i want to do a carb'd ls1 swap in my 89 iroc! I have a 02 5.3 that came out of an avalanche. Comes with everything but im not going to need it all because my car is already carb'd and really just want to build it up! Im looking into just porting the 5.3 heads and buying a rotating assembly for it with a big cam! But what i want to know is what all do i need to get in order to make the swap possible for my third gen at a somewhat low price. Im planning on buying some of my parts with money from selling my engine in the car now. Which might not be enough but ima try and do it myself with a lil help from my father in law! I plan on using the same carb which is a holley 750 4 barrel! And im running nitrous so im looking toward a forged rotating assembly! So what do yall think! Really the only thing i dont know about is ignition, motor mounts, how to run my 700r4 or a th400 on it, and about the pulley setup like my power steering, a/c, water pump, alternator and also i have a mechanical oil pressure guage so how would i get it to work on the 5.3?
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u can have the 5.3 heads milled, for more scr no porting to heads required. go with a ls6 cam, victor jr. intake and msd ignition controller, spohn has the mounts for 100$. will need fbody 98-02 clamshells with bolts to mount engine. so youre looking at around 200$ to use basic mounts. 98-02 fbody shorty headers work very well. u can reuse your 700r4 with a tci flexpate.
but i would recommend a th350 since u can reuse a 6.0 flexplate, and spacer and use along with th350/400 10' tq converter.
if u really want to use alot of spray, then it would be wise to build a 6.0 instead of 5.3, since it will aslo come with more cid. make way more power on just motor. 5.3 will handle a 150 wet hit easy.

 

Yea well thats what i want but they hard to find and to get one is expensive! So since im getting it for dirt cheap i wanted to get it but start working on it once ive saved enough money to start the build! Ive heard alot of guys running these engines with good flowing heads and a decent cam and putting down good numbers! I dont want something too extreme though! i wanted all forged cuz i wanted to run at least a 200 shot of nitrous unless it was safe to go higher! But im just trying to get ideas on what all i need to see how much money itll come out to!

 

anyone???

 

300rwhp thru is very possible, the heads in there current form do not need any upgrading besides springs, mill for more scr, and vj. they do not need porting. for 5.3.
look for a ls6 cam, and even if u have to use stock manifolds. the vic. jr is like 350$ from summit. box is like another 350$. if alredy have coil packs, no need to get any. stock coil packs lite off 1000hp turbo motors.
or u could just run motor as is, with new springs, and ls6 cam.
springs are around 100$ and u can find cam for around 100$ used off the ls boards, but there like 175$ new.
i would keep it around 150 wet hit, or around 175 with race gas and ngk tr55's. msd wires also very good.
if u really want more, a 6.0 is the way to go, y spend on a 5.3 when u will pay the same for a 6.0

 

Alright thanks man well ill try to look for a 6.0 but if i cant i might just do the work on this one! Im in no hurry so im sure ill run into one in the future!

 

Ok so i looked into a lq9 and lq4 so would it matter which one to get if they are both iron blocks? Also when doing a 6.0 swap in a third gen is it the same thing as dropping a ls1 in it? I mean would i need the same parts? And would i have to get a serpentine setup off a ls1 so the pulleys fit since the ones on the 6.0's stick out further! Also how would i run my power steering pump and alternator on it?

 

You lost me there. What does already having a carb have to do with putting a carb on an LS1? About all you can figure on being able to use is the carb itself. Maybe.

Okay, let's try to address all this together.

Ignition: A box like the MSD LS controller. Quite frankly, though, the stock EFI and ignition would be a lot simpler, and a lot cheaper.

Motor mounts: Covered in the LS1 swap sticky (yes, 6.0 is basically the same as a LS1 swap).

Pulley set-up and accessories: None of your current stuff will work. f-body accessories and LS1/6 intake are the typical approach. It is possible to use truck accessories with the right hood.

Mechanical oil pressure gauge: There is a bolt-on "adapter" just above the oil filter that you can drill and tap. Search the posts on this subforum that I've started, there's a pic of mine in one of them.

My guess would be that you haven't really done your homework on this swap. Start by reading the LS1 swap sticky. My personal opinion is taking EFI off and putting carb on is like taking radial tires off and putting bias ply tires on.

 

i reccomend a 6.0 over a 5.3. the stock 317 heads flow just as well as 243 ls2 heads.

 

Ok sorry for getting you all confused! My car is already carb'd so i want to run a carb'd lsx or lqx! I dont want to spend too much right now so im going the easiest way and i believe it is to stay carb'd! But thanks i believe i know most of what i need! Ill keep yall updated when i start! Thanks!

 

Alright thanks man! Ill keep my eyes open for one! The heads that come on the lqx's are 317s? Which heads do you think would be best to run?

