A guy i work with has an 89' Firebird Formula, i asked him if he would trade me car's just kidding around but he said he would think about it he like's my Iroc because it has ground effects and his formula dont, but its a nice looking formula its red with the decal's still in pretty good shape, good body, and excellent intirior, but it is a 305 tpi, but it has a five speed! and my Iroc is a 350 tpi with the 700r4, thinking of trading not sure yet, tell me what you think

 

do it! formulas are the ****!

 

my main reason for not buying a 350 was the automaticness. I love standards every inch of the road

 

I think that would be crazy. Keep your car IMO.

 

IMO you're better off with the 350 unless his car is in alot better shape and you like the look of the formula firebird.

 

keep the 350. Throw a 5 or 6 speed manual behind it if that's the problem. But don't trade a 350 IROC for a 305 formula. If it was a 350 formula and it was in good shape I'd say do it cause those are the quickest of the 350 thirdgens and look pretty cool too and much rarer to come by than an IROC.

 

Get the Formula. Weighs less and has the 5-speed. Most everyone really wants the 305 TPI 5-speed cars now.

 

Dont trade. The engines alone are reason enough. Besides how fun is a stick gonna be when your old IROC is flying past you. Also you will have to change your name on the boards.

 

Wrongo about the Formula. It is not the fastest 350, but they were close. They actually weigh more than Camaros, 130lbs. more base for base, also keep in mind the better Chevrolet intake over the Pontiac. IROC-Z's and the later Z28's were the fastest, I've done plenty of asking around to confirm this too.

 

I wouldn't even consider it, trading a 355 for a 305 just cause of a stick. Keep the power and do a tranny swap, not too mention I like the looks of Camaros better.

 

KEEP THE IROC

 

"Wrongo about the Formula. It is not the fastest 350, but they were close. They actually weigh more than Camaros, 130lbs. more base for base, also keep in mind the better Chevrolet intake over the Pontiac. IROC-Z's and the later Z28's were the fastest, I've done plenty of asking around to confirm this too."

This is complete nonsense. The camaro intake doesnt breathe any significant amount better than a firebird.

Second, the 5.7 Camaros weigh more than the Formulas. Don't try and defend that point, you are wrong. You say base vs base, but thats not what the comparison is. A 5.7L Formula vs a 5.7L Iroc, the Iroc weighs more.

The motors are exactly the same. EXACTLY. A speed density 91-92 Formula vs a speed density 91-92 Z28, they will yeild equal results. Neither are faster. The 30 lbs the ground effects weigh will not make a substancial difference in quarter mile times.

If anything, the lighter formula will equate out the so called better intake (but take a look at that thing, its restrictive where it comes over the radiator)

I guess what I am trying to say is that the body of these cars should be overlooked because they share the exact same drivetrain.

 

The Camaro intake is better than the Firebird intake, especially the earlier 1's, this is very known. The bumper is better designed also to take the air right through the front of the grill up to the intake arms and not near the engine.

The IROC's do not weigh more than Formulas, don't go by looks. Camaros are usually lighter cars, GFX don't weight much. For example, here is the base unoptioned weight on 87 cars:

IROC-Z 350 Auto: 3,341 lbs.
Formula 5.0 5-Speed: 3,383 lbs.
IROC-Z 5.0 5-Speed: 3,250 lbs.
GTA 350 Auto: 3,476 lbs.

As I hope you can see, the Formula 5.0 is still heavier than the 350 IROC, not much, but still.

 

No.

Model Weight Base Price Production
Firebird V6 3,102 $10,999 28,973
Firebird V8 3,300* $11,399
Formula 3,296 $11,999 13,475
Trans Am 3,355 $13,999 8,793
GTA 3,406 $19,922 11,214


The Camaro is not the "lighter car" until compared with a TA. (This is for a 88 Formula, taken from www.3rdgenformula.com)

 

The camaro TPI intake is not any better than the firebird TPI intake ducting. Ever seen a cold air kit? Pulls from the same area as the firebird stock unit. It also doesnt narrow down to go over the radiator such as the camaro intake does. Neither is a better setup than the other. The only ducting the camaro does a lot better with is cooling, as teh radiator is much more open.

 

This is the 87 firebirds.

Model Weight Base Price Production
Firebird V6 3,186 $10,359 42,552
Firebird V8 3,274 $10,759
Formula 3,274 $11,829 13,160
Trans Am 3,350 $13,259 21,779
GTA 3,435 $14,104 11,096

 

I hope this shows that weight is not an issue with these cars, and the intake is not a substantial factor in the ET's of these cars.

A 92 350 TPI Z vs a 92 350 TPI Formula will both run numbers nearly exact to eachother. You cannot argue that a Camaro is faster than a Firebird, or vice versa.

**To get back on topic with the thread however, I feel you would be better off keeping the 355 and swapping a tranny in place of the A4. I'll be putting in a T56 this summer, I will post details in a few months.

 

The numbers I posted are right from GM with these drivetrain combinations when these cars were sent out to be tested and weighed again when they got there, and they were correct. They are not just book numbers. I don't know how any1 could say that intake is better. I have seen what others cars have run, and I have found an IROC or Z28 to be slightly quicker in pretty much every case.

 

I think you have witnessed the skills of good drivers then

The driver can make the world of difference, in any car. I have seen SS LS1 camaros run 14's all night long (at sea level!) While at the same time I have seen bone stock LT1 cars hitting 13.7's. Its all about the launch and rippin through the gears, and whos better at it.

 

Maybe so, you know cars. Everything depends.

 

The air entering the intake will be better on a Camaro than Firebird as IROCTWENTY has said, as far as the TPI itself, I would assume those are the same.

 

Well if the radiator is much more open, that means more and cooler air passes thru it into the intake. Which will give a Camaro the edge without driver error.

 

Not necessarily. The air still has to pass through the restrictive ducting setup. Dont get me wrong, its a good setup, but in my opinion does not flow any more air better than a bird setup. As far as the cool air, the firebird ducting pulls from the fenderwell area, the same as a cold air kit would (without actually cutting metal though)

One may be better than the other, probably in favor of the camaro. But I wouldnt give it a .1 or even a .05 difference.

 

Well, the guy told me he payed 2700 dollars for the Formula and it has a 350 in it but i knew it couldent because it is a 5 speed, but he say's the guy he bought it off of put a 350 in it, he says he dont think it wuz a brand new motor but a used one that he had rebuilt, im going to get the vin number off of it and i will post it up on this post- thanks for your apinions - Don

 

Only $2,700 and it was claimed to have a 350 but doesn't and whatever.....you should really keep your car.

 

OH HELL JUST BROKE LOSE!!!!, i just drove the guys formula! oh hell yeah, im seriously thinking of trading him! damn that thing is quick as hell! i think it is faster than my Iroc, 350 or not, maybe its the gears, it feels like its got 3.42's in it, but damn i drove my friends 94' Z28 w/ 6 speed and they are close im sure i could stay with him if not beat him with better driving, i still dont know for sure because this is the only tpi w/ a 5-speed that ive driven, i have driven my friends 87 T/A with a 305 auto, and tpi, but he wuz with me and he agree's its hella faster than his car, im seriously thinking about trading

 

Dude you have a 350. You're gonna take a step down in performance for a manual?? It feels different because you are shifting it and because of the gears. If you trade, he's getting the better deal.



G-Tech them or take them to the track and see which comes out faster.

 

How can it be faster, what mods have been done to it? I would definately take IROCTWENTY's advice.

 

Why dont you and that guy just race couple of times??

 

I think you should race too why not this weekend ? I saw the formula too, and if it's a 350 you should trade him, that car is pretty sweet.

 

What, is your IROC-Z beat/have alot of miles or something??

 

look at the spec's on this site, if it is a 80 formula with 3.42 gears, then it has the same h/p as my IROC, but the torque is a little lower but damn! i have driven my friends 6 speed 94 LT1 and they feel like one in the same they it almost feels like driving the same car! the guy says that it is a 350 and he is going to bring me the receits and every thing but im not sure if that matters to me now cuz that car is faster than my IROC, im pretty sure 350 or not, plus if you had read my earlier posts you would know that i have a remanufactured engine in my IROC in which case it has crappy cam and heads on it, it doesent seem to run as good as it did when i first got it.........seriously considering trading now


PS. i looked at the motor in the Formula it looks all stock and there isent a trace of oil anywhere ouside the motor and its clean as hell, and i cant race him because i need a battery on my car and need to set the timing and my licence is suspended at the time to boot...

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Don_89Iroc
look at the spec's on this site, if it is a 80 formula with 3.42 gears, then it has the same h/p as my IROC, but the torque is a little lower but damn! i have driven my friends 6 speed 94 LT1 and they feel like one in the same they it almost feels like driving the same car! the guy says that it is a 350 and he is going to bring me the receits and every thing but im not sure if that matters to me now cuz that car is faster than my IROC, im pretty sure 350 or not, plus if you had read my earlier posts you would know that i have a remanufactured engine in my IROC in which case it has crappy cam and heads on it, it doesent seem to run as good as it did when i first got it.........seriously considering trading now

Ah, didn't know that about your engine. Why would he want to trade his car for yours?? If its a 305 its probably not faster than your car.


PS. i looked at the motor in the Formula it looks all stock and there isent a trace of oil anywhere ouside the motor and its clean as hell, and i cant race him because i need a battery on my car and need to set the timing and my licence is suspended at the time to boot...

If its a 350 it was swapped. Still trying to figure exactly why this dude would want to make this trade. Its probably a 305 and he wants to mod a 350. Your 350.

 

Yeah youre going to have to look for the casting numbers on the block. At least its a TPI car, which 305 5spd TPI's were pretty damn fast, almost as fast as a L98 if they came with the right gears.

If your motor is that shot, trading him might not be a bad idea. However, he most likely has a freshened 305, which will give you the performance of a L98, but not the same potential as the larger displacement motor.

You would be better off in the long run by getting a new heads/cam for your 350 than getting the formula. The only other factor I can see is the WS6 suspension, but I have never driven a Iroc so I don't know if there is much difference (I know WS6 is level III, and I think some Irocs got level III, but not all of them)

*It will be easier to swap a A4 to a M6 than a 305 to a 350. Plus if you swapped the 305 for a 350, the T5 would be subject to breaking anyways.

Keep the Iroc

 

I don't think freshening up a 305 is gonna give the performance of an L98. All IROC-Z's got the top Camaro suspension which cornered slightly better than Formula's (also able to hit .90-.92 G's stock easy) but their ride is not as smooth as WS6 suspension.

 

"It will be easier to swap a A4 to a M6 than a 305 to a 350. Plus if you swapped the 305 for a 350, the T5 would be subject to breaking anyways."

Yup.

 

belive me this guy knows nothing about thirdgen's he wants my car because it has a "kit" on it as he calls the grounds effects, well he says it has a 350 in it and he says he thinks it was a used motor in wich case hopfully another L98 car if it is a 350, but he says he has reciets for everything that has been done and he is suppose to show me them, but if i dont trade for this car im selling my IROC and getting another 89 IROC thats all original and starting fresh with it....................but damn that car felt fast! i was going 80 in no time man! good thing there were no cops cause i was in a 40mph zone