Like say for instance if I was to build a 502 that was able to run on pump gas. Not to big of a cam or to wild in the heads. a 750 cfm or so carb, full exhaust with dual cats, but no EGR system. Now if done properly it should run farely clean. So here is the question then. If I would take this car in for testing, could I lean out the carb and adjuts timing to get it to pass an exhaust sniffer? What would it take to get a engine like this to pass????? Or is this dumb to even think of building a street rod with a 502 in a emission area. Which Columbus isn't but I sure it will be some day soon.

 

With the right parts and proper tuning, you can get anything to pass. Larger engines just pump out more junk, so you will have problems with HC and NOx. A properly tuned carb is going to be a must on that setup, and pray the cats can take care of the rest. IMO EGR does little, and I have passed quite a few cars without it. The cat is the most effective device on a car, and will remain that way as long as you dont drown it in fuel.

 

My experiences and opinions are much the same as madmax's. It depends on the nature of the "test"; in some places they actually look at part numbers, which would pretty much rule out a 502 in any car that didn't come with one. However, if all they do s hook up a sniffer at idle, then it should be easy to pass that. My 400 with a Comp XR282HR cam and a Holley 6211 carb passes TN specs, which require that the car meet the OE specs at idle. No visual, no dyno. Piece of cake with functional AIR and a CAT. EGR has no effect on HC or CO emissions, only NOx, and only a marginal effect at that; if you don't have a check where they actually test it for function, it probably won't affedt your ability to pass.

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"So many Mustangs, so little time..."
ICON Motorsports

 

You shouldn't have to worry about EGR with an idle emissions test, since the EGR is closed at idle anyway on cars equipped as such. Good luck.

 

move out of franklin county and you won't have to worry about it i've read of people running most of the fuel out of the car and dumping a bunch of dry gas in to pass the sniffer. playing with a/f, timing will help, plus running a cat. sad to say i don't even know what the requirements are in ohio, we don't have e check in jackson county.

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ICON Motorsports

1st & 3rd

 

Coleman lantern fuel. Its white gas and burns much cleaner. Drygas is alcohol and requires 2x more in jetting to keep it from going lean.

 

OK there are no requirements around here that I know of.
This is just something I am wondering about. I want BIG HP numbers which are capable of passing and I dont want it to be so damn expensive as dealing with TPI. I mean I love my TPI for what it is, but a 502 will obviously not be for the every day drive, Who could afford that? Though I want to be able to register it so I can drive it when the weather is nice. Which means in the future, which will eventually happen ion every state, All cars being register or re registered will need to pass emissions test. So When I embark on my awe inspirering Project 86 Trans Am (some day I hope it turnsd out like that ) I am planning for the future the whole way. Besides I hate trailor queens, why buy it if you dont enjoy it. Right?

 

Check into the new RamJet 502, just the thought of that beast under my hood gives me a hard o.... !

 

Where can I find all the specs on the Ram Jet 502? Also what is the cost?

 

You can do a search for Ram Jet 502 on www.yahoo.com and find several dealers that carry or will soon be stocking it. The bad news is I'd say the price is over 7 or 8K since it's a complete port fuel injected BBC. The HP and TQ ratings are both over 500, if I remember correctly. But you'll definitely get better fuel mileage outta this one than most other BB setups.

 

Whos worried about MPG on a car with a 502? I could give a crap less if it got 8mpg or 28. Granted it would be nice to get 28 mpg, but its not like I am going to drive this car everyday so its not a factor, just being able to pass emissions.

 

a motor that is in perfect tune, should pass.

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SUPERCHARGED 87 GTA: Blk/Gld w/Superam, 355cid Trickflows, forged pistons 9.5:1. Auto 2,600 stall, 3.45 9 bolt disc, Best time & mph (Naturally Aspirated): 13.567 @ 101.900 w/ a poor 60ft. Best mph: 104.3 *This car is 100% NYS emissions legal, w/ all emissions controls!* "If you want to have a fast car, hang out w/ those who do!"
http:// www.community.webtv.net/munks87/JustinsGTApage.com
VORTECH S-TRIM, INSTALLATION IN PROGRESS: 10 & 15 LB> PULLEYS, CUSTOM HKS RACE BYPASS, CUSTOM DUCTING W/ COLD AIR, SWAPPING TO SERPENTINE, & MANY EXTRAS! BEST TIME: 11'S I GUESS. WE'LL SEE IN SPRING!

