Hi,

I have a 1988 IROC Camaro with an L98 350 and T700 and am looking for lowering springs. Nothing too radical, the car is just used on weekends and I want something that handles well and is still comfortable.

I have ordered a BMR Suspension adjustable Panhard bar, Wonderbar and strut brace. The car is on original 16" IROC wheels.

Eibach lowered springs seem to be the best best, but am not sure whether to go for Sportline or Pro-Kit springs.

According to Eibach their springs drop from the originals:
* SPORTLINE 1.6" front, 1.3" rear
* PRO-KIT 1.0" front, 1.0" rear

Mattzoom has the same car and wheels and it looks good on Sportlines:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...portlines.html

If went for the Sportlines would I need an adjustable transmission torque bar too?

How would the handling and ride change with Sportlines?

Does anyone recommend the Eibach "Anti-Roll-Kit"(sway bars)?

I am leaning towards the Sportline springs, but would be interested in suggestions?

 

Sportlines will be fine, they ride fine too. An adjustable or shorter panhard bar and LCARBS would be recommended

What's wrong with your stock sway bars?

 

Prokit dropped my car more than advertised. rear didnt seem to drop as much at first but after a year or 2, it sits lower now Front is fairly slammed.

I love the prokit, rides great and handles great. I wouldnt want to be any lower and with my current exhaust setup, I couldnt afford to be any lower.

 

I love the sportlines they feel good and the car handles great now, also love the way it sits just looks mean and no issues with rubbing and if you take all your driveways correctly you dont even scrape

 

I got sportlines and really like them. I had to take out the upper rubber mounts in front to get it to sit level though at the time. Now the front is a bit lower, but IMHO it looks great.

 

The stock sway bars are fine,just curious about the Anti Roll Kit that Eibach sell.

Looks like most people recommend Sportlines, which is the way I'm leaning anyway.

LCARBS are the rear control arms?

I'm thinking of getting the Spohn adjustable front tie rod ends to keep the original steering geometry. Does this seem reasonable?

 

LCARBS are lower control arm relocation brackets. They will make sure the angle of the lower control arms is accurate. When you lower your car it will through that angle off and make for some nasty straight line wheel hop.

The Spohn adjustable tie rod ends (bump steer kit) are overpriced. Search on here, for my name, and you will find a list I put together for an adjustable bump steer kit for cheaper, and upgraded parts from www.speedwaymotors.com.

 

Thanks for the tips.

Wouldn't it be easier to just use adjustable rear lower control arms rather than relocation brackets?

I thought that because the control arms are almost on a 90 deg angle to the springs,that lowering1.3 inches would only make a small difference?

 

Pro Kit:
714 lb/in linear front 1 inch lower front
109/177 lb/in progressive rear 1 inch lower rear

Sportline:
700 lb/in linear front 1.6 inch lower front
80/137 lb/in progressive rear 1.3 inch lower rear

Eibach says the reason the sportline kit, which is actually lower than the pro kit, is softer is because they use the bumpstops as supplemental spring rate to maintain good ride quality and performance with the lowest drop possible.

I'd stick with the Pro Kit or the Hotchkis springs. Seems like there are less complaints about oddball heights with the Hotchkis springs.

Hotchkis
600 lb/in linear front 1 inch lower front
100/140 lbs/in progressive rear 1" lower rear

 

Hi Reid, thanks for the reply. The level of tech knowledge here is A1.

I'll check the Hotchkis springs, but an still leaning towards Sportlines, mainly because of some good recommendations here and the pictures of similar cars with these springs.

What other suspension mods would you suggest to work with the lowered springs?

 

From what I've read:

Pro-kit = better handling

Sportlines = better looks

Is this right?

 

The relo brackets are for a different angle than the adjustable LCAs. If you are into straight line racing, then the relo brackets are going to help you the most. From the learning I have done, read: personal opinion, the reloc brackets will not help all that much in the twisties, it might actually hurt you. I have a friend that races and he said he car was very loose in the turns with the relo brackets and very firm without.

 

^^^^^ I have to disagree. When I finally broke down an put the relocation brackets my car handled much much better in both the launch and in the turns. With out them on sportlines the car would almost hop in hard turns and felt so unstable.

Besides that, The sport lines road ok. IMO the problems first.....
Exhaust was too low to the ground and would scrape if i hit a dip in the road at speed or speed bump.
Had to remove the bump stops to get the full travel out of the suspension.
Had to replace my struts to handle the drop and travel.
Front bumper would scrape pulling into parking lots from the road.

Pros....... Looked awesome,
definitely improved handling (lower center of gravity)
Better ride then just cutting springs
Actually shifted weight fairly well when launching the car.


With that all said. I sold the springs after about 4 years cause they were too low, and Hated planing where I could pull in or going around speed bumps. After I destroyed my exhaust and tubular K member on a paving project here in NY I went full coil over. Its a night and day difference. The car rides smoother, Is now balanced to actually weight and is adjustable !!!! I set it just a smidge higher then the sport lines, but Ive got much more ground clearance now.

 

Yes. You are correct. Personally I think the Sportlines are too low. Don't forget that simply sitting inside your car will drop the springs another .75" in height. The whole thing about Sportlines using the bumpstops as part of their daily use baffles me. I don't EVER want to be on the bumpstops. That's why I would buy new springs and shocks in the first place.

The Pro-Kit has firm enough springs to keep you from getting bottoming out too much. Scrapping on the ground is decent (especially if you have new struts/shocks). Sportlines? I'd rather not lose my $$$ exhaust from having too low a ride.

