well....spoke too soon, its back. Car acts like crap, AGAIN!!!!

I swear I am so burned out on this. I am so ready to torch it.

Well, ordering a new Distributor. This is the last part I will install. if still an issue, the dealer can tackle it. I am done with this. Whole summer will go by and I wont be able to drive it again. Man this sucks.

 

Update, new Distributor just came in. I will be installing it in the next day or so. Will confirm outcome. fingers crossed.

 

arrggh. Any suggestions on how to get the stupid bolt loose for the distributor? Who designs this stuff? I cant get a socket on it with the driver. Unbelievable. Also any suggestions on timing? thanks.

 

You can try a 9/16" universal socket, extension and ratchet. Or one of those bent up wrenches specifically made for those hold down bolts.

Six degrees BTDC is where I would start.

 

Yeah I bought one of those sets that is like a fixed adjustable wrench that attaches to a 3/8" ratchet. Trouble is I bought MM not SAE. I though it was 14mm because the socket fit but its 9/16". Oh well, back to Sears.

I am soaking it in wd-40 so it wont be so tight.

thanks.

 

I have some flex head ratchet wrenches I picked up from Harbor Freight. Well worth the money for when you have to loosen or tighten bolts in tight areas and you are only able to move 1/8 of a turn at a time. http://www.harborfreight.com/5-pc-sa...set-61657.html

 

Thanks Brett. I just got back from Sears with the same style wrenches. Going to let it soak overnight with pb blaster then try in the morning

 

This stupid bolt is so tight, even with this ratchet wrench she wont budge. I need to get a socket on it to get good leverage so I can move it. But the distributor plate is in the way. this is a really stupid design.

 

I use a wrench similar to this for the hold down:



I use the appropriate box end section with the square drive coupler, and a short extension attached to my ratchet. Access and leverage.

BTW, that hold down bolt doesn't need to be reefed on to hold the distributor from turning.

 

Yeah trying to locate them locally, not much luck. I went to harbor Freight just now and got SAE crow feet wrench set. Lets see...

 

Did you get the flare nut crow feet? The open end crow feet may round off the bolt.

 

yeah that's what I got. arrrgghh

 

looks like there is an autozone that has one in stock like you suggested, and yes, the crowfeet wants to round the bolt. Off to autozone.

 

Well got that setup from Autozone, and its twisting. CHEAP GARBAGE. This is beyond stupid now. I am thinking I will need to get a distributor GM wrench off eBay. Who is the idiot who designs this crap.

 

Just curious......are you running a small or large cap HEI distributor?

Since the engine runs, try letting the engine get up to operating temperature and THEN try to loosen the bolt.

 

Its small.

I just ordered a Craftsman 9/16'' distributor wrench from Summit

 

I got it! Turns out the crow feet did it. So I marked the base to the manifold and the rotor front and back to the top of the flat part of the distributor. I am starting to work it out. Its turning clock wise and seems to be moving up off the manifold, is this correct? Also it is VERY tight and I may need to use a pry tool, any suggestions? thanks.

 

You should not need to pry the distributor out. Just wiggle it/rotate it slightly and maybe jiggle the rotor (with the cap off) to disengage the dizzy gear from the cam gear.

 

I got it off thanks. I got the new one in and lined up. I put it back together and Started her. She started MUCH better. HOWEVER, code 32 and 42 set again. I trided to time it but the timing light I have is garbage and the markings have a coating of rust. I adjusted it back and forth to get her running steady. Now I reset the codes again. Start her up, no codes. But she is running rough, the whole car is rumbling. Hard to say if its missing a cylinder or not. But all is tight, Not running as smooth as it was before. I hold no hope the code 42 is gone. It has done this many times, tease me then comes back.

The original distributor was bad, it hangs up a bit in 2 locations. Not nice like the new one. So that was a good call, thank you Paulo57509.

Now I need to work out this rough idle, thoughts please?

thanks gang.

 

Your timing is clearly off. I always dab some light colored paint on the timing marks on both the pully and the tab on the timing cover. They show up nice and bright when the timing light is flashing on them. I even used White-Out once. Assuming you are running a TBI or TPI car you'll need to follow the correct procedure to set the timing without the ECM trying to adjust the timing. Do a search on that topic here on TGO. You'll probably find a bunch of how-to's on the topic.

 

well, I crossed a wire on the cap. Got the rumble solved. BUT code 42 IS BACK AGAIN. Guys I am so fed up I just want to take a sledge hammer to the car. I don't know what else to do.

Off to the dealer. I have said it too many times. I AM DONE.

