IS it just me or do you guys also have neighbors or acquaintances, that it seems would rather be skinned alive,with a razor, rolled in salt and slowly lowered into a wood chipper than take the time to read the linked info on how to do something, or do the simplest research on a problem, or do the actual work on their own cars?
I had a neighbor recently come over a few weeks ago asking how to do something rather simple but a bit time intensive that was well within his ability's, (replacing his oil pan and oil pump) I explained what he needed to do, brought him in to my shop, showed him a link with part numbers,on my lap top, for the required gaskets and pictures of the parts, and sent him the link on his computer, gave him the phone numbers where he could buy the parts locally or on-line cheaply, and told him Id help HIM do the job by supervising and pointing out every step, required while he did the work,and even help if he got really stuck during the process, but I also pointed out that it was really not that difficult, just a bit messy and time intensive,and if he HELPED, AND supplied lunch and coffee, or paid $50 and purchased all parts required, he called back asking several times for the same basic info, I had the feeling he was really just trying to get me to do the work or find someone to do the work for free,, now I have zero problem helping out, most guys but I know from experience that this guy won,t even buy lunch, will complain if a job takes more than a couple hours, let alone pay a minimum hourly rate for work, or just slip me $50 for doing what any dealership would see as a $500 plus job, and its on a corvette that doesn,t even have the cross member in the way and I know this guy has the tools,basic skill , jack stands and floor jacks etc.
honestly if the guy was just willing to get his hands greasy or supply hot coffee and conversation and make a run and buy any required parts, and spend some time on a mechanics creeper under his own car, Id most likely jump on the opportunity to help out..., but when you hand a guy the link listing the parts and explain the process several tiimes in detail, and the guys both not willing to buy the parts and offer to at least help in the process or slip you a few bucks for a couple hours work and acts like buying parts, researching what needs to be done or even be involved in the repair process is beneath him,to the extent hes not even willing to hand you tools and buy lunch.....IS it just me or would you tell this guy to take a hike?


vaguely related threads

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...php?f=32&t=459

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...ting+your+head

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...+stands+safety

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...uctance#p18037

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...php?f=80&t=728

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...hp?f=32&t=6011

 

Don't hold back there Grumpy! Yeah sounds like everyone with an auto problem I've ever known in my 25+ years of car ownership. I've worked on heaps of rello's/friends/neighbors pos old cars they've always GOT to get going right now. Couldn't go to a mechanic, too expensive, and hey Treefiddy u can fix cars n stuff help me help me!

It usually went:

I'd get 'em back on the road, but it was never done quickly, cheaply or pretty enough, and I always got to do all the work and buy all the parts.

Then I would get to be responsible for every problem that car ever had again, from that day forward. It was my fault and I better fix it now or else wah wah wah.

I gave up working on anything but my own pos cars a long time ago! Hey venting feels good!

 

Yep. It's the 99%.

Learning practical things and actually doing real work yourself is so last-century.

 

There is usually a reason they are bothering someone for help instead of paying someone. Most of the time they even have the money but are to cheap to do it. Those people are impossible to please.

 

thats why all my freinds and neighbors know i dont work for free. needless to say im hardly ever asked to help out anymore. im more than happy to point them in the right direction, but these days the average person just wants someone else to do the work for them. then bitch and moan when they have to pay for something they can easily do themselves.

 

If it makes you feel any better all that awesome info you have online about headgaskets and camshafts and cylinder heads, I've read... well, Im not gonna say all of them, but I read enough of them til my brain melted. Now the relevant stuff is stored in the old noodle and the irrelevant stuff is cataloged as "See also: grumpy's link" when necessary.

I know exactly what you're talking about, though. I have a friend who is an epic mooch. He cant do hardly anything himself.

He constantly buys pieces of crap vehicles, either 70s-80s Chevy trucks or 70-80s Camaros, and they always run like crap, and he goes to do a cap and rotor job (because he thinks thats within his realm of capability...) in the hopes that it will make it "run like a v8"... despite the fact taht I've told him anything between 74 and 81 is going to be SUPER slow, no matter what, and pointed compression and hp/tq numbers for him repeatedly. Anyway, he invariably pulls of his cap, and sees the rotor pointing towards some cylinder other than number 1, and removes the distributor to "fix" it, and throws it back together.

Then I get a call at 10 at night "I've been trying to fix this car all day and I think the timing is off and I gotta get to work in the morning...."

Now understand, he generally thinks these smogger v8 vehicles are slow simply because "the timing is off". SO no matter how much I tell him it's running fine and the timing is right, he always complains about it. So when he calls saying the car wont run because the timing is off, it's definitely an epic-fail situation already.

Anyway it takes 5 minutes of interrogation to get him to say that he removed and repalced the distributor, since he has no idea that it's a big deal. And then I have to go over there and find 1 TDC again, and remove and reinstall his distributor again, and then check the timing with my timing light once he gets it running.

And I've done this one time, and then I explained to him what was happening. Then I had to do it again 6 months later when I reminded him of what happened. Then I had to do it AGAIN a few months after that, at which point I told him I'd start charging him $20 every time he did this until I could buy him his own timing light and he could figure it out himself.

Havent heard from him about it since... maybe he's learned... but I doubt it.

