another thread i was reading here reminded me of the cars ive lost to bracket racing... its kinda embaressing, but funny.... and on the flip side, ive beat alot of really fast cars....

ive lost to:

a RENTAL toyota corolla 4 cyl.. with a girl driving... she was dead constistant too..

honda civics of all sorts..

a VW bug dune buggy.

but i beat:
a low 11second big block nova (the same one that won the previous weekend)

all out strip cars of all sorts

dodge ram (hey, it had a HEMI in it.. lol )


just made me start wondering, how consistant everyone else is and what they still lost to (or beat)...
and when you lose, is it from breaking out, or from being too conservative with the dial in?

 

i am a test and tune guy, i never bracket raced before but it sounds so cool.

 

That's the thing about bracket racing;

"Speed means nothing"

Anyone can win a bracket race in any vehicle. There is no age, sex, race, car etc discrimination.

2 years ago we had a 2000 Tahoe racing. 18 second 1/4 miles and deadly consistant because he used the factory traction control every time. Absolutly no wheel spin and the truck ran the same ET every time. He ended the season winning Sportsman ET class.

I've run right on my dial in almost to the thousands and lost because I was asleep at the tree.

 

I started racing a few months before I got married - in 1978. This was back when the timeslips were hand-written, times were only given out to the hundreths place, and no RT or intermediate times were given. 2nd to the last race of the season (married by then), I took the other '57 I had at the time out for a change (I normally raced my Honda CB550F). This was a 1/8 mile track at 6000' elevation, by the way. I did the allowed time trials, then lost 1st round. Went to the consulation bracket, dialed 10.25, ran a 10.25 and got smoked bad by a '67 Nova that dialed a mid-9 and took off before I did - but I ran my 10.25. When I got back to the pits, I couldn't figure out why had I lost when my buddy's brother (who didn't even race) says to me, "Why were you sleeping at the line?" I said, "What do you mean, I ran right on my dial." He says, "Your time starts when you leave, dummy, not at the green light. You could sit there for half a hour and still run a 10.25!" Oh. With that new-found knowledge, last race of the season the following week (back on the bike) I won my bracket and qualified for the regionals (1/8th finalist there).

Fast forward to last year. I'm running our "Club Clash" Friday night series, I was in 2nd or 3rd place mid-way through the season (out of some 250 registered racers, usually have over 400 show up to race any given night). 1st round, I'm up against a Dodge Dakota who's dialed 3 seconds slower than me. I tree him by a bunch, catch him at 1000', back off so I won't break out, he starts to go around me again so I get back on it - too late, he crosses first by .007 seconds. I see him in the pits later, he says, "Wow, that was close. That's the first race I've won all year!" Of course, he lost the next round...

Sweetest win: Probably 2002 Super Chevy at Bandimere. Weather was lousy Friday & Saturday, limited time trials and racing. I'm running in the DOT class (DOT tires & mufflers required, no electronics allowed). Sunday morning eliminations, no time trials because they're behind in the program for the weekend, DOT class goes first - it's cool dry weather so cars are running faster than they have all weekend. I roll down the staging lanes and end up next to another '57 - I'm dialing 14.8 or so, he dials a 9.70! This is a full steel (including front fender liners), mini-tubbed, 406 SBC car with a chute - he's spraying more power than I'm making. I kept telling myself, "Don't be fooled by how far back he is, just stay in it - don't be fooled by..." I take off, get a green light; get to 1000', he's barely to half track. I stay in it, my brain telling my right foot to stay down even though it wants to lift, I hit the traps, he's still way back, I stay in it, get to the line, and he flashes by at 140 MPH +! My win light comes on - I win by the same margin I treed him, a couple hundreths.

Funniest announcer and most agonizing loss: 2002 Division V ET finals in Topeka. 2nd round I'm dialed at 13.55, paired up with a blue-smoking '79 Malibu wagon that's dialed at 19.95. As we stage, after telling who we were and where we're from the annoucer says, "Tim's going to have enough time to read the paper, eat a ham sandwich and drink a cold Coca-Cola before he gets to go." I was patient, cut a good light & win. Go to next round where I'm the slower car, cut a .509 light to his .609 and lose in a double break-out because I didn't back off soon enough.

 

the first time i had somthing like that happen to me, it scared the crap out of me.... i was in a VW trapping MAYBE 80mph, and he was like 140+ WOT flying by me at the end... the wind from the car pushed my car over a good foot. scary stuff. i dont like running a car that is that much faster then me. its not the speed that scares me, its the diff between the speed im going and the speed hes going...

 

Very true. If anyone wonders what that feels like, stand with your back turned about 10 feet from traffic going by at 55 mph...

 

i hate that too.getting all worked up weather to stay in it or not then turning around and seeing he turned the red on.dam tinted windows.

 

"Rear View Mirror".

