350 TBI in dire need of help!
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Member
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 267
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From: Georgia
Car: 88 Firebird
Engine: 350 LO5 TBI
Transmission: 700R4 Vette Servo/Shift
350 TBI in dire need of help!
ok i have searched high and low but just havent been able to find solid answers to anything. Most have just posted their specific problems in a new thread to get better help so i am doin so...greatly sorry guys if this is repeat in any way.
heres the deal:
1: ive got a cracked TBI unit
2: blown header gasket and headers are trashed. cat is cut off and i need new exhaust
3: im blowing white smoke out just bout every time i turn the car on
4: i have next to no money. Possibly a little over $1000 to spend immediatly (if i put college tuition aside)
so here is my proposed setup:
-immediatly get new headers (correct?) hooker 2055s with Y-pipe coated
-now i know my umbrella seals are probly shot and my heads just plain suck so i ask this-
I have a 350 TBI - are the vortec heads the best to get and if i get the GM intake that matches will i be ok. If there is a cheaper set of heads and matching intake that will get me more HP then please let me know.
-i need a bolt on replacement setup so can those vortecs, intake, and possibly an LT4 hotcam go in with no modification needed. No tools, time, or money so i need bolt on parts for replacement that also give good HP.
- can i keep EGR because i dont want to modify my whole system. I will spend the extra few hundred to get parts that need less mods to fit. Is it recommended to go without EGR?
- Does someone else make a better performing intake thats compatible with vortec heads and also works with EGR (at reasonable price)
- AIR is bout the only thing I am removing so im not worried about emissions
- how much and good are the AFR heads compared to vortec.
Down the road im looking for a 400+ hp setup with a 383 stroker kit from powerhouse for my 350.
Most importantly how much of this can i do on my own. My local shop wants over $450 just to INSTALL my headers so i cant even image what it cost to put in heads and intake and what not. Can this be done at home by a regular joe? (if its a matter of tools i can possibly invest in what i need)
so where can i get these parts for decent prices and are they right for me?
thanks guys
heres the deal:
1: ive got a cracked TBI unit
2: blown header gasket and headers are trashed. cat is cut off and i need new exhaust
3: im blowing white smoke out just bout every time i turn the car on
4: i have next to no money. Possibly a little over $1000 to spend immediatly (if i put college tuition aside)
so here is my proposed setup:
-immediatly get new headers (correct?) hooker 2055s with Y-pipe coated
-now i know my umbrella seals are probly shot and my heads just plain suck so i ask this-
I have a 350 TBI - are the vortec heads the best to get and if i get the GM intake that matches will i be ok. If there is a cheaper set of heads and matching intake that will get me more HP then please let me know.
-i need a bolt on replacement setup so can those vortecs, intake, and possibly an LT4 hotcam go in with no modification needed. No tools, time, or money so i need bolt on parts for replacement that also give good HP.
- can i keep EGR because i dont want to modify my whole system. I will spend the extra few hundred to get parts that need less mods to fit. Is it recommended to go without EGR?
- Does someone else make a better performing intake thats compatible with vortec heads and also works with EGR (at reasonable price)
- AIR is bout the only thing I am removing so im not worried about emissions
- how much and good are the AFR heads compared to vortec.
Down the road im looking for a 400+ hp setup with a 383 stroker kit from powerhouse for my 350.
Most importantly how much of this can i do on my own. My local shop wants over $450 just to INSTALL my headers so i cant even image what it cost to put in heads and intake and what not. Can this be done at home by a regular joe? (if its a matter of tools i can possibly invest in what i need)
so where can i get these parts for decent prices and are they right for me?
thanks guys
Last edited by Avenger007; Oct 8, 2004 at 02:47 PM.
Supreme Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,231
Likes: 1
From: Greenville, SC
Car: 1991 Chevy Camaro
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 700R4
Axle/Gears: 3.42
If I were you, I would put off buying performance parts until you solve the problems you listed. But, that's just me.
1. Which part of the TBI unit is cracked? The base, the injector pod, etc? You can get any of these things cheap at a junkyard, there are plenty of TBI cars out there (Caprices, Camaros and Firebirds, 1500 trucks, vans, etc.).
2. How are your headers trashed? You can get some new header gaskets or donut seals easily. Not very expensive, either. You can choose to get a new exhaust from a muffler shop or get a cat-back and install it yourself if you can (it'll save you $), and neither of these options cost too much.
3. Is the smoke dead white or does it have a slight blue tint to it? How long does the car smoke from the exhaust? Is just when you start it or is it all the time? It's probably just your valve seals, which aren't too hard to change, but you need some special tools. I have no idea how much a shop would charge.
I can't really help you with your performance questions, but I do know one thing. You're going to need to learn how to burn your own PROMs (or know a friend that can do it) with those mods you listed. The stock chip just won't cut it.
Good luck with your project!
1. Which part of the TBI unit is cracked? The base, the injector pod, etc? You can get any of these things cheap at a junkyard, there are plenty of TBI cars out there (Caprices, Camaros and Firebirds, 1500 trucks, vans, etc.).
2. How are your headers trashed? You can get some new header gaskets or donut seals easily. Not very expensive, either. You can choose to get a new exhaust from a muffler shop or get a cat-back and install it yourself if you can (it'll save you $), and neither of these options cost too much.
3. Is the smoke dead white or does it have a slight blue tint to it? How long does the car smoke from the exhaust? Is just when you start it or is it all the time? It's probably just your valve seals, which aren't too hard to change, but you need some special tools. I have no idea how much a shop would charge.
