Granted $ for $ 5L has the tip, but is was to fun kicking the crap out of them in an ususpecting 305 TA

 

Well the grandnationals were sweet along with the t types but im looking for replys on any type of camaro and firebird... this has been sweet so far!
keep the replys comin ladies and dudes!

 

Sorry guys, all you gotta do is look at the culture. You say "5-point-O" and everyone knows exactly what you're talking about, and the image isn't a SBC. Nearly the same goes for "Iroc". Regardless if you wanted to be a tough guy and had a small *****, the 5-liter Mustang was your car.

The F-body got a bad rep because of the 305's. By the time the TPI came out there were already legions of LG4's on the road. Even then the vast majority of TPI 305's that everyone assumed were 350's because they're a small block, were still slow.

Ever notice how every 86 Iroc has a "corvette motor" or "LT1" under the hood? These are the blistering fast 16 second capable cars.

People STILL laugh when you roll up in a thirdgen next to a "real performance car".

But don't worry, most people just don't know. Even most of the people on this forum have no idea that the 90-92 L98's were some mean drivetrains. It's a question of personal experiance. Most people didn't and still don't have any.

 

But don't worry, most people just don't know. Even most of the people on this forum have no idea that the 90-92 L98's were some mean drivetrains. It's a question of personal experiance. Most people didn't and still don't have any. [/B][/QUOTE]

I would argue with you on this point. Yes by early '90's the L98 were a better drivetrain then the earlier ones - I assume you state this because of the valvetrain, and the updated electronics, but in stock form they were not anywhere near the potential of the LT5 or the new LS1's. TPI was not a hot set up anymore - it had its limitations, SPFI was more sophisticated and was around on GM cars much earlier than the '90-92 L98 variants.
Again, just M.O.
-Andrew

 

I'll just say the 305 TPI automatics gave thirdgens a bad rap. WHen the 305 was temaed with a T-5 it was a much quicker car--close to a 350.

But Mustangs with the 302s were cheap and plentiful. As long as they had the T-5 they were pretty dominant. Can't handle and looks so outdated though

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 871LEIroc
[B]I'll just say the 305 TPI automatics gave thirdgens a bad rap. WHen the 305 was temaed with a T-5 it was a much quicker car--close to a 350.



thats true except for 1985 Auto TPI
which was rated at 215 bhp

the rest is like u said were slow 190 bhp

 

To roughly sum up the (then)new tests,
it went something like this:
In '82 the Mustang was faster
'83/84 Camaro was faster. Someone posted an L69 (190) test
'85-87 varied some but Mustang was generally slightly faster
'88 L98 tested on par with 302 5sp
'89-92 The L98 got faster and got the Z28 down to 5.8 0-60 and 14.4 1/4. the Mustangs in Stock form could never beat those two numbers any article I have or read.

The 'birds were pretty much always slower, with exceptions being the TTA and Firehawk, of course.

Like mentioned above, the Camaro/Firebird handled MUCH better and the Mustang was cheaper.

Another thing worth mentioning is that with with Ford it went like this. Either you get the 88hp 4cyl turd or you get the 225 HP top gun. No in-betweens. (hp ratings varied with years). Since you could get both in the LX form you could have a cheap, fast car.

Wit GM you had lots of choices. For instance in '91 you had the base 6cyl for pretty cheap, a step up V8 170hp, then in Z28 you had the 205, 230, or top gun 245 hp V8.
The 230 hp was just barely slower in acceleration than the Mustang 5 speed.

The Mustangs were fast, fun cars but the F-cars (to me) looked much better, looking like $30k sleek performance machines while the Mustangs were very plain boxes. Granted they were fast boxes.