 

Its fine, I had crossed to wires on the cap. But the code is back. tons of money spent and still wont go away. I am so fed up. I really thought the new distributor would fix it. I just don't know what else to do at this point. D@MN CAR.

 

So if anyone has anymore thoughts I would appreciate it. Otherwise I guess I have to take it to GM dealer, and have it towed being I cant drive the stupid thing. Thanks for all the help guys, I am just in a really p!ssed off mood right now at this car.

 

Ok I did some more checking. Going back to basics. This SEEMS to have all started shortly after I replaced the starter last summer. I found a post about code 42(by the way 14 is back AGAIN).

Anyway, it is in regard to the KNOCK SENSOR near the starter. Could this be an issue and cause my problems. The quote I found is below:

"Stop where you are! Code 42 is a EST module or knock sensor error. I would bet that you are almost always accelerating when it codes. The knock sensor and EST module allows the engine to run with the ignition timing as advanced as possible with out damaging anything. It's what allows us to get 15-17 mpg on these burb's. The knock sensor hears the knock and relays the info to the EST Module. The EST module signals the distributor ignition module when to fire.
The ECM self tests the spark advance controls. What it does is when you reach operating temperature, the ECM advances the ignition timing in an attempt to create a knock. If it hears a knock, it retards the timing to make the knock go away and the test is over. If it advances the timing and can not create or "hear" a knock, it thinks it has no control of the ignition timing and lets it go back to the base timing (which should be zero deg).
On some models, if you hold WOT for 5 seconds (engine running), the ECM will pick up the timing again. Don't run WOT with out a load or you'll blow your engine.
Your knock sensor is on the engine block just forward and above your starter motor. It should have 1 wire connected, I can't remember if it's blue or purple. This wire runs to your EST module (square w/4 wire connector) by your Throttle Body.
Check this wire all the way for loose, burned or rubbed through. If you're sure you've got a good connection through the wire. With engine running connect a digital volt meter to the wire by the EST Module. Tap lightly, with a small hammer or wrench, on the exhaust manifold (same side as sensor) and see if your tapping is reflected in your voltage. If not, I would replace the knock sensor. Remember that when you pull the old sensor, antifreeze is going to run out so be prepared and make sure your engine is cool. If you do see a reading change when you tap, recheck your connections from the EST Module to the distributor. If all are good, blown EST Module would be your problem. I think that both of these items will run between $30.00-$50.00 each. Don't buy anything but Delco brand when replacing these parts!!!!!!
Aftermarket sensors from such as AutoZone don't work as well (or at all ) and won't last long. Spend the extra $$ now or you'll be working on it again soon.
If your base timing is set correctly, ( @ 0 deg) you shouldn't be stalling when you idle. While you're working on the truck, to keep it from stalling, you may want to set your base timing to 2 or 4 until you get the problem fixed. Remember that you have to disconnect the black and tan EST wire (by wiper motor on firewall) when you are setting your timing. Be sure that when you get your problem fixed that you set your base timing back to zero. These old bowties don't have a crank or cam position sensor. If you start with the wrong base your timing curve will be off.
Let us know what you find!"

I am going to lift the car tomorrow and check around the starter to see if this is my problem. Sorry gang, I just want this to go away.

 

Ignore all of that you posted in bold, about 99% of it is incorrect.

With the various codes popping up there are two areas I'd concentrate on. One is the grounds. This is the battery cables and connections. And the EFI harness grounds on the back of the cylinder head(s).

Make sure that they are clean and the bolts are tight. That there isn't any frayed wires where they terminate to the ring lug.

The other area is that the ECM may be bad. Drop it down and with the engine running rap on the case. Can even grab the case and flex it a bit. See if that makes the engine change how it runs.

If you have access to a known good ECM just swap it in and see if that fixes the issues.

RBob.

 

RBob

Thanks for the info. I asked about the starter area because last year I replaced the original with a powermaster performance starter. Shortly there after code 42 showed up. Maybe it was coincidence, don't know. I will tell you I did in fact rapped on the ECM several times, nothing. I also re seated the CPU or prom.

I will check the grounds as you stated. I will say for a LONG time I have a negative cut off switch I installed on the battery to the negative cable. That was done several years ago and has never been an issue.

I am just at a loss on this and the ECM I believe now maybe the culprit. I don't have a spare or one I can swap in. I will have to invest in one. Question is where would be the best place to buy one? RockAuto? Local AutoZone?

 

The knock sensor is down by the starter, but an issue there will cause a code 43, not 42.