 

Absolutely, positively, no doubt whatsoever that putting a carb on an LSx will cost you more to do than keeping the stock EFI system.

 

Exactly

Whether buying a controller box to reuse the factory coil on plug or buying a very special front cover and ford distributor, you STILL have to buy an expensive intake which alone costs about as much as a conversion harness

Original car makes no difference as the stand alone harness only needs 12v Battery and 12v IGN to run

 

i have to disagree.
he is alredy carb'd, he alredy has the carb. he will have to get a standalone harness, along with injectors, 02 sensors,pcm, tune. ls6 intake, not too mention the installation process,
the msd box is not much harder than wiring in a msd 6al. he may also not be able to use the truck intake .

my engine for example, it is cheeper to run a carb.i would need a
600$+tune just to ge it running correct, 60lb. injectors,
with a carb, all i need is box of jets and power valve.
buidling a higher compresision better heads engine of the one currently in my dd. which makes around 575-580bhp. cost me around a grand for tune and injectors. and i mean a proffesional tune. no surging, backfiring, idle quality is near stock with a 24x cam. around 23mpg.
i can also now use a super victor which is superior to just about any efi manifold short of sheetmetal intake.
if hes building a street strip, brawler. then carb would be the wisest choice, due to ease of tune. of carb.
now if its a dd mpg , a-b car. then efi would be a wiser, due to fuel budget control.

 

Well im just trying to get the most power out of my buck! I know going with an iron block will be better for the future when i get enough money to build her up from the ground up! Also im running nitrous so i want the iron block for that reason! Either way that i go is going to be expensive. I made a list of most of the things that i need and its going to be about 3k to get it done but that includes headers, intake manifold, msd box, cam and valve springs. Thats not including the parts ima buy for the swap which includes the mounts, clamshells, accesories, oil pan which i still need to figure out which one i need to use for this swap. And used shortblock or longblock! Thanks for yalls advice though guys! I do appreciate it!

 

Dollars to donuts it won't be optimal for the LSx.

You don't need a stand-alone harness.

Will come with a complete take-out or complete vehicle.

Optional.

Installation is the same either way.

"not much harder"? That means it is harder. Wiring in an LS1 isn't that hard.

Granted. But, an LS1 intake is cheaper than the carb'd intake.

That's always nice to know. Unless stated otherwise, I assume DD.

 

Better said Yea for now i want to do a simple swap with a cam and full exhaust and behind it a 400 with a 3500 3600 stall! I want it to be a beast when i have the money to do it all!

 

Guess I took too long to complete my post.

Carb is no more simple than EFI.

 

need fbody or cts v pan. fo track bette off going with manual steering

 

You want to do this cheap, stick with the EFI setup, you can pick up an LS1 intake reasonable price and TB, use the truck coils injectors etc etc. You can use the truck harness, or pick up an F-body harness not that expensive, pick up f-body accessory brackets and have something that you can take to the track, run good numbers and drive it back home getting good gas milage.

I agree with five7, carbing an LSx engine is like going from radial tires to bias ply....good analogy there five7

 

thats all fine and dandy for a stock drop in motor, for a normal cruiser dd type car,
but hes looking to build track type car, cant beat a carb for eae of tune. compared to efi. he has to have the knowledge, hptuners, and wideband o2 just tune himself, carb just a box of 30$ jets and power valves.

seeing as how ive swapped ls1 into around 10 vehicles now. both carb and efi. for a novice swapper, a standalone is th easiest method for harness. harness controls, engine only, all other wiring from vehicle is independent of engine.

ther is also available adapter fittings to run conventional sbc type sensors for oil psi and water temp. gages. none of this dril and tap nonesense.

first carbed 3rd gen i have built goes 10.3 on motor with carb and 9.8's with 150 hit. runs on pump gas, to and from track.
car ran so good a guy bought it from me at the track.
all other swaps have been efi. with standalone harness and autometer gages for oil psi, and water temp.etc.

ive even designed, a serpentine system for use with 1 wire alt, gm ps pump, for manual steering, and even one for scavenge belt driven oil pump for low mount turbo.
not a fan of elec. oil pumps for remote or low mount turbos.

 

There is a guy local here who built a 346, EFI with the stock LS1 computer, had it dynotuned one time running a D1SC, ported/polished 243s LS6 intake stock bottom end with an LS7 cam was running 9.80's through a turbo 400 and 3.73 gears consistantly every pass. Full power windows, a/c, power locks, driver seat only, if it weren't for the loud fuel pump he had in the car it would be really nice to drive on the road and he even stated that.