Also worth mentioning is the fact that I am basing the above comments strictly on Magazine tests as in real life at the strip you see all sorts of variations(they usually are not stock, either) and the general consensus for a long time was that mustangs were faster, although you must remember that the majority of the Z28s you see were NOT the L98 variants.
It is also unrealistic to think that, for instance, all 1990 IROC-Z L98s could muster 0-60 in 5.8 sec. Magazine tests represent a sampling of a car's ability but not necessarily the gospel as in reality on different days/conditions and/or with different cars you could have different results.
Could all 1989+ L98 Z28s beat all '89+ Mustang 302 5speeds stock for stock? No, but tests showed that it was possible.

 

I'm not so sure the LB9/T5 combo was faster than the L69/T5 combo... when I had an L69 and T5 (and stock 3.73 gears) the TPI/T5 cars couldn't keep up with it.

 

that might be possible because i think a an 83 z28
has lower wieght than the 85+ irocs and z28's

 

but what gears did the T5 LB9 cars have? 3.42/3.45s really helps them out. They do have a 50lbs-ft torque advantage (295lbs-ft--that varies a little)

Or maybe you were just a better driver!

Car and Driver gota 15.0 with an L69..ONCE. That was the fastest published time for any magazine. But I have more then one test of the LB9 thats sub 14 second.

 

Straight line = Mustang

Handling = Camaro


Thats how i see it

You cant always follow magazines, ive seen 87 L98s run 15.3 and another article was 14.5...... Depends on drivers


The L98 Fbody VS the 302 5 speed Fox Body was a One of the best matchups ever. It was deff a classic and a pretty much equal one. Sometimes the L98 wins and sometimes the Stang wins. If the L98 3rd gen weighed as much as a Fox Body and had a 5 speed. OH this would be a whole diff story then

 

i wish the numnut that ordered my car would have opted for L98... then it would have been a formula 350, which would have been sweet but no.. the formula image was enough for that guy...

 

how much better was a vette than a Camaro or Firebird

 

I remember (and probably still have somewhere) a period mag article that squeezed a high 13 out of a bone-stock early L98/auto Vette. So, in terms of 1/4 mile, about a 1/2 second+ better than an L98 F-body in that case. In this same article the Vette eventually got stomped in some late-night street racing by at least one GN. However, I imagine that the Vette also left a thick trail of dead 5.0s in its wake as well.

As far as L69s, my most distinct memory is of an early white-on-blue Monte SS owned by one of the mechanics at the dealership my dad worked at. That car was a factory freak/lightweight and could probably walk away from most other 305-powered G and F-bodies (and probably 83/84/85 5.0s) in town.

One of my friends had a red 85 TPI Iroc and that car was pretty quick too, faster than the 87 LB9/auto he bought to replace it.

Having been a teen in the 80's, I couldn't afford what I thought were the hot cars then. Now, I've got two of my favorites, an 87 Turbo T and an 89 LB9/5-speed Formula. Both are low-option hardtop cars. The T can destroy the Formula with ease in a straight line, but the Bird will be made faster and is a blast to row through the gears and carve corners with. I've had LG4/auto & LB9/auto T/As and a 90 Formula 350. I like my current 89 the best of them all and it's very similar to what I would have ordered back in the day had I been able to.

 

I have an old CAR CRAFT somewhere frome 87 or 88 that listed the formula as the fastest new third gen between the Z28, trans am, and formula. The trans am ground effects actually slowed the car down as did the extra weight from all of the posh amenities. The base model formula was slicker in the wind tunnel with a lower drag coefficient. I remember it clearly because I was just starting to see formulas on the street and immediately went into craziness every time a saw one.............

 

You are correct, If you take a Z28, IROC, FORMULA, Trans Am and a GTA, and put the same exact engine and options on each of them the Formula will be about .1 or .2 quicker in the quarter mile, every year, every time . It also will out-handle each of them because of the lower weight. Thus why its "The most fun to drive"

The're for GO not show

Thats why Formula Owners lover their cars so much

John

 

You bet!! I believe the term was, MOST BANG FOR THE BUCK, and I've been a believer ever since!

 

its an absolute blast to drive, and i love it to death, hell i think it handles better than my dad's 98 z28...