As for purchasing an ECM, check the classifieds here. May be able to find one there. The '7165 was also used in some TBI 4-cylinder trucks. Getting a good store bought ECM is a 50/50 chance.

RBob.

 

Ok, but sorry, 7165? model number?

 

NM, I see what you mean. the classifieds here don't have anything. I am on eBay now. Looking at a DELCO reman. I am thinking would not be bad to have a spare either way at this point.

 

RBob, where about are the ground connections located regarding the back of the cylinder heads please? How many do I need to look at? The ground from the block to the firewall is sound. Just wondering what else. Thanks.

 

ok, here we go. I start the car after codes cleared. Now getting 32 and 42 car running rough. I change back to the AC DELCO coil I bought, clear codes. Start again, running rough same codes. After testing codes, start her up again, NO CODES car is on point. I rap on the ECM, idle changes, codes are back. BAD ECM.

I am ordering a reman Delco off eBay with a 12 month 12k warranty. Lets see if this fixes the issue. I am not holding my breath but what else is there to do?

I checked the battery ground and ground from engine to firewall, all are clean, tight, and no issues.

 

So I ordered one off a dealer on eBay with a solid bunch of reviews and he is only 1 state away. I cant understand that I have rapped on that ECM several times, I guess I was doing it when there was a code. This time I did it without a code and got it to change the idle and kick on the engine light. Man what a pain, I hope that is a light at the end of this stupid tunnel.

Thanks to EVERYONE who helped, I sincerely appreciate all of it. With all these new parts and no codes she starts RIGHT UP and sounds amazing. I am DYING to drive her with T-Tops off and good rock blasting! Ahh the memories....

 

Ok, new ECM installed with existing chip. Car starts right up, no issues so far. Runs great as well. Next few hours/days will confirm. Putting it back to together to get the inspection done. I have her all set with insurance and registration. Fingers CROSSED!

 

Fingers crossed.

 

Thanks man. I washed her and will take her out for a fill up later. Man it really wants to go.

Despite the frustrations, man I love this car.

 

Ok, so I took her our for gas, ran amazing. Of course there are some odd quirks, review mirror button not working on either one and the power antenna wont come up. She ran perfectly, even got some looks. When pulled in, just as I started to park she stalled. Started right back up again though, I am thinking its a dying gremlin. Anyway she goes for inspection first thing tomorrow. Then I will take her out locally to clean it out and get her tuned in.

It will take time for the confidence to come back but I hope this episode is over. Thanks again to EVERYONE who helped out. I cannot stress how much I appreciate it and this forum. LONG LIVE 3RD GEN CARS AND THIS SITE!!

 

Well she got inspected today, all good. Runs great! I am so excited and relieved. I think I can close the book on this issue now. Again A HUGE THANKS to all that helped out. Really appreciate it!! Bring on SUMMER!!!

 

I am very happy for your success! It is so upstanding for you, and this forum to work together to solve a problem.

ALSO, the the OP ADVISED THE FINAL OUTCOME!

IMO, on so many cars forums (I own 12 vehicles & read lots of forums) the OP never advises the final outcome! So much possible information lost.

Even if it's "I sold/burned/junked or better yet FIXED the car, share it as this OP did!

 

Amen to that Mikeceli! Drove her today as well. Had a state trooper behind me for a bit, I was doing the speed limit etc. I know he ran my plates. Funny he turned on a side street just as I hit the blinker for my driveway. Guess old cars are taboo? I DONT CARE!! HA!

This is a fantastic site/forum that is well maintained and supported by a great bunch of people. I am very proud to be a part of it and grateful for all the help that got this problem resolved ultimately.

And totally agree, GOD BLESS AMERICA!

 

Glad to hear you worked it out. Bad ECM's can be the hardest to diagnose. I have a collection of backup units for various cars I've owned over the years that were pulled from bone yards. They come in handy when all else fails with sensor replacements. Don't hesitate to grab them up when you see them at your local Pull-A-Part yard. The one near near me charges a flat $30 for any ECM no matter what car it's from. (probably because they can't guarantee they work and won't let you return them if they don't)

 

Live and learn as they say and good advice, thanks!

 

one more follow up if I may. Drove her around with the T-tops off, it has been YEARS since I have done that. Had some Ozzy, Dio and Metallica for tunes. Man the looks she got, one dude near broke his neck with a turn around in his truck.

I have forgotten all the fun it was to drive with the tops off. Cant wait to get her cleaned up and re-painted. Not this year, not in the budget. But I hope to have her looking this good again some day soon: