Heres the deal guys, I messed up I know.

Story:

Pressure washed engine, Covered TBI plenums with plastic bag. I used a HIGH PSI pressure washer. I then finished up started the car and it idled extremely high and drove at 1,200 which is still too high. Later that Night I decided to use a AIR COMPRESSOR to dry out all electrical connectors of water I dried (FUEL PUMP RELAY/w connector,CONNECTORS SORROUNDING IT, CHECKED UNDER DISSY CAP AND ROTOR dry,DRIED OUT ALL ELECTRICAL CONNECTIONS ON TBI AND MANIFOLD,) Still idleing to high, I checked the spark plugs they're just black from the car running so rich (Those were replaced some weeks ago) I need to spray starting fluid in order to start the car in the mornings and when it sits for more than 7 hours. All vaccum hoses and lines are correctly fitted into thier proper place. IDLE AIR CONTROL VALVE is working correctly, because I aquired a new one and installed it and it still idled real high.


Action Taken:

Dried all visible electrical connections and electrical components. Replaced MAP SENSOR w/ bought a AC DELCO = Same Idleing except now the gas pedal isnt as hard anymore. Replaced a potential faulty injector (That makes 2 new injectors) Inserted HEET to gas tank a liquid that removes any water from the fuel system,= Same Problem remained. Idle at too high. I did the timing when EST cable is pluged up IDLES too high still.

What else could be the problem? I see the injectors spitting out a cone of a shiiiit load of gas!!! and making a loud hissing sound. I get no SERVICE ENGINE light. What else could be the proplem or something I haven't tried?

Someone pleeeease help me!! my third gen literally drained me for this week I had to borrow $120.00 and my car is still giving me a hard time

Sounds to me like you created a vacume leak somewhere. How hard did you hit the top end of the engine??? Intake manifold area etc??? Is the loud hissing coming from the injectors or somewhere else. You may have pushed the intake gasket in and this would create a vacume leak that could cause your problems.

I sprayed the intake quite a bit... I routed the emission hoses correctly and now when I step on the gas on DRIVE the car turns off!!! it was routed diffrently... the MAP SENSOR went straight to the EGR.


Does anyone have actual pictures NOT DIAGRAMS of how thier emission hoses are set up?

Alright when outside and looked at everything all hoses look in their correct order.. it doesnt turn off now... but it idles at around 1800 could it be the EGR valve? the Hissing sound is coming from the injectors because they are spraying so damn much :-p

what should I do? replace the EGR VALVE??

You can test the EGR valve. With the engine idling, you can press the diaphragm in and you should notice a difference in the RPMS.

How do I go about doing this?

When you are idling, your EGR valve is not supposed to be open. It is only supposed to work at part throttle and/or while you are driving. So you could test it by pulling the vacuum line to it and plugging that vacuum line. If your car does not stall, then you have discovered a bad EGR. However, if your EGR valve is stuck open, this test won't help you.

I said press in the diaphragm, because you can do that instead of pulling the vacuum line, but either way works.

Could the EGR valve cause an the engine to idle so high? I will try this test in the morning.

Yes, EGR can cause erratic and strange idling.

Change the Throttle Position Sensor. Last weekend I washed my engine and had to replace the TPS right after. It idled at 1500. Most likely the problem.

Are you talking about that black component on the passanger side of the TBI the one that has a plug going into it? I disconnected that (while turned on)and the car still idles high.

Ok the egr valve seems to be working, and getting vacuum everything else seems ok, some reason the injectors are spraying out way too much gas and making a hissing sound because of the speed at which they are throwing it, What the hell else do I do???? I cant be putting $10.00 of gas everyday to drive this damn thing... I dont have anymoney I will be force to sell this... this is so frusturating Iv'e done everything I possibily could and nothing has changed it

Idling too high ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS means you are getting too much air. If your injectors were spraying too much or you otherwise were getting too much gas or your EGR was stuck open, you would idle like crap. Chances are you have a vacuum leak or your IAC is stuck open for some reason. A bad electrical connection will cause the IAC to stick but should also cause a SES light so I am leaning toward a vacuum leak. Remember, it doesn't have to be a hose. It could just as easily be caused by a broken gasket.

lol relax, chances are that you need to adjust your TPS sensor, if you blasted the Plenum with the high pressure air, chances are youve blown your plenum gaskets. take off your plenum and inspect the gaskets and replace as necessary. if thats not the problem then adjust your TPS, if thats off then its gonna throw more gas into the engine than it needs, i bet your running rich right now.

