I went to the track last wednesday and was pulling 14.5s and 14.6s. Which if you look at my previous best, is awesome. Then on the last run of the night, I advanced my timing to 13* btc and pulled of a 14.115! I was soooo suprised. I didn't even think that it was possible. Next thing to do is put on my 1.6 rockers and shoot for the 13s. But I think I am gonna need a helmet.

Wow great improvement, bet you throttle responce is alot better to....

What other changes did you make?

base timing of 13 is way too high for a stock tpi motor.

He probably didn't leave it like that, just like he lets some air out of the tires at the track (we have met at the track before).

A rocker swap will depend on what you have in the engine now. Going from a 1.5 full roller rocker to a 1.6 full roller rocker should gain about 5hp and it's unlikely you'll see a 1/4 mile improvement. If you're going from a stamped steel factory style rocker to a roller rocker, 1.5 or 1.6 should see a noticeable gain.

I believe he is getting roller tip rockers, not full rollers (1.6).

What did you do to go from 15's to 14.5's? What were the 60 ft's for the 14 second runs?

What was the timing at when you ran that 14.1?

Well, if he picked up 4 tenths by that alone, I'd say that's incorrect

no his motor was probably getting knock counts, but since he advanced the timing well beyond what the computer could retard he was able to overcome it. No way a EFI motor needs that much timing, as it's built into the chip instead of needing huge base timing like a carb car.

I don't mean to argue but I was running 15* timing on a 305 tpi with a 258hr cam, 93 octane fuel and a cold air intake. I was doing about 14.4 in the 1/4.

It can be done, just have to do it right. BTW, I had a engine scanner on while doing runs, and the engine would only pull 2* of timing off the hop, then start adding in more timing later on(that was with a 24 lb (very rich) injector and a 125hp shot of nitrous)

Exactly


Mine gets knock counts when the throttle is stabbed, then it shoots down to none during the WOT run. I can't find anything that would be causing the false knock counts, if it is false that is...

Timing advance with a bigger then stock cam (which will bead off some cylinder pressure) is different than timing advance with a stock engine. FWIW, I tried it on my L98 in 2 degree increments at the track and I remember I didn’t see any difference in ¼ mile times on a wide range between 4* and I think 10 or 12* (it’s been a while), so I just left it at 4* and went from there.

If the detonation was really that bad, the knock counts would have retarded the timing quite a bit right? So how does a car with a ton of knock as you theorize run 4 tenths quicker?

I added an AFPR (49 psi) and advanced from 6 to 8, and then 8 to 10, and seen NO mph increase in the 1/4 at all.

I unplugged that tan wire when I adjusted the timing. I was running at 13* base timing. If you think that its not possible to knock 4 tenths of your time just by advancing your timing, you are wrong. I have the slips to prove it and if I could figure out how to use this damn scanner, I would put them up to prove it.

I am the car in the left lane. The only thing I did between runs was advance my timing. That is it.

the 60' was ever so slightly better but even more telling is the 3 mph difference on the top end.

Certainly something changed. Great times for a stock tpi

I am not trying to call B.S or start an arguement (I see you got the slip to prove it). But gaining close to 3mph from just bumping up your timing is almost unheard of. Was the car cooler on the 14.1 run? When you advanced it to 13, what was it originally set at?

And what did you do to go from a low 15 to a 14.5? Just curious.

All I did to make it to the low 15s to the 14s was shorty headers, smog pump delete, and changed my plugs and wires. It was at about 6-8* on the mid-14 runs. Also let me add that my rear tires are really bald.

Like I already said and Iroc… confirmed, I haven’t been able to document any increase from advancing the timing. Apparently also like Iroc.. found, increasing fuel pressure helped. I found that the car ran fastest with FP between 52 and 54psi depending on weather/track conditions. I believe that that also used to be one of TPIS's secrets to fast times from stock/stockish TPI cars.

Better rubber (tires) and more FP should certainly make a significant difference in ET. Also i dont know what gear your running but 3.42's would be ideal with TPI, not to mention anything you can do to open up that tpi manifold.

All in the works. Trying to hit mid thirteens on stock intake with some porting. I know it is possible. Wanna get an AFPR but not sure which one to get. any suggestions?

Don't get the BBK, get a Holley and spend the few more $

Oh its very possible. Now all you gotta do is get over that bottles are for babies thing and run 12's...

Actually, I have recently overcome that "bottle" thing and are in the works of saving for a kit. I wanna run 12s soooo bad.

LB9, Why is the BBK AFPR no good? I was actually thinking of getting an accel one. Any feedback on those?

Can anyone give me some advice on how to port the intake on this beast? I kind of have an idea, but not to sure how to do it.

The shell is cheap and the bolt stripped in it.
Get the holley, it has a big wheel on the top and easy to turn and set
http://re3.mm-a4.yimg.com/image/2806896402

Use a gasket to mark intake and start filing/dremmeling the port to match the gasket. Also smooth out any rough edges, just make sure anything AFTER the injectors is not mirror shine (needs to have some hatching so the fuel doesn't coagulate or puddle).

Thanks John. I plan on going out to the track this wednesday with new tires and my rockers. I will keep everyone updated with any improvements.

i have personally have ran consistant 14.2's in my stock L98 700r4 motor. I didnt have to play with timing at all. All I had was an aftermarket muffler and that is all. I think the driver mod played a big role in this. Also on a 150 shot and some sticky tires spraying outta the hole I ran a 8.1. So the bottle is the way to go.

What exactly do you mean by driver mod? I've been racing for a while now. I would like to do spray. Im assuming by 8.1 you mean in the 1/8. You should come to moroso. It is a hell of alot better than countyline. That is where you race right?

no i ran my 14.1 stock at Brandenton and my 8.1 at sunshine speedway which is an 1/8th mile

Oh ok. Where in the hell is largo? Oh well. I am going to the track on wednesday so I hope that I break 13s. We will see. I got my new tires on so I hope my 60' is better.

LArgo is in pinellas county. Near Clearwater Beach and St Pete. Good luck on your new times.

I was thinking it was near like key largo. Shows how much I know about florida geography

Speaking of geography, it's Bradenton (which is outside Brandon) haha Brandenton. Bradenton is where two of my kids were born and DeSoto speedway is where I got the pic (8x10) of Gregg Sacks and Bobby Allison driving me around in the pace car during the Star Spangled Banner holding the American Flag which is autographed by both (for those of you who even know who they are). Just breaking your stones, Giovannetti .

oops lol

John, when is the next time you plan on going out to the track? I wanna see you out there when the turbo is on. Do you think you will be anywhere close to Dave's times? I wanna race you when you finish turbo. We can arrange it at the track.

I really don't want to embarrass you with my little ol V6, do you? ;p
Was working on it today, actually. The last flange was finished Fri (my CNC bud forgot to bring it home from work) and the MegaSquirt came yesterday. The turbo is going in first to see what a turbo kit will do on a stock 6er, cam is in the garage also .

Embarass me? It would be worth it though. If you could beat me. Will you have it done by wednesday? If so head out. Let me know. I think it would be fun to go to those nopi nationals and whoop some imports. I might go to the track on wednesday. I hope it will be worth it.

Won't be done by THIS Wed, the flange wasn't totally finished. He has one more cut to make on it and the mills were down at his shop today because ther was a broken coolant pump. Pipes are comming together, though.

Im telling you man, If you can make it to the nopi nationals on satursay the 31st. That would be sick. Your turbo vs. import turbo. just no v8s on sunday.

ooo, now I'm interested ;p

Test and tune on saturday. It is perfect for you to tune the car. I think it is like all day or something same low price same great service. LOL. Let me know if you wanna go. I think it would be fun whoopin some rice buckets now that I can. It is hard to do running 15s in a 350.
But now its all like this->

But for real, let me know. Im not going tomorrow because I have some fine tuning to do before next weekend (march 31st)

Peace!!!

I jumped from a 15.416@ 89.81 to a 14.101@ 98.30 without touching the engine! All i did was a tune up. This is with stock manifolds and running @ 8* BTDC. This guy is running neck and neck with me! But I don't have headers! Neener Neener...

The headers really help out alot. Better throttle response. Mine are the cheap flowtech ones though. Hooker or SLP are better.

I have a set of ceramic coated Hedman shorty tubes sittin in the garage right now. But they're not getting bolted to my 350. They're going on my 383.

I was thinking of building a 383 much like the one in the sleeper L98 article in the super chevy mag a little bit ago. I think it is completely worth it. even though they use aluminum heads I think I might stick with steel. But who knows.

13's are real possible.

best w/stock 2.77 posi rear 13.65 @ 99 mph 1.89 60'
best w/3.73 13.54 @ 98mph 1.81 60'

stock motor w/no back seats , no cat ,free flow muffler , stock exh. manifolds
tci trans w/app 1500-2000 stall . ac + smog are gone . oh yeah 155,??? miles
electric w/ pump gave me 1 tenth .

but it seems I am stuck here so headers are next .


oh yeah , on drag radials

let us know how you do next time.

Thanks raptor, I will definitely let you guys know. I did forget to mention that when I ran this 14.1, the guy in the 01 GT bustang came to see what all I had done (because I spanked him) and he was suprised that all I had was headers on a basically stock motor. I just though I would add that cause I thought it was funny.