A racer friend last season was running his 13-sec '60 Impala against a 10-sec 1st gen. He takes off, heads down the track, the other guy gets a green and kills the engine. Friend keeps going because he can't see the guy, afraid he's in his blind spot, stays in it and breaks out by a couple of thousandths of a second. Other guy gets his started, putts down the track and gets the win light.

That poor guy couldn't be consoled for a week...

 

that would SUCK!


i just wish every track would let me run with the top down... now blind spots.. so far, ive only had one IHRA track and a outlaw track let me do it.... the only NHRA track that i goto is Ennis and as "a world class" track, they refuse to let me go with the top down unless i have a HUGE amount of saftey stuff.... i understand that crud with a quick, or even a moderatly fast car, but i was running a 16 flat at the time.. i didnt even need a rollbar... heh.
i still fail to see how weak bars covered in fabric is going to help in the event of a crash.... they can only help to intrap me or somthin.. imean, if they had somthing valid like arm restraints and helmet, sure... i can deal with that... but all the other BS... ugh.

anyhoo that was a tangent. :lala: i'll try not to hijack my own thread.

 

At Bandimere, at least, when you're green and the other guy's red, the win light comes on in your lane.

 

There was a series of articles a few years ago in (I think) Hot Rod written by "Mr. Dirt" (who later turned out to be one of ESPN's color analysts for motorsports). One that I remember was how he thought the best vehicle for bracket racing was a full-size van. It was really consistent and you were basically sitting on top of the front wheels so you could really gauge when you were going to trip the lights.

As for embarrassing bracket-racing losses ... well, I never bracket raced anything other than a little ol' Sentra, so I think I was usually the one dishing out the embarrasment. I remember one time lining up in the "14.99 and quicker lane" at Va. Motorsports Park and having some guy laugh at my car. I won the class that night.

Pat

 

I dunno about bracket racing. I understant that it is good because it allows vastly different cars to "race" against each other, but to me there is something counter intuitive to "racing" when people are slamming on their brakes before the finish line to avoid breaking out. I have a pretty fast street strip car and the first time I bracket raced an Expedition I redlighted trying to be patient when he was halfway down the 1/8mile strip. I wish there was a way to heads up race without having to get into inspections of the cars to make sure they comply with regulations for the different classes.

There is a guy at the track I go to with about a 80 something Cadillac coupe de ville, with "geriatric cadilac" written on the side. He wins just about every time by just stepping on the gas and holding it to the floor, not much skill. I know there is still skill in cutting good lights. Like I said, I dunno

 

We have a local racer who drives a mid 60's Plymouth Fury. Under the hood it doesn't look like anything has been changed since it was new. Wires have electrical tape wrapped around them etc. He wins many races because the car is consistent. He doesn't need the bells and whistles to go fast.

Bracket racing means you must guess what the car will do. If you're hard on the brakes at the end then you guessed wrong. Since you gave yourself a head start compared to your opponent then just because you crossed the finish line first doesn't mean you should win. That's why you break out. It makes the racing more fair.

Try watching Super Comp/Gas/Street where they have a heads up start and all try to run the same ET per class without breaking out. To most people super class racing is harder to understand than bracket racing is. Even more difficult is Comp Eliminator racing.

In a class where it's a heads up start and the first one to the finish line wins is just a way to say who has the most money to spend. There's no real skill involved if you can invest $$$ just to go faster than the other guy. Look at ProStock. Top 16 qualifiers are usually within a couple of hundreds of each other. They've all maxed out the amount of performance they can achieve under the current rules. By spending more on R&D a racer can squeeze a few more horses than the next to get the advantage but that kind of HP isn't cheap.

 

street drags at the track.... on a given night, theres minimal tech (usually NO tech) and you basicly run what you have...

some places, (like las vegas) want to see your current registration and you have to run DOT tires for the street races(once more, so theres no confusion, this is at the track)
you run heads up on a instant green agienst whoever you want to line up with. thats about it.

other tracks (like ennis, TX) they dont check registration or tires... you just run whoever you want.....



another night is just the usual test n' tune... you can race anyone you want.. and sometimes they even give you the choice of tree you want to run...



then theres the lil outlaw tracks all over the south that you can run whatever, however you want...

 

I came across a 2001 timeslip last night. It had a $ stamp on it, indicating I won some money, but I clearly remember what happened.

It was the Mile High Bracketnationals, the last ET race of the Summit ET series at Bandimere. It was sponsored by Penzoil back then, and they had a special race where they have you submit a receipt for purchase of their products, then draw out 32 for a run-off (2001 is the only time I've been picked). I was paired 1st round against a '71 Nova with a 350 HO & Edelbrock EFI dialing 15.05. I was a little slower then, and dialed a 15.53. His RT was .688 to my .544, I remember I backed off but still ran a 15.48 to his 15.10, which he ran out. I took .26 of stripe - no way I'd take that much stripe now.

He lost next round, of course. I think they gave me $30.

 

im about as consistent as new englands weather...

i need some good tires and then ill be able to be competitive