Corry

Well, maybe not that severe, but I have a bolt *FROZEN* into my fuel pressure regulator (those d*mned F*cking stupid @$$ tamper proof torx screws!!!!) Sorry, I get a little too emotional Anyways, I drilled out the tamper proof piece ouf them, then forced a T-15 bit into the heads, this worked well for all but one, it just stripped out. After throughly destroying the head, I tried forcing hex sockets around the bolt, still nothing, so I went to the home depot and bout a pair of vice grips. I set it so that the jaws were almost touching when closed, and clamed 'em down on the screw. I got maybe 1/4 of a turn, but now it just moves the jaws of the vice grips around. I need some help, this is my daily driver! If anyone has some tips on getting it out, please!!! Just remember fuel vapors are leaking out of this thing, and even if they weren't it's still too close to fuel lines to use any sort of heat trick, and I do not think WD-40 would be wise (and I have none, and I have already walked 2x to home depot today, and really don't want to make it 3x!!!)
Corry


------------------
Corry Lazarowitz
clazarow@voicenet.com
clazarowitz@hotmail.com
1987 Pontiac Trans AM (GTA?) 350 TPI
SLP 1 3/4" headers, 3" cat back (stock cat MSD ignition.
MSD Blaster SS coil.
3.73 Rear end gears
Accell 8.8 Wires
Bosh +4 Spark Plugs (Don't know if they really help but hell!)
Holley AFPR
Newly Self gutted cat!
More soon when funds are avail...

Vader

Corry,

Use plenty of penetrating oil. Soak the bolts thoroughly while you head back to a hardware store (not Home Desperation) and get some 6" Knipex pliers. They are self-gripping, and have jaws about as hard as a teenager in the morning. Get a good grip on the perimeter of the screw head and turn it in the normal direction to loosen it (anti-clockwise). If the penetrating oil has been soaking long enough, you should be successful. If not, and the screw heads are completely screwed, you'll be drilling and tapping for 6-32 screws. I'd recomment Allen cap screw as replacements instead of Torx.

------------------
Later,
Vader
------------------
"What a Day..."
Adobe Acrobat Reader

Corry

Thanks, Already bought the allen head replacents There was no way I was putting those *%^ "tamper proof" screws back in!!!
Unfortunatly, I have no penetrating oil, so I have to get some, also, Home Dep. is the only hardware store in walking distance here, and the only one of any good! We got Days Ace about 7 mi. away!

86TpiTransAm

What kind of "college educated idiot" at GM said "Hey, let's use Torx screws" anyway?? There are TOO MANY Torx screws on our cars and I honestly think it sucks!! It's kinda like what "college educated idiot" at GM decided "Hey, let's use standard AND metric bolts....that'll **** everyone off"!!

Sorry, it just bugs me!!

That said.... ummm....go with Vaders idea! Sounds good to me!

NavyVette

PB Blaster is the best stuff out there for penetration fluid. Having SAE and METRIC on the same motor really pisses me off too.

Jeff

eightTfourTA

iTrader: (3)

Another vote for the PB, that's what I had to use to get my manifold bolts undone. Stuff's great.


------------------
DR Stevens
1984 Trans Am 305HO L69
sucks gas, hauls ***
1991 Firebird 305 LO3
for days when I need a/c

Corry

Well again, home desporation being the only "hardware" store I could get to, they hadn't hear of knipex pliers, and the only penetrating oil they had was "Liquid Wrench" In a last ditch effort, I bought "Screw Extractors" (Reverse thread, tool steel "screws") Unfortunatly, they need some depth to get started, NP, just drill it a little, d*mned drill battery went dead, now I'm stuck up here waiting for a battery! Ugh, this has become the most frustrating job I have ever done! All because GM had to go and use "Tamper Proof" torx bits, normal torx bits I could have handled! The head probably would have never stripped but since I had to drill the stupid security tamper proof pin out of the center of the screw, ruining it for use w/ the t-10 bit, I had to force a t-15 in there, which didn't go very far in, then I tried again, didn't go to far, etc, the 3rd time I tried really getting it in, no use. Just got maybe 1/32" in there. Stripped the head. I am so pissed, now I will miss classes tomorrow, and well, lets just say EVERYthing is bigger in Texas so I like going to school, lotsa BIG mountains and valleys there! No bad mind get out of the gutter, no not down into the sewer!!!
Thanks for the help anyways, hopefully tomorrow, I'll be up and running.


------------------
Corry Lazarowitz
clazarow@voicenet.com
clazarowitz@hotmail.com
1987 Pontiac Trans AM (GTA?) 350 TPI
SLP 1 3/4" headers, 3" cat back (stock cat MSD ignition.
MSD Blaster SS coil.
3.73 Rear end gears
Accell 8.8 Wires
Bosh +4 Spark Plugs (Don't know if they really help but hell!)
Holley AFPR
Newly Self gutted cat!
More soon when funds are avail...

86TpiTransAm

Most people suggest using a small tap and a hammer to flatten that center (tamper proof) piece so you can still use the proper size Torx bit!!

Corry

Heh, oops, oh well, I tried drilling, still had about the same effect, It just cut some of the material, but mostly just bent it down! Hey, why couldn't Holley have provided the bit? I have never seen a place to buy those tamper proof bits! Would it kill them to tack on 1-2 dollars for the bit?! Sheesh!

dans82bird

drill the bolt out.

Enkil

Torx bits are great for automated processes, perhaps because they generally stick to the bit pretty well.

------------------
89 iroc-z 305 tbi
k&n filtercharger, open element air filter. nuffin' else

Vader

Corry,

Again, a real hardware store or supplier will have a full selection of Apex bits, including Robertson, clutch head, Pozidriv, Torx, hex, tri-part spanner, and whatever else you can think of. Unfortunately, Easter Sunday is not the best time to find those kinds of places open for business. I know how it sux to be stuck with no supplies during the "off-hours" like this.

If you have a drill and tap, you can clean off the existing bolt heads with a larger drill, spot new locations, drill and tap new holes for the can screws, and be on your way. Just be careful not to locate any of the new holes where fuel passages may exist. Some of the holes don't have a lot of lattitude.

I wouldn't suggest that five of the six screws might be adequate to hold the can in place, and I wouldn't want you to chance the fuel leak under the hood in the middle of the night. At least the flames would be visible sooner than during the daylight...

------------------
Later,
Vader
------------------
"What a Day..."
Adobe Acrobat Reader

Kevin Irving

I work on aircraft catapults in the Navy and with the amount of steam any of our fasteners are exposed to at any given time, especially on the flight deck, some bolts are bound to get frozen in place. Seems like it's only the ones we need to remove every so often are the ones that lock up, and the ones we need to stay in are the ones popping out with a plane hurtling down the flight deck at 160 mph.

We also live off of PB Blaster, sometimes it seems like we drink it when there's no time to run down to get a cold soda. Sometimes Blaster will work, other times we have to knock the head of the bolt off with a cold chisel, take off whatever it's holding down, and then grab the shank with a pipe wrench which gives a lot better grip and allows for greater leverege to get the thing out. Since most of our fasteners are allen head bolts, it can happen quite often. Each catapult has over 1,200 allen head bolts holding down just the deck plates that cover the cat, so you can imagine how many we have to remove that way. Granted, these are a lot bigger bolts than the ones on the FPR, but you get the idea.....

Now I'm off to get me a cold can of PB Blaster and an antisieze sandwich.... don't knock it until you've tried it!

------------------
Kevin Irving
85 Trans Am WS-6, 305 TPI, custom burned '86 PROM with '87 "165"ECM, Accel Supercoil & 8.8 Wires, MSD 6AL, Aluminum Driveshaft, Wonderbar, TB Coolant Bypass, Ported Plenum, Modified MAF, Syclone Fuel Pump, JET Airfoil

15.556 @ 86.65mph, Nov 10, 2000.... I know it sucks.. but it will get better!

http://www.geocities.com/transam85tpi/

Member - The Tidewater Trans Am Club, Norfolk VA http://www.geocities.com/ttacva/

Vader

AW-Right!

Another Never-Seeze junkie! And I though I was the last of a dying breed....

It's pretty good on pancakes, too. It makes pretty sparkles with all the metal particles floating suspended in the maple syrup.

