Ok so I decided to scrap my LT1 and 4th gen interior idea because my car is almost to the point where it doesn't have to pass smog in any state, don't have em here in Mi but I don't know where I'll end up. So I'm gonna list the parts that I plan on using and I have researched like crazy and I think I got a good combo so let me know what you think. Also if possible can someone tell me what compression I'll be running at or give me the stock deck clearence so I can do it myslef? Thanks everyone, here goes.

-LO3 305 block bored over .040" with stock 400 crank shot-peened balanced and knifedged.(3/75" stroke should give me a 334 with overbore.)
-Sterling 9.39 comp. hypereutectic flat top pistong with Eagle SR I-beam rods.
-Dart Iron eagle cast iron heads w/ 5 angle valve job port and pilished. i'm thinking about the 50cc heads if I can stay just under 10:1 compression ratio. Otherwise I'll get the 64cc and shave the deck and use a thinner gasket. I'm using stock .46 gasket with the 50cc heads.
-Comp Cams extreme energy 270/276 cam(also running comp cams roller tips 1.6 rockers, Can I use regular 2.02 and 1.6 valves with this setup or do I need the shoter or longer ones? Also what is my total lift?)
-Holley Pro-jection dual plane truck TBI manifold (same bolt patter!) with the holley 670 ot 400 cfm 2bbl GM TBI
-Hedman 82-93 F-body headers jegs prt. no. 68481
-Custom PROM
-Full Pertronix igntion system
-Moser 10 bolt rearend w/3.43 gears and aluminum driveshaft with beefy flexplate, shift improver kit, 2600 stall convertor, forged yokes
-Full array of suspension upgrades.

Tha's the important stuff, if I missed anything let me know, if you have suggestions for more power with minimal cost increase let me know. I'm looking for 400 ponies and 450-500 tq. The main issue is the torque, I will not go lower on torque. I also will not run the bottle or turbo, Supersharger is possible in the future but not until this is done and tested. "Im willing to run up to 6500 rpm if this combo will go that far!Thanks again for reading.

TQ estimate=
HP estimate=
compression=
1/4 estimate=
max rpm estimate=

 

Save all of that but do it to a 350. For the money you are going to spend on all that you can throw in a bit more for a 350 block. You cannot overbore a 305 more than .030 and you will never see 400hp out of a 305 TBI. Only on spray will you get close to that. However if you do keep the 305 idea and go .030 over you still want to stick with 1.94 and 1.5 valves. 2.02 valve will work but will shroud air from entering in on one side. You can hurt performace that way. There is no problem with your TBI aspirations but do it to a 350 or larger combo. You will be much happier. Many members have heads and cammed 305's that wish they had 45+ more cubes.

 

You see the ignorance in your thinking. 1. I don't have a 350 block lying around and I don't want to buy one. 2. If you think about it, 45 more cubes will give me 379, It's not gonna be a 305, It will be a 334. 3. You can go beyond .030 over bore, that's why they make .040 overbore pistons in the first place. It's not your place to come on here and say get a 350. I'm tired of hearing it. Tha's all these people say. I've seen 334 get 500+ hp so don't say it can't be done without the bottle. How much will you give me if I do it? I'm not that concerned with hp, hp is nothing, I want the TQ! That's what kills the imports! As for the heads I see what you're saying, but my only other option from Dart is the SB 165cc heads which is perfect, but they have a 72cc cumbustion chamber and that will kill my compression. I'm not trying to dog you, but dude, you gotta admit everyone says get a 350. I like to be different, I always go against that grain and I really wanna do this. A 350 won't be in CHP as fast as a 400hp 334 monster will be. I like to be creative!

 

Running the Comp Cam 270 with the AL L98 heads on a 350, TBI, I made about 325 HP.

Now with a 305, you'll also wind up with more valve shrouding then with a 350. The smaller bore means the valves are closer to the cylinder wall and where they are close flow is very poor. Now, if you want to use some really short rods, you can help min that to some degree. The short rods, have the piston moving past TDC faster, and that helps draw the intake charge in better.

 

What if I were to get the stems that were .1 shorter, would that help at all?

 

Ok I changed my mind on the heads I decided to go with the World S/R (not tourqers) with the 64cc cumbustion chambers with 1.94 and 1.55 valves, that should put my compression at 9.4 and I should be able to run 90 octane. So that's settled, anyone else have opinions?

