anyone got any information on what full bolt on 2002 ws6 TA is putting out and what it would run in the 1/4?

thanks.

 

just so this doesn't get locked, the reason for the post is i have a chance to run one and am wondering how the ol' girl will do against it.

 

I would think mid 12s at the slowest and could easily be as fast as a low 11 depending on tires and the tune.Go to ls1tech.com and check out what some of them are doing.http://ls1tech.com/forums/index.php?

 

Mid 12s easy! He could be putting as much as 350 hp to the ground depending on what mods and a good tune. He could be close to 400 hp at the crank. LS1s are very strong and respond well to the right mods!

 

A full bolt on LS1 should put down 350 to the wheels. A4 cars are a bit lower due to greater driveline losses. 350 at the wheels is well near 420hp at the crank. Each car responds differently at the track with that amount of power. Heavily optioned TA's can wiegh 3800lbs while base Z's can be 3300lbs or less. Driver skill aside you should see a range of ET's anwhere from high 11's to high 12's.

 

I've seen a stock Z28 dyno right at 300 and a SS dyno at 321 at the wheels. On average at the track I've seen them run 12.8's to low 13's. The only ones I've ever seen run 11's had 150 shot. Thats just what I seen at local tracks. I'm sure they can run mid 12's but thats only with someone that knows what their doing. The average guy in a WS6 will run a low 13.

 

Tring to figure out drive line loss is always a good recipe for a fight. I like like to figure it at 40-50 hp and call it a day.

P.S by the way, Mine makes 331 RWHP. With just a mild cam.

 

my friends 2000 Z28 goes like 12.3 at 108mph... his is a 3500 stall auto Ls1 with longtubes/exhaust/lid... LS6 manifold and maf sensor... the 2001-2002 ls1's all had the LS6 manifolds and maf sensor

 

sounds like i have a race on my hands.

the question will probably be........how long before he catches up to me off the line. better make it a short race.

tanks fer da input and will let you know how it turns out if we git er done.

it all started when i ran a 03 cobra last nite through 2nd gear. dang if i wasn't barely pullin that thing. when the car went to second i left it. turns out the guys wife was driving and she can't shift so that's why it disappred to the rear during the shift. (i was shocked i was pulling the car til then!!)

anyway, he has a full bolt on ws6 TA and wants to run. guess the fact he wants to bring the TA and not the cobra should tell me something.:burnout

 

You can see in my sig what I run with a 2000 ls1 with hardly any mods.

 

On this site it is but there is plenty of dyno data (crank and chassis) to accuratly quantify it for LS1 motors running through the T56 or 4L60E and 10 bolt rear. We also all know that automatic transmissions are not as efficient as manuals.

In the end though there are dozens of variables that can affect driveline power.

 

hmmmm..........nitrous? no many mods...lol just one BIG one?

 

I'm trapping a hair over 109 with my mods(which really aren't that huge).

If you're talking full bolt ons(including converter if it's an auto) then you BETTER bring something quick. Not sure the full specs on your motor(cam, intake etc) but if it's truely a full bolt on car you're probably screwed lol

 

IF i loose i think it will be close. think i'll take the jump off the line and let him play catch up. question is how long before he catches me.

the TA is a 6 speed and he's no dullard.

you know i have a crate vortec from scorggin. also custom chip(to rich at idle), 24 bosch inj, ported and matched plenum, 52mm tb, gutted cat., eibach springs, lower control arms, panhard bar, shorties, 2.5 in hooker exhaust, 255 tires, pulleys, beefed up with kevalr 700r4, 2400 stall, high flow fuel pump, hmmmm, think thats about it.

the 2.77s are gonna hurt but i have a real problem with traction now.

kinda got me thinkin postitive when i was pullin the cobra.

 

I'm gonna say this as non-biased as possible.

You'll take him off the line but then after that I think you're toast.

It'd be cool if you beat him though

 

Well, yeah it is but not counting Nitrous then

 

thanks again guys, either way it's gonna be FUN.

 

update,

counldn't line up side by side (he had to go home) so followed him from behind. we trun and i line up behind him. we are doing about 10-15 and he nails it.

he is pulling me just ever so slightly (remember he hit the gas first) up to about 75-80mph. it was VERY close til then. (we were in a 45 zone so that was fast enough for me and i slowed down)

will try to line him up from a stop next time. it's gonna be close, very close.

i have to say, i am very proud of the ol' girl. she is defending her honor quite well.

 

Tell us all the mods on your car cam size, intake, gears, stall etc.

 

most is listed above.

then engine is the scorggin vortec crate.

lt4 hot cam, 9.6 comp, 1.6 rockers, vortec heads. besides what's above, that's about it.

still have the long tube runners just ported the u-no-wat out of the plenum and gasket matched everthing.

 

I would figure you'd probably lose w/ stockish TPI stuff up top, but I would have figured the 03 Cobra would school you as well.