Pro-Kit (or Hotchkis) can get away with not needing LCA relocation brackets. Sportline, you'd need them.

 

Avoiding LCA brackets and scraping the exhaust are good points.

The Pro-kit has a 1" drop and the Sportlines 1.5", do you think half an inch would make that much of a difference?

I read here that anything under a 2" drop was ok, but would rather learn from others experience rather than find out for myself.

 

I have pro-kit springs on my car along with a slew of other suspension upgrades and here is my stance. To me the pro-kit is too soft but I'm more interested in track performance then street comfort.

 

Thanks for the picture.

Not sure if it the low tyres, but there doesn't seem to be much of a drop?

 

If you put that car next to a stock ride hight you will see the difference.

As for the only 1.5" drop im telling you it drops much more over time. And its also funny that someone else mentioned using the bump stops as part of the suspension. After I bought new tires, I put my car on the alignment machine and noticed the rear about 1." away from the bump stops. So I removed them to eventually cut them down a bit. Well was the worst thing I could have done. I then had the worst wheel hop (before LCA brackets), and the car just felt as if it handled very strange.

 

From the ground to the top of the wheel well it's 26" front, 27" back. Keep in mind that my car is only ~3100# in that pic. If your car is heavier it will sit lower.


You should never have to use the bump stop as part of the suspension. It takes away from comfort and predictability. When you hit the bump stop you have effectively bottomed out and to me it is a very stupid idea to pay $250 to make you car bottom out.

 

I'd still recommend the Pro Kit over the Sportline.....The height drops aren't set in stone. See my answer below.

I agree on the bumpstop. Hitting it in a straight line is annoying. But getting on the bumpstop during a hard corner is where things would get flat out scary.

As far as ride heights go, there is no uniform standard. Not every car with the same springs will be at the same height. But to throw some numbers out there. Racing Geek's rear end is 27" tall. Mine (with brand new stock height Moog springs) is 28.5" That right there to me says that the Pro Kit is offering a 1.5" lowering level over stock height in the back end.

My height with the original (in other words OLD) factory springs in the car was 27.5" on the left and 28" in the right.

Now the consensus is that Pro Kit = handling and Sportline = looks. I also think that people get too much into "lower car = better handling." While it's true that the ultimate handling cars all have low ride heights. Using our cars as an example, the cars that have 2" dropped spindles also have 1000 lb springs up front and 300 lb springs out back.

For the majority of us, the best handling mods are really good struts/shocks (Koni/Bilstein) along with rod end or delsphere/rotojoint LCA and PHB. The best tires we can buy. Lowering springs aren't as important in that regard. So spend the money on good struts/shocks and save money on the springs, rather than doing good money on springs and relying on old struts/shocks.

 

@racing geek, what size are your wheels and tyres?

 

I'm on Sportlines on an otherwise bone-stock but healthy suspension. Dropped the car a good bit, though I'm not as low as the other guy with the blue car in the thread linked earlier; my guess is if I were to put Bilsteins/Konis in, my car would drop a bit more.

At the current ride height I have zero problems with rubbing or bottoming out. I've got probably 10-15k miles on the Sportlines over the last 7-8 years since I put them on, and I thus far have nothing bad to say. One caveat though, I don't drive the car hard or race it so I can't speak to the wheel hop issues or anything, but it seems to handle fine for its purposes as a cruiser. For me, at least thus far with stock shocks/struts, I'm glad I went with the Sportlines and not the Pro-Kit. I too saw many pictures of the Pro-Kit and to me the cars simply didn't look lower, so I went against the grain of Pro-Kit recommendations and got the Sportlines, and I'd do it again no questions asked.

Picture:

 

excuse the front end damage that will get fixed.... here is my car with the pro kit but i also have a near fully bolt on suspension.. the only thing i did was take the rear isolators out.... this is low enough for me because my exhaust scrapes bumps at times and i can forget about driving up my my garage... i live on a steep hill and the only way i can get in the garage is if i unbolt my y pipe off.....

IMG01163-20101119-1413.jpg?t=1312121129

 

One thing to remember with viewing pictures and comparing height differences is what is the angle? If you take a picture squating down low, the gap between fender and tire will look bigger. If you take a picture standing up with normal viewing, it will look less.

Here is my car with stock height springs (Moog 5665 with the stock isolators). Height is 28.5" (or 27.75" with me in the car). I'm 6'4" and this was taken with the camera at shoulder level, looking through the view finder as one would typically do a quick point and shoot. This is what the car looks like when I walk up to it.



I don't think it really looks that much different from the above pictures. But get down low and look and I'm sure it would seem much taller than the blue and maroon cars above.......Having said that though, I'll admit that when they went in, they seemed WAY taller than the original factory springs (which had sunk down by 1.5" over time)

I'm still of the ProKit > Sportline though. Skip the hard thumps on the bumpstops, the scraping pipes, the dread that occurs when you see something on the highway, better performance spring rate numbers, and better overall ride comfort in any situation. The Sportlines are for looking good when the car is parked.

 

18"x10.5" wheels with 295/30/18 rubber on all four corners. Still has the stock turning radius too.

 

Ok, that's interesting.

I just bought some polished original IROC 16 * 8 wheels to replace the existing 15" Centrelines. I'm planning on getting some 245/50/16 tyres and was worried about clearance, but now figure there must be plenty of space.

I'll go with the Pro-Kit, but looking at your picture there doesn't seem to be as much of a drop as I expected.

Anyone have experience with the Eibach swap bars?

 

Does anybody make a set that oes about 1.2" all around with enough stiffness to avoid the bump stop?