 

Thats what I was thinking, but I wonder if it would help to run lean for an emissions test

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86 Trans Am 355 TPI Rebuilt 700R4 with Corvette servo, modified valve body, and a B&M Torque Converter (2000 rpm stall w/ lock up), 87 350 block bored .30 with new crank. Reworked 305 heads with 3-angle valve job. Added in the rebuild was an SLP TPI cam, BBK 58mm Throttle Body,MSD 6A, Hypertech Power Coil, 1.5 Crane roller tipped rocker arms, SLP Intake Runners and Port matching in upper intake including fully ported plenum, TPIS adjustable fuel pressure regulator @ 46psi, Hooker shorty style headers w/ Thermotech heat wrapping, Custom 3” exhaust with Flowmaster muffler and chrome quad tips, Hypertech Thermomaster Computer chip, K&N open element cone filter on modified MAF per TPIS specs, MSD Wires, removal of A/C hardware and added a 1LE firewall cover installed. Also there has been a PST front suspension kit with Hotchkis strut tower brace added. Soon to have Intrax lowering springs.
http://geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Garage/9548/kyle.html

Kills:
95 Talon TSI, 96 Probe GT, 91 T/A L98, 89 RS, 86 Mustang GT, 88 Mustang LX 5.0, 92 Thunderbird V8. couple or ricers that I think were Civics or Preludes not sure what year, 95 Celica GT-S, 94 Chevy 1/4 ton 350, one of those NASCAR F150's

The Third Gen Will Never be Forgotten

 

Madmax is right on the money. Just having an engine tuned to the max won't convert hydrocarbons to harmless gases, which is what a Cat does. It's all about chemical conversion. As a rule of thumb, with an increase in cubic inches, you need a corresponding increase in converter surface area. For instance, a motorbike (yes, they are on those too) uses a very small converter, and a truck uses a big honker. If you put two converters, one on each bank, and designed for a 350, you may not get the job done.

 

Running lean will just cause NOX to go up

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SUPERCHARGED 87 GTA: Blk/Gld w/Superam, 355cid Trickflows, forged pistons 9.5:1. Auto 2,600 stall, 3.45 9 bolt disc, Best time & mph (Naturally Aspirated): 13.567 @ 101.900 w/ a poor 60ft. Best mph: 104.3 *This car is 100% NYS emissions legal, w/ all emissions controls!* "If you want to have a fast car, hang out w/ those who do!"
http:// www.community.webtv.net/munks87/JustinsGTApage.com
VORTECH S-TRIM, INSTALLATION IN PROGRESS: 10 & 15 LB> PULLEYS, CUSTOM HKS RACE BYPASS, CUSTOM DUCTING W/ COLD AIR, SWAPPING TO SERPENTINE, & MANY EXTRAS! BEST TIME: 11'S I GUESS. WE'LL SEE IN SPRING!

 

Kyle F - Uh, last time I checked an engine that consumes less fuel puts out less emissions with the same emissions equipment. The primary driving force behind the creation of EFI was the reduction of emissions it provides. All the other benefits of EFI such as improved driveability are just icing on the cake. For example, if your carbed 502 gets 10MPG and your FI 502 gets 15MPG with the same cats, the FI will produce less harmful emissions (NMHC, CO, NOx). Your easiest chance to pass emissions tests someday is with a properly tuned fuel injection system and some well matched cats to the 502. This is also expensive, so if you're not too worried about emissions in the near future then go with a carb.

 

I think I have read somewhere that running excessively lean will cause misfireing and actually cause emissions to go up. And that was the trend as I leaned out my car and had it retested a couple of times last year. before I just decided to pay the guys to make it pass.

 

That is correct. Most three-way catalysts are tweaked for reducing emissions at the stoichiometric air/fuel ratio.

 

Ah ok, so lean will not do it, but proper tuning will. Why do you think carbs are so bad? You know how EFI technology has gone up... well guess what so has the Carb Tech. Yea I might have to spray some cleaner in it every now and then and adjust the Choke(If it has one) but thats about it. Plus its alot easier to adjust a carbs Air/Fuel ratio that an EFI where you have to adhjust the pressure and then the timing again(which is a bitch) Then you miight have to go programa new chip. Like I said I love the TPI for what it is, but I don't think it will be on my forcasted 502 prodject until I hear I need to pass emissions to register.
When that Happens I think I will go with an Accel DFI and BB Super Ram set up. Thanks for the info guys.

 

the problem is they dont want somethign that runs "fairly" clean or "good" or"pretty good" they want close to perfection, at least where I live and our as-strict-as California levels as of Feb 1st. ****'s!

 

Well Im not in cali so I atleast get some help

 

our e-check in ohio is more than an idle speed test. They put your car on a set of rollers and run it at 35 miles and hour for like two minutes, the emissions are all measuered in % not in total volume. Hope this helps.

BTW: last time I took a car for e-check, they didn't even turn on the cooling fans that usually blow at the front of the car. If they do that with my formula, I'm gonna kick some *** ..

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1987 Formula 350, headman hedders, Accel supercoil, cap, rotor.
MAF screens removed. 160 degree stat and manual fan switch.

Best ET: 14.745@91.317mph-Stock
Best ET: 14.418@95.51 mph-Modded
Ridiculed Founder of the Traction Impaired Crew

 

Well it shouldn't hurt your car any to not have the cooling fans on. Though I wonder if it helps any

 

$7 or $8k for a Ramjet 502??? HEEEEEEEEEE, heeeeeeeeee. Try $9,500...

 

I like to dream !

 

Yea seriously I could build a Carbed 502 for around $6000 making around 500-550hp on pump gas and drive it everyday.