 

Before you go off and start putting anyone down for suggesting you to go to a larger engine you might want to read your CHP magizine a few more times. I think what most people here already know is you will spend twice as much if not three times as much getting your engine to make the power and torque you want than you would spend building a larger cubic inch engine. There are a lot of ways to be different and not build a 305 variant. You could even build a 327 and have better success at obtaining your goal than building a 334. The easiest way would be to build a 400sb and just tell everybody it's a 305. But as far as building the 334 that you want, all I can say is build it then test it on a dyno and print the results for all to see. Oh and by the way, the length of the valve stem has nothing to do with valve shrouding caused by to small of a piston bore, do YOU see the ignorance in your thinking, yet.

Steve

 

Just go an get a 305 bored .040 over and see what happens. When you have water in your cylinders because you weakend the block let me know. There are a few diff's between a 305 and 350 block and there are water jackets very close to the cylinder walls in a 305. You can go as much as .060 over in a 350 but they have don't have water jackets in the same spot. I am not speaking bogus stuff here. I too wanted to be unique but every single mod later plus a cam swap still makes me just "moderately slow". My buddy has a full heads and cammed+tuning and 454 TBI 305 and it is STILL SLOWER THAN my stock 95 Z. The 305 is not a performance motor. So when people tell you to go with a 350+ that is because it works. I am not trying to put you down but merely guide you into more logical thinking. The 305 has lots of benifits don't get me wrong. And with lots of mods you can get them to run low 14's and maybe low 13's with spray. But for the guy who spends all his efforts to run 13.5 with a 305 TBI there are a million guys who spent half as much and run 11's. But if you are going to spend 700 for machine work and another 3 grand for parts, what is another 200 for a 350 block? There are a few guys who have 310's (305's .030 over) and they make 320hp with all of the goodies. Sure that sounds nice but is not worth the price they paid for it. Take my words for what you want but don't be dissapointed when you car runs high 14's.

 

Dude, there's all sorts of 305 pride here on the thirdgen boards. I mean, almost every TBI guy has just a little 305 pride (even those that use it as a boat anchor).

But facts are facts; if your going to pull the engine out, you might as well go with a good sound platform to build off of. Even with the .040 over-bore, your elongation of the stroke will amplify the stalwart weakness of the 305 (that it's bore is WAY too small for it's stroke to make decent power). That's just a plain fact. No matter the heads, valves, induction, voodoo, chanting- NOTHING will make the 305 breath better on top.

And if your talking torque, nothing does more talking than raw cubic inches. Period.

If your gonna blow a load on a motor, blow it on one worth the money, and not some ***** of an eco-block.

 

hey, sizzlechest, you ASKED for peoples' opinions. don't start calling people "ignorant" and telling what their place is just because you don't agree.

and as far as emissions go, you'd better do some checking. here in geargia, a car has to be 25 years old before it's exempt.

and finally, it's crazy to put money into a 305 short block when 350s and 383s are so plentiful and cheap. a lot of the major increases in horsepower you've seen over the past 20 years has come from improved head design. with a 3.75" bore, you lose a lot of the benefits of that, as the combustion chambers overlap the bore and the bore shrouds the valves.

i don't think you can compare a 5.0 gm to a 5.0 ford. i may be wrong, but i think the bore of a 302 is pretty close, if not the same as that of a 351. trying to make a small bore 305 make 400hp just doesn't make sense.

i'm in the process of trying to wring all i can out of my 305, but the minute the short block goes away, so does the 305. you can eventually knock a hole in a wall by banging your head against it, but it's a lot easier (and less painful) to use a sledgehammer.

 

I'm with everybody else on this subject. Don't waste your money on a 305/334 unless you are absolutely set on a stroked 305. Numbers are numbers, facts are facts. 350 blocks can be had for cheap.

If you are interested, I can pm you the cost of my engine-including labor on the buildup, valve and bowl work, 400 crank prep on block, etc, and you can compare it to the price of your set up. It has been estimated at 400 hp (at the flywheel) by a couple of guys with a lot of track experiance.

Not trying to disrespect you, just trying to help you save money and make more power.

 

N/A91CamaroRS,
I say go with it I've always wanted to see just what can be got out of one. The 335 is a motor that I've wanted to build for about 10 years now. But I know it will not make the amount of power that I'm looking for, thats why I'm building a 388 now. I've seen 305's bored .060, but you'd better invest in a lot better raditaor, Be Cool, Griffen or such with no more than 160* stat and use some water wetter. I think 400hp might, real big might be possiable, but it would be with the best of everything and most likely not last many miles(20,000-40,000 maybe). Might even have to add a little NO2.

I say if you've got the money do it and prove them all wrong. But that has always been my problem, the money. If I'm going to spend $6000 to $10,000 its going to have to be in a motor that is going to last 100,000 or more. Good luck how ever it turns out though & post us some figures, Bobby

 

I"m not gonna sit here and pretend that I'm not ignorant about some things because I am. I have to readily admit, and maybe this will help understand my thinking, that I used to be a sport compact buff. I have a 95 Cavalier with a 2.2 pushing near 300hp, I think it's 273 right now. And I just assumed the same can be done with a V8, which it can. i have decided instead of N/A since you all say it's impossible to go supercharger on the rebuild (maybe turbo, but unlikely). How much power you you all think A built engine sleeved with .03 overbore with all my above goodies will put out with 20psi? I'm thinking near 450hp. I am sticking to the 334 for, again, creativity, and money isn't an issue. I'm poor, but I build slowly! I'm sorry uf I offended anyone, I am quickly understand the muscle-cars, but I don't have it all down yet. For the person who mentioned the emmisions, it is 25 years, but in MI we don't have emmisions, and I'll be here forever! Thanks for the help guys, I'm still looking for estimates and better power cobos if you guys got them. Thanks again!

Nick

 

Why not do a 355? I dont like strokers, I like destrokers. That 4" bore will satisfy you more than the 305 ever could.

 

Anyone have a block they want to sell? For really really really really cheap? Like free? I can build it on the side and just drive my 305 until I drop in the other? I don't have the resources to get the new block. I would have to get it tested and I din't wanna waste money testing a block when I have one I know is in great shape. If I could get one already tested I would. I just really like the idea 334. It's reliable and the gas mileage is decent.

Nick

 

How did you get 300hp out of a 2.2L. Isn't that a TBI system as well? I had a 95 cavalier that had the 2.2 and it was a TBI system with multi port injector set-up. I think that is still TBI though. But I know it was seriously slow. If you did that is impressive. I did not think there was an aftermarket for that motor but for the 2.4 instead. Anyways, the best 2 barrel TBI set-ups can only support around 400hp (give or take 20) with all the goodies and tuning. It is the nature of the TBI beast. 450hp will require a serious bottem end if you are running boost. Even 5lbs of boost on a stock bottom end can be leathal if the compresion ratio is kept at stock.

 

Man Shifty, you had a Cav? Yeah the aftermarket for the 2.2ohv, 2.4L, and the new 2.2 Eco is huge, not that of the Civic mind you but huge! I'm not running N/A on the Cav, I'm rinning 15psi of boost, but the 12sec 1/4 is nice! Check out j-body.org if you get the chance, nice site, one of the best. The bottom end on the Camaro will be all forged parts. I"m not gonna 'F' that up. I'm thinking of running 2 T304E turbos with a 7.6 compression and 15-20psi of boost, should put me in a nice curve, I'll have to search around and find out. I really like Superchargers better though, seems like thet are not as dangerous, but I heard they don't make pulleys to run over 7-9 psi. Is that true?

Nick

 

You are right about the pullies but that is okay. 9psi on a built 350 is serious power. If you want to go the turbo and or super charger route you need to look at an LT1/stealth ram/mini ram set-up. You can get you 450+ hp easily with either of those.

I used to go to jbody all the time. Before my roomate got is 02 SS he had a Z24 and was on that site a lot. My 95 cavy was a winter beater with the 3 spd auto. You must have spent some $$ on that

There is a guy in town here that has a twin turno LS1 TA, stock displacement with a little bit bigger cam and some head porting and he has run a best of 9.85 on slicks. Power adders cam make scary power when placed on the right small block.

 

I spent about $3500 on the CAv engine, another $2000 on the interior, it's my winter beater now, LOL. I think I read in the power adder room that there is a 14psi pulley out now. Imagine that biatch on there? Along with the other mods I have planned I'm thinking that 500hp at about $6000 is a pretty easy feat, spent another $3000 on the driveline and I'm golden!

Nick

 

Search, hunt, beg, pleed, and you'll easily find a 350 block for free. They're out there. Trust me. You have to dig, sometimes literally, but they're out there.

