..and how did you get there?

extra internet points if you didnt turn the car into an unstreetable tin can. i want to keep a "stock" interior

looking for ideas besides the usual stuff as i will be doing:
battery relocation
no ac and a non-ac heater box
hole saw to the crash beams in the bumpers (would absolutely love to find a way to use aluminum and/or carbonfiber.)
tube control arms
glass hood
aluminum heads
plastic intake
would like to do glass (fiber not sand)/cf t-tops

 

Dont the early firebirds have aluminum bumpers?

 

theres something id like more info on..

 

I've been wondering about relocating the radiator to the trunk. I never put anything else in it. It's a fair amount of weight really far out at the front so transferring it to just behind the rear wheels sounds good. I know aluminum pipes can be used front to rear which would also provide some cooling and it would require a couple of big fans maybe running most of the time unless some ram air could be ducted in. Forward vents in the sail panels? Venting could be through the rear. Vented panel and bumper? Also, a notch back would be a little lighter and could have more inlet and outlet vents???
Then think of the cold ram air you could have straight up into the intake! I've got a friend who has done this with his Nascar-ish El Camino. But he does have a lot more room. Hmmmm......

 

I think it's just the early Z28s that got the aluminum bumpers, but apparently they dont weigh much less than the newer bumpers. They just swiss cheesed the newer ones enough that they weight about the same.

I did a little searching.

To me it seems like all you can do is stuff like...

aluminum heads
remove power steering
relocate battery
remove A/C
'glass hood.
LS1 swap

Beyond that I'm at a loss too. Seems to me the only REAL way to get 50/50 in these cars is to mess with the firewall and install the engine farther into the car. I wonder how close an LS1 would get you, though. They're what... 150 lbs lighter?

 

Third gens are very nose heavy. With a 4 cylinder and a little work, you might get close to 50/50.

My car is a gutted out race car with a BBC. The engine has been moved back as far as it can go. With a full cage, much of the cage weight is carried by the back tires. All windows are Lexan. Fiberglass doors. Lexan t-tops.

My race weight sitting on the starting line is 3020 pounds. Driver, fuel car etc. There's still 59% of the weight sitting on the front tires. With good track conditions, it still didn't stop me from carrying the front wheels 80' down the track early this season.

 

Think I'm at 57 or 58% on the front, I'll have to dig out my sheet. Don't have a/c or a heater, battery is still up front, fiberglass hood, aluminum heads, intake, water pump, radiator, crash bar untouched, impact absorber still there. Pretty much any lightening I've done is just basic unbolting things and the aluminum bits on the engine. Also took out all the sound matting inside, got rid of any wiring not needed, most of the duct work behind the dash is gone. Going to start costing money soon to get it much lighter and I really don't want to go at it with a hole saw.

 

It's not just what but where. A pound from the nose is worth much more than a pound from the firewall.

 

need something like this up top. would help quite a bit i imagine.
i think the stock t's are 25-30?lbs

i would be willing to take a hole saw to the crash beam as long as the plastic bits got to stay. if i could find some structural cf...

k member is an obvious one. k and the a-arms are worth 30-55 off the nose altogether.

with a 3400lb car at 57/43, would need to move 238 lbs to the rear or remove from the front of the car.

at 3300lb at that same 57/43, i would need to move or remove 231.

what are the general weights of:
stock steel vs fiberglass
ac system
aluminum heads vs stock cast iron

 

tubular A arms and k member, fiber hood, aluminum heads, lightweight wheels, EGR delete, AC delete, headers, if race only car can remove the headlights and headlight bar, if you use a pin on hood you can remove the hinges/shocks, cable, latch, latch bar, spring, etc. Again if its race only, you could run without an alternator(provided it doesn't need to run longer than the battery will last) pretty much delete any non essentials up front, or swap out for lighter parts, the bumper is pretty damned heavy(I just pulled my nose today), and right on the nose, battery relocation, you could relocate the radiator, but the problem with both of these is you are adding weight via cables/piping, though the battery sure is in a bad spot, pretty far forward and sitting rather high up too. Can remove the fender shields, if you relocate the battery you could cut out the tray(pretty sure this wouldn't affect structural integrity) windshield reservoir, overflow tank, wipers & motors if race only, a manual trans might help a little bit, but the trans is pretty close to center of the car, if you have too much money to spend, carbon ceramic front brakes, if you are ludicrously rich, carbon fiber front brakes and carbon fiber rims(I would kill for a set of CF rims...)...heater if you don't need it or can live without it, all the little things, just got to sit there staring at it and decide what can go or be replaced with something lighter, or moved elsewhere.

 

Don't forget, that total weight needs to be with the driver. Adjusting a car to 50/50 then adding a driver will throw the ratio off. The driver doesn't sit in exactly the center and also sits over to one side which will throw the 4 corner weight off.

 

I didn't think our cars were that front heavy. One of the articles listed on this website shows an 82 TA with a F/R weight of 54 / 46.

https://www.thirdgen.org/1982firebir...mt-january1982

Another article in 82 for the Camaro shows the same weight distribution.

https://www.thirdgen.org/1982camaroz28-mt-january1982

But then again a later 1986 article puts an L98 Iroc-Z preview article at 58/42.
https://www.thirdgen.org/rt_october1...s_camaro_irocz

Of the articles I looked at on the site most didn't have the weight balance information.

 

Found my paperwork... 55.5/44.5 total weight 3535 lbs.

 

I think all thirdgens fall into the 60/40 to 50/50 range, which is decent, if one were really committed there is also the corvette IRS and rear mount trans option.

 

my ultimate goal is to have the ultimate dual duty car. a large part of that will have to be weight balance. the IRS, while nice, would be... bad for drag racing and heavy. a live "3 link" axle can work as evidenced by the new mustangs.

so far, it seems that THE place to take weight from is the front of the car.

 

"Ultimate" is largely dependent on ultimate $$$. You can go all tubular, acid dipped, carbon, aluminum, lexan etc. etc. etc. 2,000 lbs and balanced and maybe still looks like a street car? Remove the rear seats and belts and a/c system for near 100 lbs saving and the cost of a new serpentine belt. Move the battery. Big effect doesn't cost much. Then you start spending some real money. Anyone know off hand what a rad full of coolant weighs?

 

has to be an actual street car not a tin can with some carpet

so far the ideas are, custom aluminum crash beam with stock honey comb plastic bits, lexan/fiberglass tops, cutting metal from certain spots (like the lip on the fender mount), fluid containers, and battery relocation.

one thing i was lookin at was the steering linkage. a chromemoly center link would be useful as well as a lighter steering box.

the key is not jsut to remove weight, but remove weight in a way that balances the car.

 

You can get to 50:50, but you need to go all aluminum motor (SBC or LSX) and eliminate or change a lot of parts in the cars. Of course GM did a bang up job using inferior (and for the most part, heavier) components that a true enthusiast would change anyway.