It isn't the IAC I work at pep boys, so I got a new one and installed it and turned on the car and the idle was still high... so that ruled out the IAC... Where is the TPS sensor located? on the passanger side of the TBI unit right a black component with a electrical plug in it? correct? How does one go about adjusting that?
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I bought a new injector and installed the gaskets that come with it and I checked the fuel pressure regulator it still moves freely. How do I Adjust the TPS?
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Are you guys suggesting I remove the TBI unit to check for a ruptured gasket?

Alright I just got done inspecting the TBI unit gasket and the middle gasket of the TBI unit and nothing seems to be ruptured or torn everything seems ok what else do I do??? the car drives at 1k now and when I floor it it takes a real long time to respond.... all vacuum hoses are correctly in thier proper spot and are not leaking

Any other input???

Change your TPS - on mine there is no way to adjust it. If it goes out it is not working and I wouldn't think unplugging it would do anything. I can't be sure this is the problem over the computer, but I would bet on it. 15 min job.

Ok, maybe you just mis-communicated this, but hopefully you set the base timing with the tan/black EST wire DISCONNECTED??

You've got a major vacuum leak somewhere, gotta find out where... If you can't find anything, it's got to be the intake manifold gasket..

I didn't notice the NO SERVICE ENgine light remark. But it should have come on when you uplugged the TPS. See if it comes on when you do that. If it does then goes back out after plugging it back in, I'd have to say it might not be the TPS. If it does not come on at all, maybe the light is out.

Well today I did not show up to work because I needed to get this done.... so I went to 2 well known Technicians in the Torrance area (hometown) and NONE found out what it was and only speculated. My last option is to take it to the dealership (MARTIN CHEVROLET) so far the bill is 291.00 for a complete diagnostic. I am totally stumped I have no one else to turn too but GM. And no there is no SES light coming on or throwing out bad codes. Thanks for all your input guys.

The TPS sits on the throttle opposite where the throttle cable connects. (shame on you for working at PEP Boys and not knowing that ) The TPS adding more fuel will not increase your idle RPM unless there is more air getting in from somewhere. Just because you replaced the IAC that does not guarantee that it isn't the problem. There may be a bad electrical connection somewhere causing it to not operate properly. Normally this would throw an SES light but as stated previously by others it appears your light may be blown.

When the tps goes out the ecm makes the idle speed go up. Change the tps and the idle goes back down. This could be because the idle solenoid is trying to compensate for the extra fuel due to the tps going out.

The tps is $40.

GAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Martin Chevrolet of Torrance, looked at it and diagnosed it and they came up with a total bill of $1,100 and then dropped it down to $900.00 I then told them it was waaaay to much for it and he said he would go down to $800.00 I said "HAHA Are you kidding me!!!?" Heres what they claimed to find out


Replacement of:
New Coolant Temp Sensor W/ Connector + ($225.00 Labor)
New Throttle Positioning Sensor W/ Connector + ($198.00 Labor)
New Spark Plug Wires ($120.00 Labor)

plus cost of parts!!! which are in the HUNDREDS!!!!!


WHAT THE F***!!!!!!!!!!!! THESE GUYS ARE HORRIBLE!!!!!

I ALREADY HAVE TO BORROW MONEY FROM ONE OF MY FRIENDS OR FAMILY JUST TO PAY THE $291.67 DIAGNOSTIC BILL!!!!!!!!!!! I ****ED UP THERE... BUT NO ONE ELSE KNEW WHAT WAS WRONG WITH IT... OMG.. THIS IS A LIFE LESSON WELL LEARNED NEVER EVER GO TO A DEALERSHIP!!!!

You should have gone to Dyno Don in Orange. He would have it fixed in a heartbeat and for a fraction of the money.

Change the tps.

Changed the TPS and IAC, now the blades inside the plenum STICK!! and I get a sticky gas pedal I have to apply great force to give it some gas, what gives???

You installed it wrong. and if you had listened to these guys the first time you could have saved $250. $20 says you still idle high when the tps if installed right. take it out, put it back in amd make sure nothing is bound up.

by the time they posted it was already too late and I know I was wrong by taking it to the dealership life lesson well learned. It does not idle high anylonger it is smooth and rides like it did before the PRESSURE WASH, the only problem now is that the blades are sticking to the plenum somehow..... How do I fix it? I though I installed it right??? do I loosen it some more?????? what do I do?? do I have to adjust it? and if so how do i go about doing that?

I tired sparying WD40 on the spring and both blades,,,, it still sticks

remove it and see if it will move free with a screwdriver, my guess is is is cocked somehow, just remove and reinstall it, if it is still sticking, exchange it.

what? exhange what? the whole TBI UNIT??? Im just going to go to the Junkyard and rebuild one and install it. It'll only take like an 1hr. A Mechanic today told me that I would have to replace the whole TBI unit because the throttle plates are calibrated by GM and if I mess with that I would be able to match it up properly.

Update:


Went to PICK YOUR PARTS found a 1991 firebird formula took the TBI base off and then went home took old TBI unit off and I accidently punctured and twisted one of the fuel hardlines (passanger side) while twisting it off. Had to wait till today to go get a another fuel line from the same pontiac firebird at the JUNKYARD and went home installed it and now everything works properly no sticky gas pedal! no high idles everything is back to when before I pressure washed my engine.

Lesson of the day: DONT PRESSURE WASH YOUR ENGINE!

and don't go to a dealer for such a simple problem

So ... what turned out to be the problem which caused the high idle ? Tired and feverish here, hard to focus *L*

New Coolant Temp Sensor W/ Connector + ($225.00 Labor) Were they on drugs ???? For "installing" a damn CTS ?

It was the TPS sensor and shortly there after the shaft in the TBI blades gave out so I got a sticky pedal and had to go to the junkyard and pull a TBI BASE plate from a 91 firebird formula. Pulled out my old one and pinched/twisted the passanger side fuel line so i had to go back to the junkyard and pull the same fuel line out of the same firebird, When I returned there was gasoline all over my street. It was about 80 degrees here in socal and the fuel tank just had to vent and it used the poorly capped fuel line to do so.

Wow ! you suffered badly with that high idle problem. I hope things will be less tough for me Here's my idle headache :

** this is a 2.8litre V6 engine MPFI **

idles at various speeds, but almost always way too high.

Often idles at 2,250 RPM, lowest it'll ever go is about 1,200

SES light is NOT on (?!) , But does come on when you turn key prior to
starting the engine, so it seems like the light itself should work.

At a red light, it may start at 2,250 , after 20 sec go to 1,750 ,
go back up again 15 sec later , and so on ...

Engine power seems to be good , the rear end will break out when giving
it gas while cornering , even on a dry surface ( My first 2.8 couldn't do that

engine temperature stays normal at all times,
oil pressure is high, all the time

I bought this V6 because of the gas prices (especially here in SoCal)
but at this rate I might as well have gotten a V8

Anybody have any idea what might be causing this high idling,
I notice that the computer tries to get the idle RPM down while at
stoplights, but it never goes under 1,200 RPM

I only know 1 thing : I wont be going to the dealership

Could have been frozen in the intake... myn was took me 6 hours to get it out in my shop, tryed at first. stripped.. then we heated it and tryed using vice grips all these kinda special wrenches and finnally we just said drill the ****er. about 40 mins later it was out and i was tapping new threads.

Check your vacuum hoses first, pull out the PCV valve - if it rattles when you shake it, its probably OK, check the throttle linkage and other linkages to the throttle (ie. TV cable) for binding or a broken throttle return spring.

Check your oil CONDITION too... see if there is water in it. Might be a sign of really bad intake gasket leak(s), which also cause the high idle problem.

I can't remember if those engines have a IAC motor, but that would be something to check as well.

I've never been a big fan of just throwing parts and money at a problem in attempt to fix something. Testing whats already there in search of the problem, then replace/adjustment as required is the best way to go, as our friend Psycho_91 has learned.