Just as an example, I also have a '72 Camaro and I go to a 2nd gen Camaro site. I ran across an ad for a guy selling an unmolested 400 block for $50. He still has the crank and rods, but spun a bearing. At the risk of the crank and/or one of the rods being toast I told him I'll give him another $20 for the crank and rods.

The machine work on a 305 and a 400 are identical, so that's a wash, and I'm 99.9% sure that a complete engine kit for a 400 is cheaper than a 305 kit. Why? Because they're more popular for high-po engines.

Why are they more popular? Because they work very well.

I noticed you mentioned imports, and how you'd love to kick their butts, and I respect that. But if you want to beat them, get their thinking out of your head.

Making more HP/Liter proves nothing except you know how to spend more money.

Making more HP/$, proves you're a frugal buyer. That's when it becomes fun.

As far as using forged parts, absolutely!!! But again, you'll find out that forged pistons and moly face rings are cheaper and easier to find for a 350 than for a 305/334. Now you're building more strength AND more HP/$.

It's really starting to become fun now.

 

That is very well put. And when you super/turbo your small block you can tell all the imports what happens when you add a power adder to a real car. You won't run high 13's after all of your efforts. You will run basic off the shelf parts and you will run much much faster. And they will all scratch their heads. Just like that turbo LS1 I told you about. Simple heads and cam and a few turbos makes Vin Diesels supra look stupid.

 

*clap*clap*clap*clap*
Now that's what I'm talking about, you have convinced me, the first person to do so in 5 years!

Nick

 

Are you sure that the 305 block is good? Have you spent the money in making sure that it is good and not saying it ran before? With all that hp that is going to be put in to it, it’s going to be a big waste when it blows up because you never sent it off and spent some money on it and end up turning your bottom end into a pile of junk. 350s are one of the most common engine and well if u can’t find one you might as well give up on every thing, because if u cant find that I doubt u can even find the rest room. what times you running with that cav?

 

That is beautiful! I may put that in my sig if you don't mind...

I was worried I may have to do something about this thread for a minute but you guys played nice really quick. I agree with the majority of the thread, as much as I'd love to have my LO3 eating 3 square meals of power every day, I know its just not gonna happen. I most definetly see your point, but thats the beauty of NOT driving an import. We are allowed to say "So what if you have more horsepower per liter, I have more horsepower per car!!" I'm leaving the LO3 in my 90' because I'm getting 20mpg out of this thing in the City. I decided I'm just gonna get a whole new car to play with and drop a 350+ in it instead...

Bruce (90RS305)

 

That's great!!!!

Now I'll have to put in MY sig.

BTW, no I don't have a bigger picture of the one in my sig.

Yes, you can use it since I stole it from another site anyway.

Someone that comes to TGO says that's their green car on the right. I don't remember who it was though

 

Dang, I would LOVE a bigger pic of it! You like that, huh? I got another good one too, for the mustang fans of the world:
"Real men don't wear bowties, huh? So I'm guessing they ride ponies?"

 

I'ld like to take a look at that. PM me.

 

if you have an auto zone by you then you can go get yourself a 350 tbi that is cheaper then doing all that. i was going to do all that to my LO3 but you can get a 350 minus like valve covers, oil filter, oil pan intake and tbi (which you can use from your engine) all for 900 bucks. i know it's alot but then when you build your motor up you'll actualy be getting some power.

 

Look for a gm goodwrench block , I picked up a fully machined .30 350 from ebay for just 200 bucks 2 years ago , of course I had another $1000 in machine work done to the block and crank etc but you dont have to do that, I did o-rings, double keyed snout , hardcore stuff. Plenty of
fresh 355 blocks that somebody has to part with , and cheap!!!! EBAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hail:

Hell I even drove to pa and back to get mine and had to carry it out of dudes moms place down a flight of stairs , that :nono: was heavy!

Also check out AMS h beams and 4340 crank for the 30 , talk to raymond. I put a ad on my frontpage for their company and in turn I got a big discount and free tee shirts on stuff for my build up. There are plenty of ways in this world to do things very cheap w/o sacrificing any durability or horsepower.

 

Hey Firbird, my best time with the cav is 12.7 (corrected) at 112. Decent, but not great.

So here is the really funny part. Last night I went to a party and met a kid who is selling a cammed 350. It's only a 2 bolt main, but I'll drill it for 4. Only thing I don't know is if it's roller or flat-tappet. Oh the irony! It's only gonna cost me $50. I'm gonna sell the cam though.

Nick