 

Im glad a few guys take advantage of the 40 plus years of experience I posted for you gentlemen to easily access on my home page

 

Welcome to the begining of the "entitlement" generation.
I have noticed it on a LOT of the car forums anymore. Everyone wants to see pictures and have a complete write up on the simplest of procedures. ITS CALLED A FACTORY SERVICE MANUAL PEOPLE!!! Buy one, Its worth the money!! I had to go buy several books and learn everything past the basics I wanted to know on my own (I was lucky and worked w my step grandfather in his shop for the basics).
I have a lift in my garge these days and do let my friends use it and may even help if they bring some beer n pizza...
OMG!! it may take 4-6hrs to change a fuel pump, I'm not going to get to play vid games with my dorky online 2nd life friends.. I say GET A LIFE and learn to be a real man or woman with skills.
Its only going to get worse with this LAZY generation of people...

 

Couldn't have said it better myself. Of course, you do realize that some younger people think that EVERYTHING can be solved on the internet or worst yet, on their newest 4G device.

 

I used to be intimidated when I was 18 and got my first and only thirdgen so far Drove the car for a year with a leaking rear china wall before finally getting the ***** to start on replacing the intake gaskets. From there, I took off. Did LT1 intake manifold conversion but sold it before I ran it, and bought HSR. Did that swap and dove into ecm tuning. Started learning that and before long I had a 383 that I assembled from shortblock up. Then I did my own exhaust with my first welder I bought. Then added nitrous. Then assembled my 401 twin turbo motor from bare block up, fabbed the entire turbo system and I had NO knowledge of this stuff when first hit with the idea. 3 months of daily research and few books later, I was ready to start. 10 months later i had a 9 sec car.

Point is, do your research, learn things and then attempt them. Sometimes, its not all that difficult to do when you originally thought it would be a nightmare.

Not many use the search features on forums anymore....same questions get asked over and over again.

 

hey, what's the best sounding exhaust?

to parrot what was already written. I also don't mind helping out people but make it clear to them that when the next problem arises, it's not because of what I did. New brake pads didn't cause the rear seal to leak

 

OH! YEAH! I especially like the guys that come back with totally unrelated problems months or even years latter,

"the old you worked on the car three years ago replacing a head light , for me, now the dealer wants $3200 to replace my busted transmission and its all your fault logic!" :roll:

or the old, "I backed the car in the lake launching my boat, now the engine won,t start, its obviously because you did an oil change for me last year logic"


loosely related thread

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...ghting+correct

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/...g+parts#p11560

 

Being a modern thinker means avoiding personal responsibility AT ALL COSTS!

 

my camaro is the first car i bought and paid for. before i bought it, i wasnt very mechanically competent. i could do the basic stuff like oil changes, tune ups and the like. my camaro gave me the mechanics bug. it started with a cat back exhaust and now there isnt much i havent touched on it. i learned by doing and with the help of friends and people like you guys.

 

could also be interpreted as a shameless plug for your site...just saying

 

I don,t sell anything,
theres no advertisers, I don,t charge for joining or looking around or posting.
I don,t make any money on my site ,in fact it costs me money
my sites simply a rather large resource of auto engine related information anyone can access
I'm simply trying to pass on information that helps others,and help others avoid the long learning curve and wasted money I spent over 45 years doing this, so if you feel that way, well ok, but its hardly, like I get anything but some satisfaction in knowing I helping

 

Someday we will all be perfect like you!

 

i understand what your talking about.
long before i was old enough to even drive, i would help people with car repairs. by the time i was 14, i had done a good number of motors starting from pullout, tear down and inspection, reassemble and install, to startup and tune.
i was on a first name basis with the guys at the local parts houses and machine shops.
most of the time i got some money, sometimes i didn't, in those cases i got other things like tools, parts or something i wanted.
on unrelated problems, i never had a problem telling someone they were an idiot if they thought the brake job i did had anything to do with the U-joints going out.

when i got into auto repair as a profession, the calls for help continued.
after a few years i got tired of it and started telling everyone i would no longer work without be paid and without THEIR help. a few people had no problem with it, they were mainly the ones who paid and helped me to start with. the others whined non stop about it.
sometime in the 80s, other than a very few select friends, i decided that didn't have any desire to do side jobs.
i even had some customers from my job calling me at home on weekends to work on their cars.
when i got a call for help from someone not in that select group, my labor rate was $400.00 per hour with a 4 hour minimum plus parts paid in cash in advance, no checks, no receipt, no warranty.
some people told me i couldn't charge that much, that it was illegal, i told them its MY time and i can charge what ever I want.
the calls for help ended.
now that im out of auto repair for a living i occasionally get some calls, when i do, i tell them that they must first help me with things i need done, then i'll help them.

 

with labor rates like that, somone would have to be insane to pay up.

 

There's your answer! Typical Corvette owner thinks he's too good to get out and get under like the rest of us. Sheesh.

 

haha.

 

Sometimes, a more in-depth explanation than what the Haynes book has,, can clarify a procedure.
I agree it would be best to just come forward & ask " How much would you charge to do x,y and z? "
Or ask " What would it cost to have you help me do x,y and z? "

I personally would be on cloud 8 1/2 to have someone knowledgeable come by and spend a day helping with a few issues.
I pay in steak from the grill & all the fixins, & a big Thank You, along with the full intention on returning the favor!!..

There are things I've never seen before, but I've noticed TGO community is always there for inspiration & support.

IMHO--
If I can help, I'm there--
If I get help, I do all I can to return the favor // pay.

 

yep, that was the ideal.
i figured it would take care of the side work, or i would be well paid.

 

ive helped more than 1 person work on a car for nothing more than a "beverage" and some food. i took my stock 305 out of my car and dropped it into a friends cousins camaro for a large pizza.