How sure are you it was a 03 Cobra you ran and not a 99 or 01 or whatever? An 03 should have been very close/faster than your average bolt on LS1, something seems iffy if he was so quick to want to rip out a bolt on LS1, I'm wondering if it wasn't really a 03...

Maybe he has a decent cam upgrade or something too...

 

Yeah a stock '03 cobra will put down about 380 at the wheels. An honest 30 more than most full bolt on ls1s.

 

i am using the info he provided.

i have been looking for a cobra for a while and was somewhat suprised too. it's spooky hearing the blower whine in your window.

i asked about the ws6 TA.....
"so what you got in that thing?"

reply....."all the bolt ons."

i will try to get more detail if/when i can run him again. i am looking forward to the dead stop run. nothing like torque from a stop.

no disappointment on my part and nice to know i have other things to improve the ol' girl.

in past i have had NO problem with any mustang gt, honda 2000, etc. i got pulled ever so slightly by an 02 ss with mods. had him off the line but he slowly pulled back. of course that was with the wrong fuel pump im my car, the old pulleys, and before the cat was gutted and the plenum ported.

also ran a 69 camaro with a zz4 crate and won that one.

had a run with an audi s4, after he said go and nailed it, i ran it down and past him and that is a 13.6 quarter mile car. he was behind my door by the time i hit second gear. ran twice with the same result. by 70ish he was 2 cars back.

did a stock lightining once.

had several car legenths on a turbo something. he claimed to have 14.0 quarter times. sorry i can't tell you what, it was dark and he had ZERO markings on the car. only the fat tires made me take notice in the first place. of course when we ran i could hear the turbo BOV.

 

one more thing.

keep in mind his WIFE was driving the cobra and it was only a true "race" through 1st gear. when she went to hit second it was bye bye time. so honestly, i don't know what would have happened if she could shift or he had brought the cobra back to run.

if possible i would like to run it again as well. what's the worst i could to? loose?

 

Cool

Keep in mind though that where you guys shut down is where the LS1 will really begin to pull.

 

yup, havin that richard simmons engine sux. all low end grunt. once your off your knees nothing left to do.

 

LOL!

 

Actually the engine in his sig is an LT1, not an L98. LT1s pull like raped apes up top if you give them a better cam. Nothing wrong with their intakes.

Yeah LS1s pull pretty good up top, however imo they just feel 'spongy' down low. Feel odd for a V8. Their tq curve is odd too if you ever look at a dyno sheet. That's why LT1s usually out-run them to the eighth mile. I've even seen an L98 do it. This is stock vs stock of course.

After that the LS1s usually pass them like they're standing still

 

Whoops, didn't see you had posted an update, sounds like you did fairly decent, will be interesting to see a full on even start race to higher speeds.

I wouldn't think he has a cam upgrade if you hung very close to him though, which I was wondering about when he was so quick to want to run you in his LS1...

 

i just imagined a damn ape... haulin *** after having been jacked by gorilla... damn that funny...

 

Always found that saying quite funny.

Too bad they're not a little faster pre-rape, maybe they could avoid it to start with, lol.

 

Yeah, my cammed LT1 setup in my bird has a ton of low end and pulls like crazy up top too. Strong power band from 1800-5800 or so, which I believe is exactly what the ratings on my cam are for.

It is definitely different driving the '98 LS1 car. Still feels powerful down low, but doesn't spin tires easily in the low end. I can let the clutch out easy, nail it, not spin a fraction off the line, and then the tires break loose at 4000ish RPMs (35-40mph), spin the rest of the way through first and then kick the rear out a bit hitting 2nd at 50mph. I'm sure the SLP lid and LS6 intake will only make this happen even easier. Its quite a different beast.

Its fun to go 1st-4th (skip shift ) and hold the same throttle position in 4th from 20mph on up and the car feels like a turd down low and then as the RPMs/MPH climb, the car feels faster and faster. On an TPI car, the car gets slower and slower feeling if you hold the throttle at a certain point for a while. My LT1 is somewhat in the middle.

 

If by odd you mean dead flat . The reason why so many people say LS1 car's have no low end is only because it is masked by its superior peak power. My buddy just had his stock '02 SS dynoed and it made peak torque from the start of the pull to the end of the pull (325hp and 338ft lbs at the wheels). You could have just drew a straight line across the page. Compaired to every other L98 and LT1 dyno sheet I saw that day it was no contest. The other two were envious to say the least. There were four other LS1 cars there that day that all had the same curves. They started the pull at 2k so you can't see whats before that though. However, when I used to have my M6 '95 we would race and I would never come close. From a dig, roll or any other speed he would own me by multiple car lengths.

 

I've seen several that started lower, around 290 or so and peaked at about 4 grand around 320ish. I've never seen one flat like an LT1 TQ curve.

Nonetheless, just driving the cars you can feel the difference in the low end. LS1s have a great top end, but I consistantly outrun them 1/8 mile at the track. I have plenty of people to back it up too. But like I said before, I usually get passed after that if the driver is any good.

I like old school motors better, you just tap them and the tires spin and the nose lifts up. LS1s don't imo. Unless they have a cam, then they're pretty mean.

 

I beg to differ. I can spin the tires with ease in my car. From a stoplight I can obliterate them if I punch it hard. A butt dyno can be very misleading

 

I agree. My LS1 is bone stock, and I can still punish them, if need be.

 

Yeah, I can light em up from a dead stop too without a problem. I usually don't because I'm focusing too much on trying to learn to drive stick smoothly If I already have it in gear and punch it at 1500rpm in first, until today, I really didn't spin. Today I decided to go and work my intake a bit and clean intake ducting and TB, etc. and found a ton of junk that got around the air filter somehow and clogged quite a bit of the MAF sensor Fixed that and smoothed out my stock air lid and it definitely has more low-end to it now (I attribute this to the blocked MAF, not the modded air lid because I still have the bellows and its still the stock "small" lid).

Can't wait to drive it tomorrow to beat on it a bit more. Didn't get a chance tonight because the roads got all wet. Want to see if I can feel the difference after cutting the stock EGR tube flush with the intake and cutting the bottom of the airbox out to get air from in front of the radiator.

 

I have an 02 ws-6 m6 with only a slp lid, k&n, and smooth bellows and i ran a 13.32 at 107.7mph with a 2.23 60'. I've never got it dynoed cuz my 3/4 syncros are shot but i get it dynoed soon. My friend has a built vortec 350 in his 91 and he runs constant 14.1-2 around 98-99mph. Not sure his mods but i believe he has a 213 cam, edelbrock headers, ported heads, bored .030 over, forged pistons, posi 3.23 gears, auto with transgo shiftkit and TC. He running stock tbi with edelbrock manifold with bigger injectors

 

exactly.
the TPI for example has a huge peak of TQ.. so you can feel it hitting.

the LS1 is spooky.. it pulls so smoothly that you dont notice how hard it really is pulling.

take this for example.. totally stock 02 LS1...



notice how flat it is.. no rising to a peak, and no sudden drop off...
it pulls, and keeps pulling...

 

Quoted for truth.

It's very deceiving. I still like the down low power of a L98 though

 

Everytime I drive my roommates '99 Z28 I always have to remind myself that it is actually fast. Those cars only feel fast as a passenger, I swear.

 

thanks for the info. i see what you mean with that dyno sheet. amazing.

i drove a typhon once and it was bizzare. just nail the gas from a stop and the tires bark and your doing 60. almost took the fun out of it. almost.

still havn't run into the guy yet. did get a one block race with an ls1 ss. we were on a hill and he pulls up and starts reving the engine. had to defend the ol girl's honor so pulled it down in 1st.

i knew what was going to happen next.

light turns green we start to move and from experience racing up a hill i roll into the throttle and he nails it.

yup you guessed it too. he lights em up and i pull away. even when he hooks i am still pulling. then we get to the next light and line up again and..................

i look at the light and wait. it turns green and off i go.......one problem.......i was looking at the wrong light.

yup you guessed it too.........i ran the red light......how embarassing. shame they don't have a red smiley face.

anyway, will let you know when we git r done.

 

lol well this is my first time back in a while...and i AM selling my car for a 2000 z28...already ordered Long Tubes, y pipe and cat back for it...
future plans:
ls6 intake, ported throttle body, underdrive pulleys, 3000 TC, and some suspension mods...maybe during the upcoming summer a cam.....
but my 83s been fun and a great 1st car/daily driver!

 

heres the exact one....

 

Sidewayz28 YOU SELL OUT!!!!!!!

THIRDGENS FOREVER!!!!

I really hope you enjoy your new ride I'm trying to find one for my friend. Whats a good price for a 98 an up trans am or camaro?

 

Welcome to the 4th gen crowd I just picked up my '98 Z28 M6 a few weeks ago and am torn between keeping my birdie or selling it If it was already done, I'd have no problem selling it, but its not done, and I just want to see it get finished All it needs is a dyno tune and good transmission and its low 12s

4th gens are soooo much nicer to have as daily drivers.

 

its all about mileage....im getting mine for a damn good deal just selling my car and my bro is handing it down to me....it was originally my uncles down in the bay area he got it with like 40kmiles for 14k i think...i think you could find a ls1 with low miles for like 10-15k

 

Mine had 106k miles on it and I paid $6400 with an extra set of crappy rims/winter tires. A bit high mileage, but the car runs well.

 

makes sense...so half the mileage and twice the price

 

Here is another dyno sheet of a stock LS1. This is my buds '02 M6 SS that we dyno'd a few months back. The picture sucks but you can see the power curves. Torque is at a solid 300 right when the run starts at 2k and peaks at 338 all the way to redline. So at the crank that is roughly 350lb ft off idle to 400lb ft at peak. That is more impressive to me than any L98 curve .