I hear bad things about the ethanol. I have always used Mobil 93.


But just curious if the 94 octane at sonoco would be bad for the motor?

 

If it has ethanol, I wouldn't run it. I understand it decreases fuel mileage and power. I never buy it just out of principle, it seems like the oil companies are cheating us.

 

what?? heres a story, i used to use mobile 93 octane all the time in my camaro 305 4bbl, i took a trip to ohio one time, all they had were sunoco gas stations, so i said damn i'll put in the 94 octane just in case it sucks, well what a damn difference i felt in that car with that 94 octane, and thats all that goes in my camaro all the time.

 

IF it has ethanol, I wouldn't buy it. Whether all Sunoco 94 has ethanol is a good question.

Now here's a question 86Z: how much compression is your 305 4bbl running? If it's stock you should run 87 octane. I venture to say your "power gain" was a mental thing, sort of like a placebo drug. No offense meant here.

 

No It won't hurt your motor.

there are many additives in gasoline.
The ethanol content of Sunoco 94 is 10%
Ethanol is not methanol.
Will not void your warranty.

It is the prefered high performance street fuel over here on the C- side.

It makes a little more power and is a lot more detonation resistant than other brands.

Ethanol is a high performance high octane fuel.
Ethanol makes more horsepower power than gasoline.

Ethanol makes a great fuel additive.

There is an old saying among racers: Alcohol's 'fur Racin'
gasoline's fur washin' parts.

Ethanol enhanced fuels polute the air less.


Ethanol is a natural fuel Antifreeze too so you won't have to add
gasoline antifreeze (methlhydrate) on those cold Buffalo mornings.

Its a clean(er) burning gasoline too.

 

Increased octane is no reason to want ethanol in a streetcar. If the car is stock, it needs and runs best on the minimum octane requirement. Additional octane hurts power if your car doesn't need it. Ethanol has less energy (calories) than gas and that means fewer miles per gallon.

Ethanol also tends to loosen fuel deposits in the system and clog filters.

The mileage thing is probably not that noticeable, and neither is the power, but it's still an issue.

It is cleaner and helps corn farmers, if that's what you're into. I admit, I have bought ethanol gas for my leased trailblazer and didn't notice the difference, though I wasn't street racing the trailblazer.

 

Too bad you don't have any experience with Sunoco 94.
You would have a different opinion.

Your wrong on every account.

The higer octance of ethanol, infact most modern octane enhancers do no slow down the burn rate of the gasoline.

Its just less likely to explode. The burn rate of Sunoco gas is infact fast.

Most motors don't need more than 34 deg to reach full power.

I've tested it back to back against other fuels. its more powerfull.

I agree over time Sunoco gas will tend to remove some of the combustion deposits in your motor left by some other fuels.
Your sparkplugs will last longer.


These deposits tend to cause hot spots and preigition.

Getting rid of them is a plus.

Ethanol and Methanol both will produce more horsepower in a motor. About 6 and 10% respectively. and lots more midrange torque. Even more if you optimize compression.

Alcohol fuels allow the motor to be more volumetricly efficient
Cooling effect.

Alcohol fuel is safer than gasoline.

The engine always makes more power on alcohol than gasoline.

You will burn more fuel with straight Ethanol. The airfuel ratio is about 9:1. But this is not straight Ethanol.

The gas mileage of Sunoco is the same.

There is no downside with this Product.

If you ever had a chance to race a motor on alcohol vs gasoline
you'd change your tune.

This gasoline has more going for it than just the fact that is it higher octane. It's ethanol content is only one factor. it is also a
low sulfur fuel. Better grade base fuel.
It will make a little more horsepower in your car even if you dont need the extra octane.

the octane rating of this gasoline is only one reason to use it.

Running a higher octane gas than your motor requires to avoid spark knock will not harm it. Its just a waste of money cause it does cost more. Yes under normal street driveing back and forth to work/school its not nessessary on most low compression motors.
But if you're going to race your car or boat or bike etc the extra performance and octane insurance is well worth it.

Engine rebuilds cost money.

 

my 305 is the H.O version 88 roller, so i believe it's 9.5:1 ? and i did notice a difference, i dont do drugs and i'm not mental, if someone borrows one of my cars i know when they put 87 octane in it....

 

sunoco still has pump stations i only see them at the tracks out here

 

Fbird...do you own a sunoco station? you advertise like you do.

So you say you can feel a diff between sunoco 94 and say Speedway 92(it has ethanol too)? How can that be if they both have ethanol? Is Sunoco "magic?" Does your car have 11:1 CR and need premium?

I don't know why people insist on premium fuel in a car that doesn't need it , it slows you down! Higher octane burns slower. If you have high compression or your car calls for premium, then run it. Otherwise, don't waste your money. I run premium in my Z cause I have 10:1 CR and iron heads.

You say you burn more fuel with ethanol....hmmm. How can a gasoline with 10% ethanol return the same mileage as straight gas? Makes no sense.

I also didn't say remove combustion deposits, I said deposits in your fuel system (tank, lines, etc.). This can clog filters.

you say I'd change tune if i raced a car on alcohol. Well I bet my race car wouldn't have 9:1 CR and drive on the street. Your street car wouldn't run on straight alcohol. Sure a 15:1 sprint car motor makes good power on alcohol but they are a far cry from yours and my V8s.

 

I use Sunoco 94 exclusively in my 800 hp supercharged engine. No problems here.

The main concern with the alcohol in gasoline is it's corrosiveness and tendencies to deteriorate fuel system components, but only when it's present in high percentages. Since there is a 10% limit of alcohol in any gasoline (at least here in MI, and most other states) that is bought at the pump, this normally isn't a problem.

 

I didn't say I felt a difference. I said I measured a actual slight performance gain going from 93 octane Pioneer and 93 octane Esso to Sunoco 94. I don't go by feel or opinion. I go by what gives results. I have test equipment that is capable of measureing small increases or decreases in horsepower.
I test and make changes and repeat the test to reduce variables.
I go with what works.


Sunoco or any other ethanol enhanced fuel will not clog your fuel system or create deposits. You have it backwards.
Actually Shell had a big problem with Fuel system deposit build up. Some fuel additive they were using caused it.
they actual got sued by some people over it. They had to change their formula.

Yes even a 9:1 motor will produce more horsepower on Alcohol
than on gasoline. But really picks up at higher compression ratios.

Yes, the calories are less (heat content) But the fact that it carries its own oxygen and the cooling effect on the intake charge makeing the charge more dense increases net volumetric efficiently.
the overall effect is a gain in horsepower from gasoline.

There are many additives in gasoline. Ethanol only makes up 10% of Sunoco. Some gasolines have up to 30% tolene in it.
As an oxyegnated additive it is a relatively small part of the total.

Your assuming just cause its got 10% ethanol it has to be worse on mileage. Not true. You assume just because its higher octane it has a slower burn rate and will reduce power. Again not true.
It has a fast burn rate.

I recommend it cause it works. You seem to have something against stuff that works. Would rather depend on hocus pocus
rumour, quick assumptions and folk lore.

Ya need to get your facts straight.

 

"Ethanol is an alcohol that has very clean-burning characteristics. It also absorbs water and will scour out any dirt or impurities present and deposit them downstream into the fuel filter plugging it up very quickly.
The use of Ethanol will require the frequent replacement of fuel filters. In addition you may experience a drop in fuel mileage due to Ethanol's lower energy content. The mixture changes caused by blending Ethanol is somewhat self-compensated by most fuel injection systems, however carbureted cars may require some adjustments or jetting changes to maintain performance. "


Here is a quote from a Rennsport Porsche site. Funny, it says exactly what I did.

You say you have test equipment that measures increases and decreases in power. Would this be a dyno? I don't know how else you would measure power gains. Do you have one? If so, show us some results.

You say I have an aversion to things that work, well that's a broad statement. I have an aversion to gasohol.

You also say that Sunoco 94 burns "fast." In respect to what?
It doesn't burn as "fast" as 87 octane. That's what octane desribes, the compression point at which a fuel burns.

Show me results form your "test equipment that is capable of measureing small increases or decreases in horsepower. "

Truth is, I doubt I would notice any performance gain or loss by running Sunoco 94 Vs. Amoco 93. I doubt anyone else would either, unless they have, "test equipment that is capable of measureing small increases or decreases in horsepower."

Now that I think of all the times I have filled my gas guzzling Z, I probably have used Sunoco 94 w/o even thinking about it. Maybe I ought to change that fuel filter.

 

AAgain opinion and theories based on quick assumptions.

All false.

It will not clog your fuel system it does not reduce your gas mileage. it does not require rejetting your carb ( unless your carb was off to start with )
It does not burn slower.

Octane does not discribe the compression point that fuel burns.
I discribles the reference knock value to a standard test fuel that has the same knock limit in a standardized test motor under a standardized test condition.

When an engine knocks the fuel self ignites and explodes indtead of burning in a smooth controled fashion, causeing a repid pressure spike and leads to preigniton cause by the over heating of the combustion chamber.

