Its an 89 Formula 350 i have 3.27 posi, LCA's shiftkit, edelbrock base ,ported plenum ,AS&M Runners ,Headers and catback, Cold Air setup, pulleys, AFPR (47 PSI). My best is a 14.030@98 with a 2.177 60". I have the stock chip still. (Fastchip made my car run like crap) and I'm jusr running Firehawk tires. I want to get into the 13.7 range. What am i missing?

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89 FORMULA 350
99 Grand Prix GT

well there are many things that could cause your car to not run what it should. the first big thing is that your 60 foot time is not to good. Do you have the SZ-50's or are they just regular fierhawk tires? What is your base timing at? What rpm do you launch at? try launching softer or harder and see what happens. I have found that if i launch soft i run consistant but i don't get the good times. This last weekend i found that my car was running 14.3's @ 96 mph but i have found the problem and it is running strong agian. It is funny what valve adjustment can do. I am not saying that valve adjustment is your problem it is most likley not the problem but it can make a huge differance. if i had all of your mods i would expect to run in the 13.3 to 13.4 range. also what pulleys did you get? tell me they are the power and amp pulley!! The overdrive alternator pulley does wonders for off idle torque. also how long did you have the fast chip in the car? it takes a while for the car to relearn and pick up after a chip swap.

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90 IROC l98
last season best corected 13.62 @102
mods
full exhaust, AFPR, pulley, jet stage 1 chip, billet servo, 52mm throttle body, slp runners and some 1.6 RR's and a few other little things.
243 RWHP and 342 RWTQ with hot engine and 90 octain fuel

Dude,

Borrow a scantool or otherwise find a way to get ALDL data during your runs. You may find the WOT fuel or spark curves (or both) need tuning. Easily fixable if you can read TRAXXION's article in the DIY_PROM forum and invest $100 or so in equipment.

Also...the 3.27 gearing is hurting you. I suspect you're running the stock torque converter. If so, the engine is running below it's peak power output range for quite a bit of your initial launch, and being yanked back below it during shifts.

You can probably pull a couple tenths off with PROM tuning, and that much again with 3.42 rear gearing and/or a higher-stall speed torque converter.

-Kevin

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1982 Z-28

See http://www.mycar.net/mafb/registry/detail.cfm?id=276 for details

You might be running too rich with 47 psi fuel pressure and the stock chip. I heard and from my own experience with a stock 88
chip, I was running rich with my pressure set at 46 psi and it killed me over 4200 rpm's.
Just a opinion.

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1987 Black Camaro IROC-Z (original owner) Replaced LB9 @ 86100 miles.
New 350 Crate engine
Balanced & blueprinted
WP 67cc Heads 9.6:1 C.R.
Cam: 450lift,216dur@50,110ls
TPI Induction(from 305)
22# Fuel Injectors
SLP Intake runners
New Computer chip
K&N filters & Air Foil ,
Hothkis STB
SLP 1 3/4 Headers
CATCO 3" Catalytic conv.
SLP 3" Cat Back Exhaust
700R4 Auto
SLP Torque Converter (2400 stall)
Limited Slip rear
245/45/ZR-17 Tires
17x8.5 ATI 5 Razze Wheels
EST. 340HP
380#/ft of Torque
NEW TOY!

What's your elevation? Did you correct your times? You may be in the 13's?

BTW, 14.0 is nothing to be disgruntled about without head and cam work.

i think you'd see a big improvement with slicks and anything else to cut the 60' times.

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ICON Motorsports
1st & 3rd
MM Black Diamond 538 F&AM

I WOULD SAY HIGHER STALL CONVERTER WILL DEFINTLY CUT TIMES. I WOULD WORK ON THE 60 FT TIME TOO. THATS WHERE YOU ARE LOOSIN TIME.

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91 camaro RS
- 305 TBI
Mods: Performer TBI intake, 1" TBI spacer, K+N, jet fan switch ,160 thermo,Accel control module, Jet Stage 2 chip, edelbrock TES headers, Compleate 3" Flowmaster exhaust, Edelbrock springs, KYB struts and shocks, 700R4 built by TSI, SLP tq converter, b+m trans cooler, white guage faces, megashifter..
next month: spohn LCA's and panhard rod, BMR relocation brackets, 323 gear, lt1 cam , 350 heads

i did not see one bit of improvment when i mounted slicks. i have the 3.23's in my car. I have had better 60 foot times on street tires than on slicks. That and i am willing to bet that it is harder to bog my engine down. The slicks hit hard off the line and then they bogged. A converter will help and so will gears. but your curent combo should be good for alot more.

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90 IROC l98
last season best corected 13.62 @102
mods
full exhaust, AFPR, pulley, jet stage 1 chip, billet servo, 52mm throttle body, slp runners and some 1.6 RR's and a few other little things.
243 RWHP and 342 RWTQ with hot engine and 90 octain fuel

TORQUE ARM..... The stock stamped unit is okay, but a sphoon unit will have ya hook up.... You have the LCA's so what is your R/T, your 330' and your 1/8th... This sounds more of like a problem getting the power to the ground.. Lower your tire PSI about 5 PSI per rear tire, over inflate the front by 10PSI...

Definitely go with a custom PROM.

At this point you will greatly benefit from modified spark and fuel curves. I have a TPIS Level 3. I like it

Another thing is base timing should be set at 8*-10* advanced with the stock PROM. If you get an aftermarket PROM set the base timing back to 6*.

I'd also put the higher stall-converter on the top of the list. It made a huge SOTP

Good luck. Keep us updated.


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Mike L.
It ain't pretty.......

1987 IROC Z TPI 350 A4 3.27 Borg-Warner.

Mods: 2300-2500 Stall Converter, Shift Kit(GM parts), TPI Specialties Stage 3 PROM, Modified Airbox w/ K&N's, homemade cold air, Relocated MAT sensor, Gutted MAF, 160* thermostat, MSD 6A, Accel 8mm Wires, bypassed TB coolant, Flowmaster 3 chamber single 3" in/out muffler, 3" MAC mandrel intermediate, custom dual !cat Y-pipe. airfoil, ported plenum. !smog

http://www.MichaelLasiuta.home.att.net

**BOYCOTT LAPEER DRAGWAY**

well, your trap speed isn't that high so i'd say your problem isn't just the 60'. as for the comment of what is your elevation, that is a good question, but if you ran 14.03, than your car is in the 14's not the 13's since you don't live at a corrected altitude. correcting is best left to magazines to show what the car can run elsewhere. i'd say your lacking hp with the parts you have on it. what's your shift point? how are you launching it? are you allowing it to cool and icing the intake between runs? what's your timing set at? just a few questions that might help to find your lack of power issue since you really should have more power than it's putting out.

you have a ported intake, you should get better heads and a larger cam. if what you have is stock then it's not putting out enough power, reguardless of the stall converter/tires/gears/chip. try new heads and a cam and I think you'll notice you times dropping.

Timing is at 10*, I first launched at 900 and didnt get any wheel spin but got a higher time. second time I launcehed at 1200, spun the tires and got the lower time. The car sat about 20 mintues after the first run but got up to about 190 200* on the 14.0 run. I didnt ice anything. Tire PSI was 27 out back and 30 up front. This was also with a full tank of gas. I have a professional GM scanning tool so what should i look under? Its an OTC.

My shift points are about 4300 but I manually shift it at 4800 and it hits at 5000.

Just curious, why would you want to set your base timing back to 6 with a aftermarket chip?

Because the chip advances your timing and you do not want the knock sensor retarding it. (I think)

it is not always nessisary to move the timing back to stock when you install an aftermarket chip. the knock sensor will only cut in and drop the timing if it detects knock. your car may run better with more inital timing with out knocking. You just have to tune on the car to see what makes a differance. it is best if you can go to the track and make several passes to see what works best. last time i was at the track i got a total of 3 knocks for 2 runs. I have found on the gass i can get arround here my car runs best at 6* of timing. Tuneing is the key and you will run a 13 if the engine is tuned properly. I found 1/2 a second in tuneing. G-tech helps in tuneing. it is not acurate but it is consistant.

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90 IROC l98
last season best corected 13.62 @102
mods
full exhaust, AFPR, pulley, jet stage 1 chip, billet servo, 52mm throttle body, slp runners and some 1.6 RR's and a few other little things.
243 RWHP and 342 RWTQ with hot engine and 90 octain fuel

My questions/suggestions are more rudimentary. How many miles are on the engine? How about the heads - valve guides and seals can go pretty quick on the stock heads). If it’s a high mileage car, I’d check the compression leak down. If it’s within reason and the cylinders are fairly even, then I’d move on over to the scanner and see if it’s a tuning issue. Actually, there is not a lot you’ve done that I would think an AFPR and bumping the timing would not get “tuning” close. I use to “tune” these cars (and others) back in the mid 80’s and early 90’s. It was done entirely without use of a scan tool. I used a Vericom accelerometer to adjust the fuel pressure, TPS (along with a multimeter – so as not to set it too high), and timing,,, and my eyes to check the plugs for mixture and detonation problems. I’ve had cars similar to yours with the stock base intake and runners run solidly in the mid 13s when they left my shop– they were “new” and fresh though,, some less than 1,000 miles on the odometer. Anyway,, what I’m getting at since these cars have some age on them now,, check out the basics first,, compression leak down test, pull the plugs to see what they look like. With you having a MAF car, valve cover leaks, old worn out grommets surrounding the PCV and the hose to the T/B, hose leaks, open air breathers on the valve covers I see folks running, a header leak, improper adjusted IAC and TPS,,, any one (not to mention combinations) of these things can cause you “tuning” problems. However, if all the “small stuff” checks out ok,, hook the scanner to it. If you need help determining what all the values should be,, I’d suggest buying “How to Tune and Modify Chevrolet Fuel Injection”. It was instrumental in helping me diagnose problems and have a better understanding of the TPI IROC I bought last year and modified. Good luck.

First you need to learn how to drive, a 2.17 60' is HORRIBLE. Once you get that knocked down into the mid-low 2.0 range you will be squarely in the 13s. You need to find the right combination of launch rpm and rolling into the throttle to get that thing off the line better. Also, your tires may or may not be part of your problem.
Other than that, i wouldn't expect much more than 98mph from that set up as is so i don't think you are down on power. Use your scan tool to check for knock retard, that is lost power. Also make sure your basics are all good. Beyond that, since you're not buring chips you'll just have to play with the FP and timing to see how you can make it run best.

rocket booster might help?

I used to run (when the car was tpi) 13.7's at 98 or 99 with 2.1-2.2 60ft times, I did have a small cam and 3.70's, but not a ported plenum. I think with a little tuning, ie timing and Fuel pressure, you could hit 13.9-8, but I think gears would really help you.

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Black 89 IROC...355, Solid Crower Cam, TFS heads.
12.0 @ 120.3mph with a 1.9 60ft...all motor

Car has 67,000 on it. The valve seals are so so. It'll smoke on start up once in a while. Plugs look great, burns 0 oil (except valve seals. There are 0 vacume leaks so far. I'm pulling 20-22 HG of vacume at idle. Car is in very good running order. Just passed echeck without the smog pump and stuff. It has a brand new maf sensor. I have noticed though that from 4800-5200 the car seems to die so maybe the fuel pressure is too high? I have brand new 22# injectors from MSD i also have an MSD 6AL box with accel supercoil.

The tires I am running are the cheapest Firehawks. They are the SS20's that I got for 83.99 a piece. but it seems when I launch at a higher stall i have a very hard time hooking up.

Bowtiroc....not to say you are lying, but to run in the 13s at under 100mph usually takes a 2.0 60' or better in my experience. Thats why if i were him i would look at improving my lauch technique more than throwing parts tuning at it. Esp. considering 98 mph is pretty good for a stock cam/head car...i don't think power is his issue. Using it is.

it would considerably help when you race to not have a full tank of gas and get than thing cooler. 190 to 200 degrees is way too hot for good times. your going to want engine temp about 170 with air intake temperature around 65 to 85 degrees. run the front tires at max pressure and you also should be able to drop the rear tires a bit more to like 23. after your burnout they should be heated to about 26 or so. but, deffinitly get rid of all that gas and keep it cool.

A cam with a little more lift?

you do know that you can now buy good z-rated tires cheap. i bought yoko AVS intermediates for 84 per tire. you can get some seriously better 60 foot times for under $220 for rear tires. beleve me you will love these tires. I am on my 3rd set. I can pull 2.0 60 foot times on an unpreped track. I know i can do better when the track is preped.

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90 IROC l98
last season best corected 13.62 @102
mods
full exhaust, AFPR, pulley, jet stage 1 chip, billet servo, 52mm throttle body, slp runners and some 1.6 RR's and a few other little things.
243 RWHP and 342 RWTQ with hot engine and 90 octain fuel