He wanted something easy and cheap, and sticking with the efi is the cheaper route considering the intake/MSD controller is over 600 bucks for the two and then a carb on top of that *shrug*

it's a waste of these engines to carb them imho, that's like putting a carb on an LT1 also.

 

If that's the case, it should be stated. I see words such as "cheap", "forged", "nitrous", "dont want something too extreme", "5.3" (granted, changed that to 6.0), etc. The only thing that sounds track-like is the nitrous. "Cheap" and "forged"? Can't have both.

Sure you can. With something that tells you what it's doing. No need to buy a wideband, you've already got O2 sensors. Taylor spark curve through the data port. Adjusts itself for changing conditions.

What the OP really needs is to figure out what he is shooting for (or at least, let us know what that is), instead of shooting in the dark. Putting carb on an LSx because the car is currently carb is completely separating the journey from the destination - like going from D.C. to Baltimore via Cleveland because you've been to Cleveland but don't know how to get to Baltimore from D.C., and refuse to use a computer to figure it out.

 

that is your opinion,
but i dont understand how u forgot to add, the price of proffesional tune. or if he did himself, still needs 500+$ hptuners, 60lb. inj., 350$
wbo2 300$, and if he tuned in sd still needs
50$ 3 bar map sensor, and thats assuming he using stock rails with.without return line. if he used return, he need rails, fittings, fpr, return lines.

i dropped around 900$ for tune on my car and its not even FI, i needed 42lb. injectors, but went with 60lb. since its around 80$ more. and 600$ for proffessional hptuners based sd tune. not some local hackjob with a dyno tune. the guy that tuned my car, has tuned 1000+hp turbo cars.
i wouldnt expect anything less for a sc/tc car.

you are entitled to your opinion, but unless you have accomplished both type of swaps, and have purchased and installed both type of fuel systems on a lsx swap and are famliar with all the details invloved within.

its just another opinion *shrug*

ls7 cam in a 346 ls1. *right*

 

If you dropped $900 for a tune on your car, someone saw you coming. I can get LSx's tuned all day for $325 and that's until it is right, which is generally on the 3rd or 4th pull they make.

I won't accomplish both types of swaps because I wouldn't degrade an LSx engine with a carb, nobody can convince me that it is better than EFI.

And yes, an LS7 cam in an LS1.

 

again, the swap/standalone/etc.harness is not equipped with a built in cord u can plug into a laptop and calibrate, evry thing yourself, it requires purchasing a 500+$ hptuners program to install into the dig. port, and thats assuming you alredy have all the required supporting components in place. such as inj, pump, what have you,
and a wb 02 sensor is correct for any proper tuning of efi system, the stock narow bands are only used for the pcm's built in calibration from factory.

as for not needing a wb02 sensor for calibration.

my tuner wouldnt tune a single car without it.
i think im gonna go with the guy who tunes 1000+hp forced induction engines for a living opinion for now, thanks

 

my car makes 490 to the wheels, gets 23-25mpg, no bucking, no surging, near stock idle quality with 245 degree duration cam. ac blows cold, car never acts funny, or turns off. u would think your driving a stock engine car, if didnt know any better.

since this guy went with a ls7 cam he now needs to use a ls2 type timing chain cover, along with ls2 type sprocket/chain. which is an added cost
shoulda just went with ls6 cam. cheaper to use. drops right in. reluctor ring is on rear of cam core just like any other gen3 cam
*shrug*
works fine seeing as how MM made around 900 to wheels with it., think he even set some records with it.

 

Well, like I said, nobody is going to convince me that 90 year old technology is better than EFI is.

If you want to run a carb, go for it, just put it on a regular old 50 year old SBC.

As for running a wideband o2, any good shop will have a wideband they can use that is connected to the dyno unit and fully calibrated and not require you to have one before tuning it. Like I said, sounds like your shop needs to move into the 21st century when it comes to dyno tuning.

 

Whew didn't know there were that many carb haters out there.




when's the lynching?

 

It's not carb hating (give me a break, I moderate the Carburetor forum), but helping a person get where they want to go.

The OP's assumptions, approach, and goals (as fuzzy as they are) are contradictory. That's where I'm coming from.

 

we're going carb on my buddies car since he has a 750 demon from a previous car, and the ls1 we obtained didnt have any sensors, intake, wiring harness or anything. So the $500 we spent on the intake and controller box was a whole lot cheaper than going EFI. My car personally I've got a 6.0 drop out with ls6 intake and fbody accessories i'm using FI. For my buddies car it was just easier and cheaper to build a carbed ls1

 

there is nothing wrong with carb. on a lsx, sure it may not be for everyone. i do run wideband o2 sensor in my car. but thats just me, is it needed?, perhaps not. but if decide to go back to a tc, i will alredy have some inj. that will support, some serious hp. thats y paid extra for the 60lb's. and a wbo2 in place. i also plan on using a wbo2 in my carb lsx 3rd gen again.
the shop that i use for tunes, is a lil local shop that has some exp. with a few ls1 engines. i think there name is LMR iirc.. there doing ok, i guess

and for me personally its alot cheeper to run a carb.
and my carb. tree-fiddy sbc mopped the floor with just about every warmed over lt1 at the track and street.

i got a 12 sec. efi lt1 z28 fs if u interested in having another.

