I'm tring to find out if there was a 350/700r4 available for 89 in California. I'm fighting wiht the smog referee here so any insight would be helpful.

Thanks,


Clive.

 

Absoutely. You can get a 350/700R4 combination for any 87-92 thirdgen f-body. Where in California are you? If one smog tech gives you trouble, you can easily find another one.

 

I knew California smog guys were strict, but this is just too much.

1989GTATransAm bought his 1989 350/A4 brand new in California.

 

Reid, so can you help me out please? Can you please shoot a pic of the emmisions sticker and the part # on it. This will help me so much.

Thanks!!!!!!!

Clive.

qpr60@aol.com

 

I'm in Texas. And my car is Canadian. I'm just saying the person I posted above (1989GTATransAm) bought his brand new back in CA.

I looked at my underhood sticker. But it just says that it meets US EPA requirements. Nothing on mine about California.

 

Ah, sorry for the confusion! And thanks for taking the time to look for me.

Thanks again.

Clive.

 

Fighting with a referee? Time for a new referee if the guy cant read his book. It was definitely available here. His emissions book should tell him that. If he cant find it, you're going to have to find another guy.

 

Well here's the issue, sorry I should have mentioned this earlier. This 89 350/700R4 is now in my 89 Jagauar convertible. So I need to show what vehicle it came out of. I've got past having twin cats and some othe minor issues so I think the referee is being OK. I have the wrong prom in the vehicle and I can't find a listing for a prom (memcal) for a California version of this car, only for the FED.

The referee is is doing more research so If I can prove the existance of this animal There is no way he can refuse it. I think he's going to find limited info showing only a 305 for Ca.
So I'm trying to gather info or a copy of an emmisions sticker (or photo with part #) that is specific to California for this year.

Thanks for all of your help.

Clive.

 

I figured it was a swap, but no big deal. There are plenty of us who have swapped 350's and would run right into the same red tape parade you're in.

You dont need to prove existence, aside of having the right prom. GM parts can look that up. The ref SHOULD have a book that lists all configurations, along with CA and FED original sales (if there were 2 different configurations), plus a list of all installed devices. If he cant do that, you need a different referee. He's being totally typical of those guys, pinning every single piece of work on the guy with the car and refusing to be of any assistance. I'm kind of wondering how he is supposed to cross-check what you're telling him if he isn't willing to go get his reference book and verify for himself that the car exists and what is supposed to be on it. He's really not doing his job, what a shock. I've smogged my 89 here twice and going in for a third and the tech (test only, of course) doesnt have any issues when he inputs data into the computer, dunno why the ref is throwing up red flags besides being lazy.

I'll ask if Allen has his original prom somewhere. Mine was an out of state car to begin with and I dunno offhand if it was CA certified or not. I'll have to check my window sticker. I'll also see what I can dig up. If you still had any question this combination was available here I can tell you: absolutely. I drove a couple of them off the dealer lot on test drives in 1989. Dont worry about being able to find proof, someone will. They sold more here than you could count.

 

I'll try to shoot you a copy tomorrow. B)

 

I didnt see anything on my window sticker, so mine is probably a federal car.

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but I always thought if you swapped in a motor, you have to meet the emissions for the year of the CAR not the motor...

John

 

Not here. The drivetrain has to be as new or newer than the chassis/car, and has to meet the requirements of the drivetrain, not the chassis/car.

I did not get the answer to my question, so Allen isnt going to be any help.

 

I pulled the original/stock PROM from my '89 today, ripped the bin file and sent it to you. It is AUJM. I downloaded AUJM_6E from Moates.net and compared it to mine: they are identical.

 

I think the author needs a PROM that is classified as a "California" prom. From what I see, the AUJM is a "FED" (Federal) prom and not a "California" prom. I could be wrong.

Is your '89 equipped with California emissions?

 

I found 3 PROM codes for 1989 350's they were APYU, ANYF, AUJM... Interestingly none of them were referenced as the California Emissions.

What is really over the top is I could not find a single 350 PROM specifically for California for ANY year from 1987 - 1992. I know that at one point in order to get a FED car into California it had to have soemthing like 5000 miles before you could register it there...

Interesting...

John

 

My '89 that came with AUJM is a 50-state car.

 

Your '89 GTA is a federal car. It was originally sold in Florida.

 

Yep.

But the door tag identifies it as a 50-state car, not a 49-state car.

(82FirebirdTA was the previous owner, that gave me such a great deal on it. )

 

AUJUM shows to be a Federal prom, but the source could be incorrect or there could be more to it. However, I'm not sure that the author can simply get by with the source code of the prom. I imagine the emissions place is requiring that he actually have the correct prom, with the correct part numbers, all in place. Don't misunderstand, the effort is there.

As John mentioned, I found the same initial research. I could not find any PROM for 1989/L98 combo that was California specific. I did find several California proms, including the the 5.0L/auto, 5.0L/manual, but nothing turns up for a 1989 L98 Califorina prom, only Federal.

 

qpr60,

If you can confirm what JT and the others posted, and you need the original factory Memcal to pass, and you've got one to replace mine with that I could burn the bin file to, you're welcome to mine for a straight trade. 82FirebirdTA can vouch that it's in perfect working condition.

EDIT: I should mention that my buddy that bought the engine is putting it in a '71 Nova, so he's happy to help you by trading the factory Memcal as long as he has one that's functional since smog is not an issue for him.

 

Pyroviking, JT and others. Thanks for rolling up your sleeves on this one. Actually I received a call from the smog referee after 5pm yesterday. No I have not gone completely mad. This really happened, he called me as promised, after hours and left me his cell phone #. Not to be flippant but here's one state employee who has not forgotten who pays the wages. Talk about service. Here's what he has decided: He's going to let the prom issue slide and not make me change it as it works fine and the car burns really clean asking me only to change the vapor canister, move the O2 sensor and make a permanent "check Engine" light (mine was a stick on). So it looks like I will not need a prom after all but it has been some interesting reading and research. Thank you all for your input. You guys are the best.

Now some clarification: I too could never find a California prom code for an 89 which was why I was scratching my head. I tried the dealer who could only tell me that they had a listing but it had superseded up to the Fed prom, the code is at my shop so I don't have it to hand. I still have not been able to confirm the existence of a California legal 350/auto car.

As for the requirements, the law is as usual fairly grey in its exact requirements but says the drive train must be the same year or newer than the chassis of the vehicle. Further more the drive train must retain all of it's original emission control equipment in the same configuration, be operative and pass a smog inspection and test.

I can't find the exact verbiage it on the Ca DMV site just now but it's in there somewhere. I'll try again later. And by the way I started this process when I lived in NV and they follow Ca requirements and I found out that a ton of other states do the same. Somewhere in the text of the law it states that the referee should use his/her judgment when certifying a car citing that the most important factor should be that the car is not and will not become a "gross polluter" as the result of the engine change. Obviously my guy sees this and is waiving some items for me and taking a common sense approach. He should be knighted! Arise Sir Referee!

Now, I have developed an appetite for a 3rd gen convertible or GTA. Watch this space.........I'll be back!

Thanks again,

Clive.

 

Try & find one with a Factory 350... its the way to go but pretty rare as they made less than 200 of them for both Firebird and Camaro combined...

More 89 GTA's & Trans Am's than anything, 89 Formulas are second, and then the 87 IROC 3rd... THe rearest and best IMHO would be an 89 TTA, but they only made 3, one is in GA, one in CA one in Mexico, and then there is the rearest of all 1 of 1... the Firehawk Vert in 1992...

Some vert numbers for you...
89 GTA or TA's W/L98 - About 139
89 Formula 350's W/L98 - About 42
87 IROC L98 - About 4
89 TTA - 3
92 Firehawk - 1


John

 

Wow, nice #'s John. So where do you find info like that?

Tks.

Clive.

 

I have the ASC dealer order logs for 1989...

Something to understand about the ASC/GM verts...

GM (Pontiac or Chevorlet) did not offer anything larger than a 305 in the F-body Vert from 1987 - 1992 due to fuel economy/emissions regulations. The same goes for the 1987 - 1989 Firebird convertible, due to Federally mandated fuel economy ratings the Firebird was NA as a Factory vert becuase it weighed more than a camaro. They could have probably only gotten the Formula and the Firebird certified as a vert, which would have made many customers angry as they would have probably wanted more TA's and GTA's so they opted to bypass it. Much like the 1991 & 1992 Verts they only offerd a Trans AM and not a GTA as the GTA came standard with a performance gear ratio, which would have upset the fuel economy ratings...

ASC did Dealer conversions, (prior to dealer delivery) from 1986 - 1987 for the Camaro and 1987 - 1989 for the Firebird. Since ALL Convertibles were T-top conversions done by ASC these cars are IDENTICAL in every way shape and form to a Factory Vert... The only difference is the VIN, a Factory Vert has a 3, a factory Coupe (or T-top) has a 2 for the 6th digit.

The 4 number for the IROC is actually more of a guess than anything... I have 4 VINS from a person who worked for ASC back in 1987 who had only these 4 cars as being converted with the L98... SINCE no one has ever enlighened us with ownership of one of these cars I suspect it is probably true. Pontiac did not offer an L98 with T-tops in 1987 nor 1988 for sale in the US. ( you could have gotten an L98/T-top car in Canada in 1987, but I suspect they could not have had it drop shipped to the US where the Verts were all produced... ) That would leave only 1989 for any T-top/L98 verts which could have been converted by ASC into convertibles....

The one Firehawk Convertible is a one of a kind with a "Factory Roll bar" and actually was a 305 car to start with, When SLP did the Firehawks in 1991 & 1992 they hoped to make 250 cars... ALL red, when the orders stopped, they started taking dealer cars and converting them to hope to make up some for their lack of sales, which actually ended at 24 coupes (one of those being a T-top car) I am under the impression that the last Firehawk the 25th car produced was a dealer lot car which was converted into a Firehawk for a customer...

Note that there was 2 cars canceleld, #18 and #23 IIRC making a total of 27 ORDERED cars, but only 25 delivered... #27 is the Convertible..

If you ever find one and 89 Firebird Vert, I can verify it on the order logs and the VIN sequence number... There are a total of 15 cars which I cannot verify the VIN on the list... 10 of those were exported and never reported in the US, the other 5 there is no record of them on CARFAX or Autocheck... I check for those once a year to see if they pop up... I suspect they were totalled early on, or they are in a collection and never registered...

Hope that helps...

 

Wow much excellent info. I got to tell you I browse many forums for info etc and this one is by far the best for content and the quality of replies and help.

Thanks again, much appreciated!

Clive.

 

There are many knowledgable people on here and when we tap into that its pretty impressive... I am often impressed with the amount of knowledge these boards contains... That's why I am here - to learn - and I really do not visit many other websites.... I think I live here some days...



John