The burn rate has nothing to do with the octane quality.
It is the unfortanate result of some old school octane enhancers.
Like lead.

A fast burn rate is more desirable in a better high octane fuel.
the fast er the burn rate the less ignition timing needed to make the same power. Less time for detonation. Higher performace at high rpm.

Forget the slow burning S&^**t.... thats for Av gas. Low rpm motors.

I use a Vericom extensively to test for performance gains on the car. it is not a toy like a G-tech. It shows in a hurry what works and what doesn't work.
it is an very accurate tool for showing prformance gains and losses, even small ones. Will show you stuff you won't see on a Dyno or chassis dyno or a drag time slip.

Have shaved more time off the timeslips of different cars over the years with this than any other tool.
One of the consistant gains found was useing Sunoco 94 over other brands of Gas.
Its higher octane is only one reason.

We have done may dyno tests directly testing alcohol against gasoline.
And have compared the performance difference of the two fuels in other cars at the track.

You don't have a clue what you're talking about.

 

Nothing I said is untrue. You're not worth trying to convince.

It will clog your fuel filter because it LOOSENS existing deposits in your system, that's like the 3rd time I've said this to you but you can't seem to understand.

Your description of octane is exactly what mine was. You say knock resistance, I say compression point. Technically it's a knock value, but what causes knock? Too much compression for the gas you have! It's the same damn thing! If the gas you are using cannot handle the compression your engine has, it will knock! You are just picking arguments.

When you say fast burn rate, do you mean Sunoco 94 burns at a lower compression point than other premiums? If so, then you are completely full of crap.

When I say higher octane burns slower, I mean it ignites at a higher compression point. You are wrong.

You think your "Vericom" gives you credibility and that anyone else doesn't know what they are talking about. Wrong again.

Everything you have said to me is opinion based on assumptions, even if you have a "vericom." You seem to think the Sunoco 94 defies the laws of chemistry. Show me proof.

 

just because you dun have high compression doesnt mean you cant benifit form premium.....with carb espesially you can advance you timing a few degrees you can feel a difference/....lol....my testing methods may be primitive but when i run premium and advance my timing my burnouts are allways like 10+ ft longer

 

i luv Sunoco i try to only get gas from them, my car just feels like it runs better on sunoco gas.

 

I run my car on sunoco 94 and nothing but it, well ecput if i had the chance to use sunoco 100 but thats 4.75 a gallon.

ive used Moble, exxon and raceway (not the track) gasoline and ya know what i love the sunoco my car runs better then with the other stuff.

the only way i see your fuel system gettin clog is if u have dirt, rust or something else in the tank and from fuel moving around, knocking it loose. then that will go thru ur fuel system and clog ur filter.

 

Well here's something that a friend of mine who works on outboard 2 cycle engines told me. He said that you should never run gasoline that contains ethanol in your 2 cycle motors because the residual sugar that remains in the corn liquor (which, of course is what ethanol is) after its processed will gum up the rings, causing them to stick. He said he has repaired countless 2 cycles with "sugared-up" rings. There is even a fuel additive for these engines to help prevent this. Now, I know that we have 4 cycle motors in our cars, and we don't pull fuel through the crank case like 2 strokers do therefore I don't know if this proves anything relevant to us. I just thought it might be worth mentioning, ya know, food for thought.

 

Yes the Vericom has credibility. It works.
It's even used in insurane and law inforcement and in Courts of Law in N/A.

None of your statements do, Cause they are not true.

Not even the consistant view of the back of my car against yours in a race would convince you.

It does not defy the laws of of chemistry. But you deny reality.

If in reality there was a problem with Sunoco gas clogging fuel systems there would be others boning in here by now to say so.

I tested it extensively to see if it was in fact worth useing.
cause it does cost more. And I'm a hard sell.
But, what works repeatably to give a performance edge
gets added to my quiver and recommended to others that ask.

It is worth the extra money. If maximum performance is what you're after.

Some performance engine builders will not warranty your pump gas motor unless you use this fuel exclusively.
Some sports car racing bodys use it exclusively.

If you have a bunch of skum build up in your fuel system like what happened to Shell Formula a few years ago don't blame other fuels.

blame the fuel company ya bought it from.

Never heard of any one haveing a problem with this fuel.

Your understanding of compression, "compression point" octane and burn rate
knock tolerance and autoignition point and how motors run in the real world, is poor.

 

I am not denying reality, I am trying to present it to you.

I'm through arguing with you, you repeat the same mantra over and over. Have fun wasting your money.