92CamaroLS1

Well Ground Control finally told me yesterday after 2 months that they would not be able to make the thinner wire diameter spring that I needed so I am just going to order some moog v6 springs. I was looking at the Moog 5658's as an alternative, but I figure I better not use something that hasnt really been used all that much in the 3rd gen world. Im looking for street/strip, I drive the car pretty easy when it comes to turning. Basically here is the problem. Even with ebiach prokit installed with all of the weight reduction(and not even flush in the pockets) the front of the car was pretty low. I want the car raised up a bit but I dont want it to look all jacked up. If anyone has any opinions on how the ride height will be with 5606, 5608 or 5610 springs, please share. If no one objects im going to buy the 5608's by this evening. These are the specs for some Moog springs im interested in:


...1.........2........3..........4..........5..........6........7
5606 / 4.080 / 0.687 / 11.00 / 1530.0 / 421.0 / 14.63
5608 / 4.080 / 0.687 / 11.00 / 1640.0 / 424.0 / 14.88
5610 / 4.080 / 0.687 / 11.00 / 1750.0 / 424.0 / 15.19
5658 / 4.080 / 0.687 / 10.75 / 1405.0 / 530.0 / 13.35

1: part #
2: Inside Diameter
3: Wire Diameter
4: Installed height
5: Load Rate(LBS)
6: Spring Rate (LBS/IN)
7: Free Height

Thanks....
Chris

RBob

iTrader: (1)

I'd recommend some stock car springs with either adjusters or jacks. The stock car springs can be had in darn near any rate (lbs/in) from places such as AFCO. They also have adjusters. This way the spring rate can be selected for intended usage, with an adjustable ride height.

A 3rd gen can us either jacks or the adjusters as the shock doesn't have to go through them. There is a long post by CrazyHawiian on the use of jacks.

I used the AFCO springs and adjusters in a 1st gen and I wouldn't do it any other way.

RBob.

92CamaroLS1

I did a little research on those, and I like the idea for the most part. The ony thing is I question the safty of the weight jacks a little. Like what if the spring buckels at the point where it meets the weight jack. Im guessing that its really not a big problem because people seem to like them. Another thing is I havent found an 11 or 12" spring that has a 500-550 lb/in spring rating. I could go with a 9.5" spring and raise the weight jack more, but I wonder if that would be not as safe either. Other than that I like it.

The only other possible problem is with the tubular k-member it might not fit. Im going out now to make some measurements and see if I can get a picture snapped. Another thing is all the springs are offered at 5.5" outer diameter, and I measured the prokit spring at it too was 5.5" OD, but 5.5" does not fit properly in the upper spring perch. I think the moog springs might be a little smaller than that which will make life much easier for me.

CrazyHawaiian

I'm with RBob on this one. If you look into it more you'll find that you can get just about any spring OD, height, and rate you want. Manufacturers like AFCO and SSS (suspension spring specialists) and probably many others I dont know about will make the springs to your specs if they dont already have them on a shelf somewhere. I wouldnt even bother with the Internet, I would just get their phone numbers and get on the horn with them and see what they say. Remember now that Ground Control is just a part supplier, not a manufacturer. And also keep in mind Ground Control recently changed their spring source to Eibach exclusively, not those stock car spring manufacturers. So this probably limits what they are able to sell you, but it should not limit you from finding what you need somewhere else. Even if you dont end up using height adjusters, you can get any spring height you want. I believe stock springs are right around 14" uncompressed, but that measurement was taken on 130K mile spring so who knows if thats supposed to be the correct height from the factory.

Aftermarket K-member and A-arms might pose a problem, on that one I would contact the manufacturer of those aftermarket parts and ask them what spring sizes they recommend. They should know, if they dont I would be afraid to run their parts.

On the safety thing, the only possible issue I see (and I say its possible because I haven't seen it happen yet) is the spring un-seating when the suspension completely unloads. Because we are using springs that are much shorter than stock, depending on spring height and the setting of the weight jacks its possible the spring+adjuster combo does not take up the entire space between the K-member and A-arm with the suspension unloaded. I know this is what happens on my IROC-Z at full lock down (which is extremely lowered and undrivable), I have to re-index the front springs every time I raise the front of the car and put it back down. But as long as the suspension is loaded (aka as long as the car stays on the ground) then there is no problem. So I could only see this being a problem if I decided to go and try jump the car off a ramp or go off a ditch or something.

92CamaroLS1

Well I will try and give those companies a call tomorrow or tuesday. The only problem is that with the lighter LS1 and the tubular parts, its still going to kind of be a shot in the dark at how high the car is going to be. However your 14" uncompressed height is fairly close. The moog specs are between 13.1 and 15.2" depending on the stock spring.

Here is a pic of the upper perch of where I am having problems. Where the arrows point is where a front 5.5 OD spring will not fit in the pocket. The weight jacks might actually solve this problem. But I also think those moog springs I listed have a smaller outer diameter with the same inner diameter which might allow me to get a normal spring in there. The Kmember is from Hawks and he might not know what springs to use because I think he changed the design of the k-member...but hes on the list of calls I have to make too.



That was an issue I was concerned about. And while it might not be feasible right now, eventually Id like to see this car pull the front wheels at the track...unfortunatly that completely unloads the suspension and might be a BIG problem. However I know you are using a short 8" high rate spring....I would probably be using closer to an 11 or 12" spring with a much softer rating (around 550 in/lb most likely) for a street/strip set up. Would this make it safer in the fact that the spring might all ways be compresed even when the suspension is loaded?

Another advantage right now with going with a moog replacement is I can have them here in a couple days...and since this week is my spring break its one of the few times I can really work on the car because my college is a couple hours away and im only home on the weekends. If I wasnt going on vacation in a month I would say screw it and just get some coil overs.

92CamaroLS1

Here is a list of pros and cons.

Moog Replacement RS springs

Pros
- Cheap and quick, will arrive within a couple days
- According to the specs, they should fit in my spring perches
- Should be good for weight transfer
- Would work out well if I was able to cut them to height

Cons
- No way to tell what height they are going to leave the car at, too high, too low?
- Cutting the springs and testing for height takes a lot of time I dont have.
- Could end up with a really sloppy ride...but who knows?
- Might not fit, who knows again?

Weight Jacks/custom spring

Pros
- could solve issue of spring not fitting in upper perch.
- full adjustability in height
- any spring rate is available
- fairly cheap in comparison to coilovers

Cons
- saftey issue of spring becoming unset, very scary
- might be a problem if front suspension unloads completely
- might not fit correctly with tubular k-member, who knows?

Spohn Coilovers

Pros
- full height adjustability
- weight savings
- any spring rate available
- completely solves issue of spring not fitting in spring perch

Cons
- people question integrity for street use (although car is not driven hard)
- expensive...for me price will be over 700 (although I have enough to buy it)
- might not fit great with 17x9 wheel and 275 tire
- needs alot of adjustment to get correct (time consuming)