I can't really help you with your performance questions, but I do know one thing. You're going to need to learn how to burn your own PROMs (or know a friend that can do it) with those mods you listed. The stock chip just won't cut it.
Good luck with your project!
Supreme Member
iTrader: (2)
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,962
Likes: 5
From: Moorestown, NJ
Car: 88 Camaro SC
Engine: SFI'd 350
Transmission: TKO 500
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt w/ 3.23's
Like said above Id work on the immediate issues first and save your money. That way youll have greater freedom to choose the parts you want. If you have somewhere to work on your car it shouldnt cost too much to fix the problems. Youll obviously need a new tbi base/pod, head gaskets, good head bolts, misc. gaskets and sealant, and fluids. After that at least the behicle will be running and you wont ahve to worry about biting off more then you can chew, especially if you have to use the vehicle in the near future.
If you really want to get a positive ID on the smoke, smell it. If its a blown head gasket itll smell like antifreeze. Also, a compression check will tell you for sure if the head gasket is blown.
If you really want to get a positive ID on the smoke, smell it. If its a blown head gasket itll smell like antifreeze. Also, a compression check will tell you for sure if the head gasket is blown.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
From: Georgia
Car: 88 Firebird
Engine: 350 LO5 TBI
Transmission: 700R4 Vette Servo/Shift
ok i guess i should rephrase my questions. With my actual problems aside and say i have the money for this, will those parts add up. For example the vortec heads, and intake. I just need to know if those will all work togethor without any modification. also, will that lt4 cam work or will i need to mill the heads
ive been throwin stock parts at my car for years. all i get is the same results and i never get anywhere to what i want the car to be performance wise.
thanks
ive been throwin stock parts at my car for years. all i get is the same results and i never get anywhere to what i want the car to be performance wise.
thanks
Supreme Member
iTrader: (2)
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,962
Likes: 5
From: Moorestown, NJ
Car: 88 Camaro SC
Engine: SFI'd 350
Transmission: TKO 500
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt w/ 3.23's
I think the LT4 hot cam has quite a bit of lift no matter what rockers its used with. Youll probably have to have the valve guides milled down on the vortecs, in addition to good springs and such. Another good cam that I personally like is the ZZ4 cam. With the specs it has it looks like it might be easier to use with an efi system, although it too has alot of lift so youll need to take that into consideration when you set up the valvetrain. If you didnt want to mill the heads then youd have to use a much milder cam, and even then youd have to check clearences to make sure the retainer doesnt crash into the guide or crush whatever seals your using.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
From: Georgia
Car: 88 Firebird
Engine: 350 LO5 TBI
Transmission: 700R4 Vette Servo/Shift
so vortecs dont seem to support a powerful cam setup. seems if thats the case i may as well spend extra for a better set of heads and get a non-vortec intake (cheaper) and save the money from havin to mill the heads. i can get some alum vortec heads for bout 600 new. plus a couple hundred to have them milled to fit a decent cam. your talkin close to $1000 if not more when all is said and done. so it seems to me i may as well just get nicer heads that will work with a more powerful cam. AFR? what are my options now, because im looking for power and want to avoid any machine work
Member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 262
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From: Louisiana
Car: 1991 Camaro RS
Engine: Briggs & Straton
Transmission: Centrifical Clutch
AFR heads are AWESOME but farrrrr from cheap. The complete AFR heads will run you anywhere from $1600-2000 depending on what you want.
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Supreme Member
iTrader: (2)
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,962
Likes: 5
From: Moorestown, NJ
Car: 88 Camaro SC
Engine: SFI'd 350
Transmission: TKO 500
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt w/ 3.23's
Before we get too much farther, are you planning on running a 383? Have any plans to make mods to the computer to support a high revving motor. FWIW, the stock ecm really isnt set up to work with a high revving, high output engine. Id probably say dont go much over 5000 rpm since your off the main tables by 3600 rpm. With that in mind, what kind of cam do you have in mind? The cam and displacement will dictate what heads youll be able to run.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
From: Georgia
Car: 88 Firebird
Engine: 350 LO5 TBI
Transmission: 700R4 Vette Servo/Shift
im not too worried about idle but i dont want a monster cam that shakes the heck outa my car. Just somethin with a good amount of power. I originally thought about either the zz4 or lt4 hotcam. Any other suggestions. $1600 for AFR is outa my league. Any other heads thatll support a pretty powerful cam? (for a reasonable price)
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 13,777
Likes: 567
From: Cincinnati, OH
Car: '90 RS
Engine: 377 LSX
Transmission: Magnum T56
Originally posted by Avenger007
im not too worried about idle but i dont want a monster cam that shakes the heck outa my car. Just somethin with a good amount of power. I originally thought about either the zz4 or lt4 hotcam. Any other suggestions. $1600 for AFR is outa my league. Any other heads thatll support a pretty powerful cam? (for a reasonable price)
im not too worried about idle but i dont want a monster cam that shakes the heck outa my car. Just somethin with a good amount of power. I originally thought about either the zz4 or lt4 hotcam. Any other suggestions. $1600 for AFR is outa my league. Any other heads thatll support a pretty powerful cam? (for a reasonable price)
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 267
Likes: 0
From: Georgia
Car: 88 Firebird
Engine: 350 LO5 TBI
Transmission: 700R4 Vette Servo/Shift
i found that my headers are really the only thing "needed" right now since i had a friend of mine replace my valve seals in his shop. If vortecs will support the power then I'll certainly pay the difference to have them machined. an aluminum set can be had for around $550 plus a couple hundred for the cam. thats reasonably within my budget. So do you all prefer the LT4 or ZZ4 as far as power and what do they require? I thought I heard someone mention using Z28 springs...
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