 

that looks mean

 

thanks it does alright

 

Now, don't get me wrong....I like the Victor Jr. intake on the LSx.........

done this way

 

very nice, it looks killer with EV hat, is the engine sc? looks like it has headers.

 

Not SC, he was eventually going to throw a 300 kit on it.

He was thinking about running the hat on it but wouldn't fit under the stock hood. Has a set of Kooks LT's on it. 6.0 LQ9 block with a set of ported/polished 843's with a coil pack relocation kit.

He had the intake drilled for the injectors and that's an 1150 cfm TB on top of it.

It made 675 at the flywheel, around 600 at the wheels with a 242/248 .620 on 110lsa through a T56 into a 12 bolt and that was before the tune....here's a couple of vids

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iZRqshJQBw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xY_pXghM2hY

This is a buddy's car that parts out 4th gens and does complete engine swaps in all types of different cars.

 

Sounds like it made decent power no doubt thanks to that carb intake, no plastic efi intake can flow enough to support mild aftermarket heads let alone some of the new screamers out there, nice to know us carb guys still help out this new fangled fancy technology.

 

this super victor and vic. jr are def. opening up the lsx lungs.
the new jr for l92 is making some incredible power. although the stock plastic ls3/l92 intakes are killing the l92 head flow. even with bolt on, tuned ls3 c6's are approaching 500rwhp with it. the new fast and weiand should be very promising.
too bad i can fit that new edelbrock tunnel ram efi intake in my ss.
but def. will go with that instead of plasting intake for another swap if efi
in 3rd gen

 

I'm hoping to finish up my 6.0L/L92/vic jr combo in about 5 months after I sell off this combo sometime in june. Should be interesting for motor #10 in the chassis. I have been reading how well the new L92 cams are for driving around town with almost stock like driving habits, it'll be strange running good numbers with almost no lope. Heck this ls1 now is no where near as rowdy sounding as my old 355 was just last season and it should make more power to boot.

 

All very nice, but somehow this seems way over the head of the OP.

Forgive me if I'm underestimating.

 

u know the ly6 is a l92 heads engine from factory, althought they are 58x and have the vvt, it shouldnt be too hard to get cams ground for it,
im picking up some lsx engine this weekend, and one of the engines im picking up is a ly6 from 08' with around 500 miles.
although a .060 over, 375ci 6.0 with 24x will prolly be better for your setup since u alredy have the msd 24x box.
the porter i use, has a l92 port flowing 340cfm on 4.06 with just some basic work and stock valve. thinks he may be able to get another peak 15cfm

 

nah this is a lq4 and i got the heads afterwards. It's an 05 with under 50k on it, so it should be a stout runner. No VVT or anything to worry about and it still has the cam sensor in the back of the valley cover not on the front cover so I'm assuming it's still a 24x crank on it....i hope. 340 is really good, been looking at the WCCH port job on these, but can't bring myself to drop that kind of coin just yet.

 

all lq4 are 24x so no prob. there. have reluctor ring at rear of cam.
last yr. for lq4 is 07' still 24x with gen 3 cam. heads will need to be milled and will need to use l92/ls9 gasket to raise scr some.
l92/ls3/ls9 are 4.1 bore .050 compressed.
lq4/lq9 are 4.04 bore .056 compressed.
even with the larger bore the ls3 gasket will raise scr. over the lq4.
also since lq4 is .010 out of the bore, it will also affect quench whic should be right about .040 (better)

 

was thinking of milling .030 since that seems to be what everyone does on these motors. So you're saying I should buy L92 head gaskets or LQ4 gaskets? Felpros or?

 

l92 milled .030 with l92 gaskets equal 10:1 from lq4 9.4:1
lq4 and l92 both 71cc chamber, so scr would be same if u just bolted unmilled l92 on lq4.
gm l92/ls3/ls9 would be the best and cheeper, than fel pro
i use l92 gasket becuase im a 4.06 bore on my engine,
lq4/lq9 only up to 4.03 bore, and there thicker compressed,
thinner gaskets affect quench area. usual for hi perf. n/a is .035-.040
im like right at .035 on my motor, .015 out of the hole.