------------------
Later,
Vader
------------------
"What a Day..."
Adobe Acrobat Reader

Corry

Wow, I got really lucky! That one last bolt came out, head destroyed, but the "Easy Out" reverse thread "screw" pulled the thing right out, I estimate (from the "hand Dyno" about 40 ft-lbs on that POS!!!! I can't believe that under that strain the thing didn't just break, but I was desperate, and my only other option would have been drilling, so who cared if I broke the thing even more right? I got it out, and then threw it about 200' in the direction that I had been facing...little piece of sh*t. I had planed on re-running some vac lines, throwing on the TB coolant bypass (Just because my hose from the TB->Intake manifold is too short and rotting anyways, re-setting minimum air, adjusting the TPS, and check my evap canister sine my gas tank also has the excessive hiss everyone complains about (I figured the canister is neglected, and I don't trust anything on the car except for the things I have already replaced!) I did a "quick and dirty: job on the minimum air, oly to have the ancient electrical pack connector break from extreme brittleness, so I tested the car w/ the thing just shoved in there, and forgot about it. Around 9:00pm I decided to try the TPS adjustment...but I only have a cheap analog meter, so it didn't work But I forgot about the IAC. So I went out to dinner, since I didn't feel like preparing myself anything after a day of stress, Car starts beautifully, first time since I have had the car that it did that!!!, anyways, eat my dinner, and continually forget about the IAC connector...Go back out, and the thing just won't start, I limp home holding gas and break at stop lights, play with the fuel pressure a little, and wiggle, the IAC a little, but it still looked in place, magically the car starts oh so nice again. I accellerace hard, (just to get a butt dyno reading, which was *quite* nice BTW) I have the T-Tops off, and start crusing (at 1:00 AM ) At the first stop light, it dies. Same thing gas and brake to keep going, still forgetting about the IAC, I figure I'll find a nice lit parking lot, that is open 24/7 so in case I need something....Walmart Get out and think, and then see the IAC not even in the holder...DUHHH, Did I feel dumb, so I went in and got some duct tape That got me home, guess I'm going out for a new connector tomorrow. The ride home was quite nice
Thanks for all your suggestions, I'll keep all these things in mind next time I have a frozen bolt (or before, I guess maybe I should pick up some of that PB blaster stuff tomorrow
Now to get those other things taken care of before the SWMG Dyno Day


------------------
Corry Lazarowitz
clazarow@voicenet.com
clazarowitz@hotmail.com
1987 Pontiac Trans AM (GTA?) 350 TPI
SLP 1 3/4" headers, 3" cat back (stock cat MSD ignition.
MSD Blaster SS coil.
3.73 Rear end gears
Accell 8.8 Wires
Bosh +4 Spark Plugs (Don't know if they really help but hell!)
Holley AFPR
Newly Self gutted cat!
More soon when funds are avail...

milhouse89

I got 3 frozen, stripped Torx bolts out of my TPI manifold using a bolt extractor socket that I bought at Harbor Freight, they worked great. The extractor set costs 24.99 and is part of the Pittsburgh Pro line. You might have to do some remolding of the Torx head but once you hammer it on it will work. The jury is still out on whether or not it will work on this frozen head bolt that I have.

milhouse89

They look good, I think would be the answer.

Vader

A little research would reveal the actual reasons many manufacturers have moved to Torx drives for fasteners. The ONLY negative is that they are not as readily available in the replacement market as other drive types. A proper Torx drive and fastener will sustain both higher continuous and peak moment drive force than a similarly sized hex recess (Allen head) fastener. If you ever fly anywhere you might be interested to understand that much of that airframe and the engines are fastened with Torx headed fasteners.

The largest problem with the system is people who service assemblies using Torx drives most often do NOT have the proper bits or sockets. Imported, third-world, look-alike tools are NOT Torx tools. They might fit in the recess or over the head, but they rarely fit properly. Genuine Torx® (Camcar) licensed tools don't have that problem. Domestic and imported wanna-bee tools are not quite the right size and drive lobe configuration (since that would be a patent licensing violation) and can allow damage. It's about as refined as using a screwdriver as a prybar. The cheap tools are what give the system a bad name. If you use Apex drivers you won't have that problem.

milhouse89

The problem is that no one wants to spend the money on genuine Torx bits, which I bet are expensive. They use whatever fits. Half of the Torx bolts on my intake manifold were stripped or partially stripped by the previous owner. I destroyed 3 of the bolts and finally got them out with a bolt extractor socket. An update on whether or not the bolt extractor worked on my frozen head bolt is, no, it did not work, both the bolt and the extractor are completely stripped now.

ploegi

Use a large drill bit, drill the head off the bolt, pull the head, then extract whats left.

rgauder

iTrader: (1)

ATF and Acetone have been proven to be one of the best products to help loosen stuck fasteners. The mixture beats PB Blaster in the tests.

GeneralDisorder

iTrader: (1)

If you want to play with penetrant like the big industrial boys in the paper mills and oil fields, you get "Yield" by Chemsearch out of CA. Unfortunately they only sell it by the case, and only ship to commercial addresses. It's about $165 for a case with shipping.

GD