Alright, right now i have a 92 z28 with a 355. Nothing really done other than a flowmaster muffler. I'm runnin just a tad slower than an lt1 right now. So my question is: after i add my parts that are laying around could i run with an LS1?? ok heres my parts: gears now are 2.73's upping to 3.42's, hooker headers, 3" catless exhaust, port and polished and powder coated intake manifold, AFPR, ZZ4 cam, heads (maybe camelbacks or prevortecs), custom burnt JET chip? I think thats all the stuff. So if i'm runnin almost next to an LT1 now, how will this match to an LS1 afterwards?? Thanks

 

My 87 has slp 1 3/4 headers, no cat, flow cat back, free mods and an ads chip. My brother in law has an 01 6-speed T/A and from a dead stop I can stay ahead of him to about 55 mph, then he just goes creeping by and i keep losing ground. I'd say I'm a good 2 cars or so back at about 90 mph. I can beat stock lt1 cars now so I don't know how you will do after mods.

 

someones got to know or at least have an idea.....

 

at least 100 HP of nitrous.... no other way you're going to get a TPI, that chokes a 305, to run with a car that has an intake that flows....

Your L98 car came from the factory with 230 HP or thereabouts. LS1s come from the factory with 375 HP or more. You do the math.

 

100 shot?? I'd say an average stock ls1 will trap 105 mph. I dont see why 100 or more mph is not attainable with the mods listed. I personally remember having stock TPI, heads, headers, and running right next to an LS1 ram air up to 100 mph or so. It was creeping up on me but not bad. Most of the LS1s seem to make more mph for their 1/4 mile time and the opposite for TPIs. So, basically race from a stop and you will do fine.

 

The average LS1 will put about 310 HP to the rear wheels, and about 330 ft-lbs. The average stock L98 will put about 190 to the rear wheels, and about the same torque. Now do that math.

Headers and a powder-coated intake and a carb cam aren't going to give a L98 145 HP.

The idea of a stock L98 "hanging with" a LS1 is ludicrous.

 

did you read the post even?

 

A stock L98 runs about 14.6 or so. Let's say you get ¾ sec out of headers and powder-coating the intake and a set of gears and an of-the-shelf chip. That's a bit generous IMO, but not out of the question.

A stock LS1 runs very close to 13 flat. Let's say it's an automatic with a stock converter and has an less experienced driver, and so it runs 13.2.

The L98 car will be running a 13.9; the LS1 will be running 13.2. How can anybody kid themselves into thinking that's "hanging with" it?

 

Your going to need a lot to out muscle the LS1's top end, cam/heads - LTR. Remember, if you can't beat it, join it!

 

The zz4 is no more aggressive than the stock LS1 cam. And the stock LS1 heads way outflow the stock L98 heads. The LS1 also has almost a full point more compression ratio.

Port your heads to at least come close to the LS1 head flow and use a cam with at least 218 degrees of duration at .050 to make up for the head flow disadvantage and you should at least have the ability to hang. Then do something about the stock TPI runners. The just use a 50 shot to seal the deal.

 

Read my sig. I blow LS1's away (in stock trim).
Just ask the guy that chose me off at Fontana. ('99 LS1)

 

 

A friend of mine has a 01 Trans Am ram air, with headers and catless exhaust, K&N air filter, a Mass Air flow sensor and underdrive pulleys, he had 344hp at the wheels, dynoed. Thats standing still on the dyno stand without the ram air helping.

 

Do you want to run with them from a stop or at speed? From a stop, it looks like with your next mods you will be running with them well. From what I know, If you have an intake, that cam, and some form of decent heads then you will be alright.. Your best bet is just to go to the strip and see what you run. I'm sure you will take one out of the hole with the mods, but I dunno about top end.

There are some ls1s that dyno less than 300rwhp. This is highly uncommon. There are others that claim they dyno 325-330rwhp stock.. I doubt it but anythings possible. That being said, I put down 315rwhp with a lid so I'm guessing I was right around 310 stock. With a cam, headers, catback and tuning, those numbers went to 370rwhp/358rwtq. I ran 13.1@109 with a lid and lcas and and hoping to run 12.6-7s @ 114 with the new mods..

If you are almost equal to an lt1 now you shouldn't be far behind an ls1. Remember both an lt1 and l98 are better off the line than an ls1, so you better make the most of that.. I'm sure you know, but when us ls1s get moving and into 3rd, we bring the thunder so watch out

 

You will never touch the almighty LS1 without some heavy Mods...sad but true.....

 

Thats funny...I watch stock 4rth gens running 12's at the track all the time....and it doesnt take much to put them in the 11's...just because you can beat a car ..most likely a poorly tuned car, doesnt put you in the same class...We have to be real about our thinking, otherwise we will never reach our goals!

You might run with the LT1's but the new LS1...Naw...

 

here is what a cam and a little spray will do for a street driven LS1

 

mtx28 said it best, watch out when they hit 3rd. This is my brothers 3rd ls1 car and I've driven all three several times. We've also raced several times and it is always the same, so go from a stop and get a good launch. Then watch him drive by you at about the top of your second gear ( with 3.27's or there abouts )

 

I have a 6 speed lt1 and have beat 5 ls1 cars. I used et streets and a cat back. It's all in the traction. You will definitely need tires.

 

Don ran that 13.2 with only 103mph, and he's got a good amount of power left because he's using the crappy stock intake ducting. I frequently see LS1s running slower than that with more mph. And I don't see how a 3 year old basically stock car is going to be in very bad tune. Maybe their tuned badly from the factory, eh?

As far as running with an LS1, it could happen. It depends more on how well you match things and drive than exactly what conditions you're under. Porting the heads, plenum and runners(aftermarket) would be of much benefit.

They're right about 3rd gear. LS1s keep pushing forward and tpi cars die out. Get a good launch(see that 1.8 60'?), and you may be able to outdistance them at first to make up for it.

 

I don't mean to flame.. but how is a 13.2 'blowing away' an ls1? unless you've got retarded monkeys in your area buying 4th gens and running 14sec et's, you're in for a suprise when a good driver gets ahold of you.

 

Some ppl here are tryin to make it sound like i stated i was gonna run with every LS1 and beat all 4th's imaginable.....i was simply askin if i could hang with a stock ls1. around here there aren't much for cars, a couple ls1's and i know they are all stock around here. I'm a senior in highschool with a part time job. these mods are just what i have so far from saving and buyin over the winter. i wanna eventually get my car in the 11's but i'm sure that won't happen for years. I just wanna make sure i'm on the right track here.

 

Well.. with the mods you're planning to get, you are on the right track for sure

 

I have no doubt it can be done given the right conditions..right driver...right everything. But consistantly, no. Put these cars on the dyno ..who makes more power..I'm talking motors here...No flames intended here..My 60' time with the 94 LT1 T56..was one time at the track..40* and no-one was getting traction..second gear was all over the place....Of course you can mod a 350 to run with LS1's..I hope to do it with my 327....Ive beat Mustangs at the light with my 96 Cutlass.V-6...that doesnt mean I can run with 5.0's...
Im outa this one..

 

wrong post...sorry

 

I have a 98 Z28 and a 88 GTA...there's NO comparison, and I have everything you listed (except Headers, and I have an under-drive pulley too for the GTA. The GTA could NEVER keep up!

 

hey guys


The only third gen that i think could hang with a ls1 or possibly out run a ls1's is a Turbo trans am

bigger turbo, injectors, bigger intercooller, and lots of boost. with some drag radials.



I used to own a 87 buick GN i had a upgraded turbo injectors and run 20 psi of boost on pump gas with traction i could stay out front till the ls1's got to churning in 3rd gear and it was over.

a ls1 has some killer top end power

 

I've killed several LS-1 F-body's and 2 C5's (all or most had the bolt-ons). Even more fun to pick on with my new combo.

Dont powder coat the intake: powder coat retains heat!

Do LT headers, good y-pipe (like mufflex)

You will need semi-siamesed runners (more top-end power)

Yank or Precision 3000 stall converter

And some traction

WIth that, you can give a STOCK LS-1 car a damn good run for it's money, I did all day long with the stock motor (350), bolt-ons, LT headers, and a converter. With the new motor and 6-speed, it's just that much more fun!

Cheers!

 

If the intake is aluminum, leave it bare.. it will get rid of heat better bare than any paint will.

 

TPI cars are strong up to about 70 or so after that its all over but the cryin...

LS1's are strong to 70 but killer above

i raced a 2001 WS6 6 speed and pulled his @ss like a mother to about 65 then it was like "uhhh weres he at?"


my dads "stripper" ls1 t-56 ran a 12.8 with street tires..factory down to the paper filter...and that was with a 2.26 60 ft

it weighs 3100 with him and a full tank

your best bet is to get out of the hole HARD and pull his @ss...make him miss a shift tryin to catch you..

 

Yep, These forth Gens dont like to bite on the launch..stock. Even with the 3.42's and posi! (see sig)

 

I can pull a stock LS1 6 speed through the 1/4, but they gain ground the entire way after the 1/8th, and trap higher.

Mods are

Fresh 355 block, 9.8:1 compression
Production LT4 cam
Stock heads with appropriate valvesprings
SLP runners
Hedman shorty headers and Y pipe
3" exhaust 3" cat, with cutout
Ported plenum and portmatched stock lower
Fully built 4l60, 2400 lockup converter
3.73 torsen rearend
Lakewood LCA's
BFG 255-50-16 DR's.

It's all in the holeshot. I run at 5800 feet elevation, and tend to et in the low 14's (14.2, etc around 94-95 mph. LS1 cars STOCK on stock tire sit in the middle 14's with 96-97 mph traps at altitude.)

If an LS1 has tire, even with next to nothing else in the way of mods, I'm probably smoked.

But thats what the 200 shot is for.

So will a mild 355 with only engine mods pull on LS1 cars? With a stock tpi on top? Probably not.

 

LS1's Run High 12's here in Ne...better air I guess..

 

My 98 ran a 13.37 BONE stock...it probably is the air( I'm in MO). I am currently running a 12.7 with a lid, cut out, free-mods and under-drive pulley. I don't know, I just think it would take more than bolt ons (without NOS or S/C) to run a mid 13.

 

I pick on LS-1 cars all day long when I'm in my Z.
LS-1 cars down here are running 13.0's with a lid and catback. Now, since MTI is down here, there are ALOT of 10 second LS-1s running arround. Those are the ones that I'm gonna need the Procharger for, but never fear it will be on the way shortly!

 

For some reason, I mis-understood the thread, and thought you wanted to stay with the stock heads and cam....yeah, so I'm retarded! I think you could run with an LS1 with those mods up to 80-90mph, but after that the LS1 just has too much up top for the tpi intake set up to keep up.

 

I didn't read the whole post, so I hope I don't repeat anything.

The LS1 is a large step ahead of the first gen sbc in terms of technology, they come with excellent flowing heads, decent sized cam, and a great intake. They've been known to trap anywhere from 105-109 trap speeds. For those who aren't used to drag racing, trap speeds are the major factor in winning street races and many times 1/4 races. Trap speed for the most part determines what your car is capable of.

Now the LS1s are putting minor bolt ons and running 109-112 trap speeds. To prove my point above, check GM High Techs recent issue, where TPI Magnum runs 11.96 at 112 or so. In otherwords, if the LS1 hooks it probably close to high 11's - low 12's. That's bolt on LS1s.

Cam/Head packages have been putting over 400 to the rear, and many added shots of 125 and so forth on top of that. So while you may be able to build a mild engine to beat a stock LS1... your still along ways aways from saying you can kill the almighty LS1.

And Dyno Don, no offense, you having a first gen that runs 8's you should know drag very well. But by no means is running a 13.2 blowing LS1s away, especially with a 102 trap speed.

 

Very well said...:hail: :hail: :hail: