when I had the trans done I wanted to put a new tv valve in but my trans guy told me I did not need it.

the 700r4 has that problem in 4th where it likes to go into third when you hardley have your foot on the gas.

I just put a 3.42 gear in the rear from a 2.77 and I am not used to it yet. I was on the expressway and was at about 4gs in 4th gear and hit it hard. My car went into 3rd and revved hard.

my valve train was making all kinds of noise at higher than 1500 rpms. I took my valve covers off and readjusted valves.

they were all a bit loose and two of them were way off. I set them up and took the car out and after juicing it a bit they came loose again.

the rockers are stockers and the nuts have been replaced. I was wondering if my lifters went out or what?

thanks for your help!

 

What were you doing, going 140mph?

 

Who knows?

I still have not replaced the speedo gears.

My lifters are hydraulic and the rocker nuts do look as if they have backed off to much.

I really hate to take this thing apart when the weather is going to break.
T-TOOOPPPPPPSSS!!!!!!!!!

 

sounds like you need new rocker nuts again.

 

My calculations show that you were doing around 120 when this occured. Highly unlikely, i would say that you tach is way off. I know this doesn't solve your problem, just pointing it out.

 

Maybe busted a lot of springs, or maybe pulled some studs loose, or maybe bent some pushrods. I don't think it's Ok to keep driving it as is. Re-do the heads before you do further damage.

 

that sounds extreame! I hope I did not hurt the heads. that is even worse than taking the intake off and replacing lifters.

Redngold has this happened to you before. if so were the springs stock because I bought bigger springs to match my cam not 3000 miles ago. I know I might be doing the same thing most people do when major things go wrong with a car- minimalize the situation.

would I be able visually check the condition of the spring or is there another way to see if they are busted.

I think that I can check the pushrods and the studs without a problem.

Let me know!

 

Sounds like you might be pulling your studs out with the heavier springs maybe

 

I'm not sure what engine ur running, but I've overrevved my LO3 (accidently) to 7000 rpms (on the stock tach) and still runs ok. Definetly some valve train nose, but I'm sorta of looking for a reason to swap out the LO3 for the 350HO .

 

it is making the tink tink noise and when the rpms get up the engine seems to gurgle a little.

I hope those technical terms wernt a bit much for you guys, Ha Ha!

 

ok its apart for the second time in so many days

1-pushrods are all straight
2-no physical damage to the rockers or the springs.
3-It seemed that some of the rocker nuts had more tread coming out than other-noticable.
Did I mention that I just readjusted them not 4 days ago and the car ran fine for about 20 minutes. the nuts are new probably 3000 miles tops.
4-two or three of the studs were a 1/16 of an inch higher than the others

Let me know what you guys think!!!

 

Well, #1 and #2 are good. #3...are they poly locks, or the stock nuts? #4, as mentioned above, your rocker arms are pulling out because of the spring pressures, and I'm sure 7000RPMs didn't help that at all. You'll need to take the heads off and to a shop to get your heads machined for screw-in studs. I wouldn't recommend doing that while heads are on the motor.

Could also have bent valves. I did a 3-2 shift at 6k in my LS1 about a month ago and I now have zero compression on my #8 cylinder. Not to mention, I'm pretty sure I've bent some pushrods because the motor is still running rough. I've been too busy working on my '88 to get a chance to work on the LS1. When I pull the covers and heads, they're getting sent off to the porter anyways

 

definately sounds like the press-in factory studs are pulling out. if you would have pinned them before you built the motor they'd still be in there, now it's time to pull the heads, have all the pins pulled out and machined for screw-in studs, typically $100 for a pair of heads to get done.

 

I have a sneaking suspicion about these two terms being so close together in the paragraph. lol!

 

a 1/16 of inch. maybe I just hate the fact that I have to tear down the whole top end of the motor but it seems extreame for a 1/16 of an inch.

Hands down if one of the studs was all kinds of loose and a 1/4 of an inch out I would have the impact all lubed up for tommarro but I have to hear from someone who works in a machine shop..

I am not saying that I do not value you guys and the advise I have been given and for all I know you guys are hitting the nail on the head but before I lose a month of driving I want to talk to the machine shop that put the heads together.

 

all you need to do is put a flat edge on the top of all the rockers studs, if they're 1/16" taller than the others then they're pulling out. tighten up the rockers again and drive a little more, eventually the studs would fail and pull out more. Don't feel too bad, the "fresh" motor I bought to go into my camaro looked like a fresh hone/re-ring job until I flipped the motor over to check bearing clearances and now all the main bearings are shot and coppered color, so i'll have to tear the whole motor down and have it machined out before I can drive this car.

 

You might be losing a cam. How old is the cam?

 

3000 miles old

 

If it isn't a roller cam then I would drop the oil and run a magnet through it and cut open the filter. If your wiping out a cam you'll see it.

 

thats a good Idea. I have a magnet on my drain plug and I also have the filter magnitized. I will do that today.

 

it keeps getting worse the more stuff i take apart. there was a mound of metallic goo on my drainplug.

I am going roller this time for sure and not putting anything else in my vehicles from now on. roller rocker two.

if I remove the radiator and the condenser i can do a cam swap in the car right.

I am in need of support. a buddy of mine told me I could extract the studs in my heads and tap the holes right inside the engine bay.

this is a 305 and if a take it out it will never go back in and I have put too much money in the longblock not to see a few more miles out of it.

 

I talked to my machine guy and he siad that it is more likely that I spun a rod bearing than smoked the cam shaft.

I think either way I am screwed.

Is there anyone out there that has some more input.

 

i have to say it, get ready for a 350 swap.

 

I still dont understand how you saw 7000 rpms in 3rd gear with only 3.42's, unless of course the trans let go. But definitely sounds like you have issues.

How does the car run? if youre wiping a lobe on the cam you should notice it, it should be a little more "rumpy" than before...maybe sound a little more cammy, idle a little rougher. And it will continue to get worse.

 

I am going to pull the cam and the oil pan so I can check the bottom end

 

I would ask your motor guy how a spun rod bearing is going to bend/break pushrods and back off the rockers. A spun rod bearing won't leave "metallic goo" stuck to your magnetic plug either. If you did wipe the cam out I would pull the whole motor apart cause that metallic goo has gone through the oil pump and then on through the rest of the motor. Sorry man but it doesn't look promising. You might think about a second opinion as far as the engine guy goes. Rod bearing???

 

yeah the rod bearing thing is kind of of the wall.

wouldnt the filter stop most of the goo from entering my engine.
I thought if I changed the oil and filter a few times I would be All good

 

No, when the filter starts to plug up, it will bypass and shuttle dirty oil through.

 

After you do all that its only 6 bellhousing bolts, two starter bolts, two motor mount bolts and a couple of connections and the motor is out to check it properly. My advice.......do it right the first time....

and 3 torque converter bolts!

 

the 305 is pretty much fresh so if the rods are ok and all I have to do is put a cam in I am going to leave it in.

 

Replacing the cam won't help the rocker studs that are slowly pulling out.

You need to fix the rocker studs before you consider anything else.

 

 

does anyone realize how small a 1/16th of an inch is. I think that when the machine shop put in a few studs they were a bit longer than the others. I could be wrong.

On the other hand I got the cam and lifters out today and it was wiped!

 

pics? very curious to see what the damage looks like (i think i may have done the similar to mine ).

 

Yes......it is .062 or 62 thousanths of an inch.....but to create a noisy lifter it wouldn't take much to loosen the rr off and create a tick......having said that, I figured you had lost a cam........if it ain't a roller cam its a 50/50 crapshoot every time you break in a new cam......sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Is the lobe completely round? Put a roller in it and you won't have to deal with this issue again.

 

my cam should have had a cam button on it if it was to go anywhere north of 6k.

As for pictures the cam is in the garbage and two of the lobes were worn down. one lifter looked concave and a few of the lifters plungers were pushed down inside the bore of the lifter.

It sickens me and I really do not want to pull it out of the trash.

If you insist I will pull it back out.

the moral of the story is always install a cam button they are like 5 bucks.

You could see on the side of the cam lobes were the cam walked into the next lobes lifer

 

A 16th of an inch is a mile, when it comes to engines. You definately need to fix that problem, or else it will keep coming back.

 

Dude, i totally understand. I didn't realize the damage was so extensive. keep it in the trash and move on. Good luck with the repair work.

 

Ok next question........the guy that told you it was probably a rod knock.....is that the guy that put this motor together for you or just did the machining? If he assembled it I would hope he's going to help cover the cost of having to redo the motor! Anyone with any kind of engine knowledge knows you need to have a cam button in it! You NEED to PULL this motor because all that schrapnal from the cam has defenately gone through the bearings..Absolutely! Not what you want to hear but dems da facts!

 

+1...and dont think you can "skirt by it" by flushing the oil and putting in HD filters and magnetic drain plugs for a few oil changes. I had metal shavings go through my motor because the mechanic who built it used soft-metal pushrods and the guideplates tore them apart and snapped one in half....well I tried to "skirt by it" and 10k later my motor failed, not from a bearing but the bore on one cyl was completely fubar, metal got behind the rings and ballooned em out, ate the bore up.....had several others with scarring .020-.030 deep that were leeching compression. I build my own motors now....ya want it done right, do it yourself but make sure to get guidance and talk to lots of people, dont just rely on one guy to be right 100% of the time.

 

Anything that will see the high side ok 3,000 rpm needs screw in studs.

 

just for the fun of it lets put some pretend wagers on how long the motor will last.

First of all I will tell you that the drain plug got a big clump of it.

I am not going to flush the engine.

I had magets on the outside of the oil filter also.

I will change the oil and filter after the 15 min break in period of the cam

I will continue to magnitize the oil filter and will change again after 100 miles and then 3000 intervals.

I say 25000 miles

 

I say 2500 miles! What you see on the magnets is MAYBE 10% of what went through that motor. Think about it for a sec, you have two cam lobes that are ROUND..........where the hell is all the rest of that steel???? Your magnet and filter don't have it!

 

Why would you even risk it? Like mentioned above it's only a few more nuts and bolts and the entire engine is out and ready to at least be pulled apart and cleaned properly.

If i had to guess 1,000 miles or so.

 

first of all the oil inside my valve covers had no metal

I have magnets all around the oil cleaner.

1000-2500 miles those are not guesses those are you guy talking @#$%.

have you ever built an engine all by yourself or do you have a machine shop do it?

where does the oil come from that oils the bottom end of the engine.

what is the purpose of the oil filter?

these are just a few of the things you have to consider when making a guess.

this motor has 3000 miles on a complete rebuild

 

Hey man, you asked for help now you don't want to listen when people give advice. Most of the people on this board that post on issues like this have extensive knowledge building motors or have a very good understanding of how things work. If you want a number from me it would be twelve. I have assembled twelve motors myself and I have lost a cam before and I did pull the motor down, and the shrapnel that gets pumped through the motor is steel. Steel that inbeds itself in the soft babbit your bearings are made of which, in turn, marks the sh-t out of all you main and rod journals. It is just a matter of time before you lose a rod or main bearing which means taking the crank with it. Your chirping at people trying to give you solid advice. I really don't care if you pull the motor or not, because its your money. The answer to your question re where does all the oil come from has been answered already. A surprising amount of the oil that the oil pump moves through the motor is bypassed by the oil filter and goes directly to the crank, unfiltered. Experienced engine builders will usually plug the bypass. Is yours? If not, rest assured that your rod and main bearings are full of garbage from your failed camshaft. Again, if you don't like the advice that obviously more experienced engine builders on this board post for you, then why do you ask. Its your time and money man, do what you want.

 

I had what was probably roughly the equivalent of the amount of metal you had go through yours, with mine...I had twin magnetic drain plugs and heavy duty truck oil filters with excellent filtration characteristics. My motor began exhibiting major problems within 5,000 miles and within 10,000 miles it was undriveable, compression numbers ALL over the place and cyl #1 tested at 95% leakdown.

And that was in the cylinders, I never even inspected the motor for bearing damage which was also highly likely!

So yeah my bet....10k

 

thats more like it 10k sounds better

Rob wade how do you block off the bypass.

I just bought a 350 block out of a 91 4x4 truck, four bolt main.

I just want this motor to last long enough for me to find a set of l98 aluminum heads. I have been porting the intake like a mad man while I wait for a cam.

 

If it won't go 7K I don't want it!

 

Ok, let me explain it like this. I do build engines. About 2 a week. I work on cars for a living. I have ASE certifications, college education, and I work in shop for a living.

I would give the same guess, and I would not be talking &#^* either. If you bothered to read or look around before you blasted people for telling you the truth you would have found out a lot. For instance:

1. You wiped out a cam. Oil in a SBC feeds FROM THE CAM to the BEARINGS. Bearings come after cam. One more time, just to make sure, bearings come after cam.

2. The oil filters primary purpose is to filter the oil. However it does not do this with perfect efficiency. Your oil filter has a bypass valve in it. When you start your engine and the oil is thick and cold it will bypass through the filter. SOme of it will not be filtered. Also, when your filter filled up with all that goop from the cam and whatnot, I can pretty well guarantee you that the bypass opened. This sent unfiltered oil strait back through your engine.

We dont make this stuff up because we dont like you. You asked for help, you got it.